Denon X3700, Pioneer LX505 or waiting?

[buz]

Going to move to a new apartment soon. Listening area is rouglhy 4x4m, one side open to larger living room, other sides floor to ceiling windows and concrete walls.

System will be dual use, movies and music in 5.1/2 but neither very loud.

I have
4 Kef R3
1 Kef R2c
2 SVS SB1000 (depending on how it goes, one might move to the office setup).
An old Denon X1000

So really I am looking for a new AVR, without the AKM debacle I would have simply gotten the X3700 but considering nobody knows how the redesigned one performs, I am also looking at the Pioneer LX505 (which, unlike the Onkyo, is availavle). Ideally would prefer to use internal amps so not sure if the protection on the Onkyo/Pioneer is an issue? Or should I make do with the X1000 and hope for better offerings in second half of the year?

 

[Golfx]

Going to move to a new apartment soon. Listening area is rouglhy 4x4m, one side open to larger living room, other sides floor to ceiling windows and concrete walls.

System will be dual use, movies and music in 5.1/2 but neither very loud.

I have
4 Kef R3
1 Kef R2c
2 SVS SB1000 (depending on how it goes, one might move to the office setup).
An old Denon X1000

So really I am looking for a new AVR, without the AKM debacle I would have simply gotten the X3700 but considering nobody knows how the redesigned one performs, I am also looking at the Pioneer LX505 (which, unlike the Onkyo, is availavle). Ideally would prefer to use internal amps so not sure if the protection on the Onkyo/Pioneer is an issue? Or should I make do with the X1000 and hope for better offerings in second half of the year?

You see this?

Anthem MRX 740 & 1140 AV Receivers Comparison Bench Test Results!

In this bench test report of the Anthem MRX 740 & 1140 AV receivers, preamp & amplifier performance is evaluated and compared. We cover Bass management and amplifier matrixing performance recommendations.

www.audioholics.com

 

[buz]

I didn't see that but I am not sure I am willing to pay that price

 

[tifune]

Going to move to a new apartment soon. Listening area is rouglhy 4x4m, one side open to larger living room, other sides floor to ceiling windows and concrete walls.

System will be dual use, movies and music in 5.1/2 but neither very loud.

I have
4 Kef R3
1 Kef R2c
2 SVS SB1000 (depending on how it goes, one might move to the office setup).
An old Denon X1000

So really I am looking for a new AVR, without the AKM debacle I would have simply gotten the X3700 but considering nobody knows how the redesigned one performs, I am also looking at the Pioneer LX505 (which, unlike the Onkyo, is availavle). Ideally would prefer to use internal amps so not sure if the protection on the Onkyo/Pioneer is an issue? Or should I make do with the X1000 and hope for better offerings in second half of the year?

What defines "better" to you, in this context? What is your X1000 lacking ?

 

[buz]

Mainly proper room correction. I also question if running 5k in speakers with an old low end avr is appropriate.

Finqlly, 4k but that can be addressed by attaching video sources to the TV.

 

[dlaloum]

In terms of RoomEQ - current competitors are Audissey XT32 (Denon/Marantz), and Dirac (JBL, Arcam, NAD, Onkyo, Pioneer, Integra) - with a couple of proprietary others... (trinnov, Anthem,...)

Depending on your budget category - might rule a bunch of these out.

IMO with 10 years experience of Audissey.... go Dirac - it has dramatically improved my system for the better... replacing an Audyssey XT32 AVR.

Your current AVR is 80W... so something like the Onkyo NR7100, Integra DRX 3.4, Pioneer LX305, would provide both Dirac and enough power to handle your current setup. (These are close siblings, being basically identical, with mainly cosmetic differences, the Integra has a full set of Pre-Outs, which is why I purchased it, as I run external amps)

Or you could stick with Denon... either the X2700 or X3700 would suit.... but honestly, I think you can do better than Audyssey.

 

[Chrispy]

Get the Dirac gear and send it to Amir and hopefully he'll do more than the usual casual digital measurements....

 

[valerianf]

The problem is that Denon is now own by a company that make medical devices (!) and Onkyo Japan has still some bankruptcy issues.
Nobody knows when the next batch of RZ50 will arrive and if there will be any Onkyo spare parts!
Myself I would like to buy a new Avr but I will wait until Black Friday 2022.

 

[Chrispy]

The problem is that Denon is now own by a company that make medical devices (!) and Onkyo Japan has still some bankruptcy issues.
Nobody knows when the next batch of RZ50 will arrive and if there will be any Onkyo spare parts!
Myself I would like to buy a new Avr but I will wait until Black Friday 2022.

Did the sale of SU to Masimo actually go thru now?

 

[buz]

It seems like only the Pioneer is available in Switzerland and the LX305 misses the pre outs, hence my leaning towards the LX505 if I go the Pioneer route. The amps in the Onkyo did not perform all that well, after all (whether that is actually audible is questionable though).

I don't think I am willing to pay Anthem money (much less Trinnov or Storm). If I ever get the chance to build a dedicated HT room, I will contemplate that.

 

[dlaloum]

The problem is that Denon is now own by a company that make medical devices (!) and Onkyo Japan has still some bankruptcy issues.
Nobody knows when the next batch of RZ50 will arrive and if there will be any Onkyo spare parts!
Myself I would like to buy a new Avr but I will wait until Black Friday 2022.

Onkyo is now owned by Voxx and Sharp.

No longer by onkyo Japan.

VOXX seems to be in good financial health.

 

[buz]

OTOH, Sharp seems to be eternally struggling. AVRs are a depressing industry for sure.

If it wasn't for Hollywood's DRM idiocy, I would not even bother, but alas...

 

[dlaloum]

The deal is Voxx 75% Sharp 25% or thereabouts - Sharp runs the factory, Voxx does everything else...

 

[Beershaun]

You will be very happy with the Denon and audyssey xt32. Purchase the app and you have the ability to modify the target curves. The Denon measures and performs well and has been reliable which, in my own experience, has correlated better than I expected with a high quality audio experience.

 

[N1ck]

.

IMO with 10 years experience of Audissey.... go Dirac - it has dramatically improved my system for the better... replacing an Audyssey XT32 AVR.

Is that using a 10 year old Audissey receiver or have you used more recent ones, i.e. xt32?

 

[dlaloum]

Is that using a 10 year old Audissey receiver or have you used more recent ones, i.e. xt32?

It was XT32 on a TOTL 2013 AVR (Integra DTR 3.4) - But there was no option for tuning the target -which means audyssey imposed its midrange dip, I'm OK with the default Audyssey Target curve, but that MRC wrecked the critical midrange... un EQ'd always sounded better than EQ'd.

With Dirac the default "simple" setup was an immediate improvement over the un-EQ'd configuration - and then I could tune it as desired.

As I have stated repeatedly, it is possible, that with the new app, and the ability to turn off MRC - Audyssey would be on a par with Dirac - but with years of disappointment behind me, I preferred to give something else a go, and I have not been disappointed.

Audyssey should have pulled its socks up years ago... now it has to prove itself worthy, against a competitor who at the very least matches it.

 

[jcarys]

This year's Denon x8xx receivers should be announced at CEDIA, if not before. I doubt there will be much different from the 3700, but I'd wait at least that long for confirmation. I also would not hold off based on what DAC is in the unit. The amplification and your speakers have far more distortion than any DAC chip they are using.

 

[Chrispy]

It was XT32 on a TOTL 2013 AVR (Integra DTR 3.4) - But there was no option for tuning the target -which means audyssey imposed its midrange dip, I'm OK with the default Audyssey Target curve, but that MRC wrecked the critical midrange... un EQ'd always sounded better than EQ'd.

With Dirac the default "simple" setup was an immediate improvement over the un-EQ'd configuration - and then I could tune it as desired.

As I have stated repeatedly, it is possible, that with the new app, and the ability to turn off MRC - Audyssey would be on a par with Dirac - but with years of disappointment behind me, I preferred to give something else a go, and I have not been disappointed.

Audyssey should have pulled its socks up years ago... now it has to prove itself worthy, against a competitor who at the very least matches it.

In a way Audyssey did pull up its socks a few years ago in general, and has pursued other than avr implementation for the most part (seems more automotive and personal device oriented now). My XT32 unit is pre-app, and would have liked to have been able to use that....so the upcoming Dirac as well as Audyssey options in the new units could well be worth waiting for....

 

[dlaloum]

In a way Audyssey did pull up its socks a few years ago in general, and has pursued other than avr implementation for the most part (seems more automotive and personal device oriented now). My XT32 unit is pre-app, and would have liked to have been able to use that....so the upcoming Dirac as well as Audyssey options in the new units could well be worth waiting for....

Given the $20 Audyssey app, if you get an AVR with built in Audyssey XT32 - why would you pay $800 to get the equivalent "full fat" Dirac...

It makes no sense... And it raises the cost of the AVR up an entire category - most people won't do that.

BUT

Perhaps the Dirac "optional" upgrade makes sense.... if Dirac is about to release its new "Spatial Room Correction" software.... that would justify spending some money, and provide a substantial upgrade over Audyssey or standard Dirac Live.
From my perspective - looking at the SU marantz/denon new range.... the only way the new Dirac optional feature makes sense, is if Dirac is about to launch something dramatic...
We have been waiting for something like that for the flagship Onkyo models as well

Here's hoping Dirac launches it soon!!

 

[Chrispy]

Given the $20 Audyssey app, if you get an AVR with built in Audyssey XT32 - why would you pay $800 to get the equivalent "full fat" Dirac...

It makes no sense... And it raises the cost of the AVR up an entire category - most people won't do that.

BUT

Perhaps the Dirac "optional" upgrade makes sense.... if Dirac is about to release its new "Spatial Room Correction" software.... that would justify spending some money, and provide a substantial upgrade over Audyssey or standard Dirac Live.
From my perspective - looking at the SU marantz/denon new range.... the only way the new Dirac optional feature makes sense, is if Dirac is about to launch something dramatic...
We have been waiting for something like that for the flagship Onkyo models as well

Here's hoping Dirac launches it soon!!

Oh I'd be generally fine with just the app (or I suppose maybe the $200 license for MultEQ-X instead)....kinda wish I'd gotten an Audyssey Pro kit but never did. Too bad the unit I have isn't backwards compatible with the app. I like the idea of having the Dirac as an option, and the combination of some features of both (Dirac & Audyssey) that have been mentioned for D&M units sounds interesting. It'll be a while to see how that goes....

What would you look for in the way of dramatic new stuff from Dirac? I'm not particularly shopping at this time either....but have been curious what could be done for avrs ever since Pioneer was granted a Dirac license a few years ago....but the roll out to various brands has been pretty limited so far.