Master Thread: Are measurements Everything or Nothing?

[DanielT]

Oh, there is no need for that. There are still many open opportunities to earn some serious money when you can show these kinds of things in controlled tests.. for some reason the money never gets claimed…

You can talk (it's possible) but .. That proverb sounds better in Swedish. Put the money on the horse? What the hell is it called in English? You can always talk, but ... I do not remember the English proverb.

 

[solderdude]

yea its pointless if i move the mic, but what if i dont move it? it should be the same

Try that too you will see the plots don't line up simply because you may not have been in the exact same spot doing the second run which will drastically change reflections and thus interference.
Don't take my word for it. In order to learn about this stuff you need to experience it.

Using a mic to prove something in the electrical domain simply is not possible.

 

[Killingbeans]

pretty much

 

[DanielT]

pretty much

Had we lived close to each other. Always nice with a little extra money. Blind test performed professionally of course in that case.

 

[voodooless]

You can talk (it's possible) but .. That proverb sounds better in Swedish. Put the money on the horse? What the hell is it called in English? You can always talk, but ... I do not remember the English proverb.

Put your money where your mouth is

 

[Spkrdctr]

Howdy @Ghoostknight Nearly all of those capacitors are not even in the signal path. They are there to shunt unwanted energy that is wayyy out of your hearing range to ground. There are also some that caps that smooth the output from voltage regulators too. Recapping is not a fix it is called shot-gunning in electronics street speak and it's a method of attempting to fix something without diagnosing the issue at hand and hoping a spray and pray effect will fix the gear.

Load up the parts cannon! Fire at will.

 

[Spkrdctr]

I capacitor swapped in a small test jig that I made for taking the high level outputs of a amp and using that output to input to a amplifier RCA connection(s). I swapped out varying values and voltages and realized there was zerO change in sound quality that was audible. I was able to AB instantly and because the amp and speakers and source never changed the levels where pretty much the same but no audible change.

You know you have tin ears. Plus your system is not resolving enough. Also, you probably didn't have any speaker wire risers so the whole test is invalid. Not to even mention you probably did not align your electrons with the polar gravity fields of Earth. This kind bit of instruction is brought to you by your audiophile friends. They forced me to post this.......

 

[Spkrdctr]

I didn’t even know you did the test when I wrote it, so get off you high horse. Did you level match the files before the test? Are the two of exactly the same part of music, exact same length? There are probably a half dozen more critical questions I could ask about this “test”.


Of course it is. 5cm (it actually looks like a lot more than that) makes a massive difference in such a close listening situation. This is orders of magnitude more likely to be the explanation of any audible difference vs the Jitterbug contraption.

You guys do realize the Jitterbug is a senior citizens phone sold in the USA?

 

[voodooless]

You guys do realize the Jitterbug is a senior citizens phone sold in the USA?

Nope

 

[Spkrdctr]

Once one crosses over from the electrical to the acoustical domain accuracy is out the door.

OMG! You just summed up about 200 of my posts in one sentence. I hereby acknowledge your skill at conveying a thought very accurately. I wish I had said what you just said. But, as any good internet person, I will steal it and use a lot. Thanks!

 

[Pugsly]

well thanks for the effort but this is just untrue

1. how is it that things sound worse sometimes, even with high hopes?
2. how is it i can reproducable hear the same changes over and over again, on different days etc with the same opamp`s for example? for the worse or the better beside having high hopes, which should trick the mind, right?


and one other thing, if all the "audiphiles" make things up, we apparently have a lot of psychotic people running around

Can I recommend the following video, and particularly the 39:00-41:00 minute mark?

There is a lot of good info in this video regarding placebo and testing, but that particular section makes an important point: being susceptible to placebo does not make you psychotic - it makes you human.

 

[Spkrdctr]

Oh, there is no need for that. There are still many open opportunities to earn some serious money when you can show these kinds of things in controlled tests.. for some reason the money never gets claimed…

Yup. I have seen thousands of dollars offered up back when that was real money. No one has EVER in the history of audio ever been able to claim it. Once you go to a blind test, you cant hear any differences, except for speakers. Assuming properly working solid state units. Plus if anyone ever does actually claim a big amount of money by "passing" a blind test, they would be world famous in the audio community. No one so far.......going on 50 years!

 

[Timcognito]

Once one crosses over from the electrical to the acoustical domain accuracy is out the door.

Isn't this true in reverse too. Once the sound enters the microphone and is converted to electrical energy things are lost or distorted. The type of and mechanical/spatial placement of microphones in recording is much debated.

 

[mhardy6647]

Please 8lb 6oz Baby Jesus, let this be true.

Shouldn't that be measured in, like, ephahs or something?

Definition of EPHAH

an ancient Hebrew unit of dry measure equal to 1/10 homer or a little over a bushel… See the full definition

www.merriam-webster.com

PS For those of you keeping score at home: an ephah is a tenth of a homer.

 

[voodooless]

PS For those of you keeping score at home: an ephah is a tenth of a homer.

 

[AdamG]

yea mainly because of capacitors is my guess, i can also confirm that cable burn in is a thing... pretty much all electronics tho the only explanation i can give is the audiophile "molecular structure change" with electrons flowing throw it...


seriously? dont focus on the "quality" its hard to hear with recorded speakers but for me the soundstage was pretty "obvious" changing, also like the "depth" of the music (tho i just listened once, so take it with a grain of salt) edit: i relistened and the first part just sounds more "2d" instead of "3d" to put it simple (maybe even more dynamic)
you can skip the pluggin part tho...

Your continued Trolling is getting tiring. I have issued you a two week forum Ban! When and if you return, this behavior must cease. Enjoy your vacation!

 

[Pdxwayne]

is it possible to record with the minidsp umik-1? (in like "good" quality?) i will probably get soon one and could do some A/B`s in a more controlled manner, specially static mic/volume ....

A while back, I was told a mic is not good enough to differentiate small dB differences. So, if the differences are very small, then maybe not good idea to use mic.

It may be best to start with capturing from your DAC outputs. But then, you also need very good ADC so the differences are not masked thd+noise of the ADC.

 

[Killingbeans]

Isn't this true in reverse too. Once the sound enters the microphone and is converted to electrical energy things are lost or distorted. The type of and mechanical/spatial placement of microphones in recording is much debated.

Yes. Both sides of the transducer-coin is an illusion.

 

[voodooless]

Your continued Trolling is getting tiring. I have issued you a two week forum Ban! When and if you return, this behavior must cease. Enjoy your vacation!

Oah, don’t take him from us already… we were just getting warmed up here

 

[Spkrdctr]

Folks that was 39 PAGES and 770 posts long. Our moderating team let it run as everyone was feeding him (having fun?) and many trying to seriously interact with him. No one can say that people are run off without giving them a chance to be heard and to respond intelligently. We are our own worst enemy when we feed them as much as he got fed. I'm just as guilty as anyone. I will spank myself later.