Which DAC measurements do you like to see next?

[stunta]

Also the designer John W says it can be much improved by an external linear power supply, so maybe you can measure that too..

WTF? Is this for the Pro-Ject? Now I've completely lost interest in this. This is the same old crap they are still pulling in the hifi industry - upgrade your interconnects, upgrade you power cord and so on. I hate to bring this analogy over and over again, but if when people go buy a new TV and they are told they only get HDR if they buy an external power supply, how well will this sell compared to others. The hifi industry is FUBAR.

Oh, so it can be USB powered by itself?

BTW, we just lost power as it is a very windy day. So can't do testing until we get it back (running on generator).

Move to Boston. Its colder but nice and sunny

 

[ManglerFi]

Oh, so it can be USB powered by itself?

BTW, we just lost power as it is a very windy day. So can't do testing until we get it back (running on generator).

Yeah, the designer says that if you're using USB that should be the only power unless you have a linear power supply. To me this sounds like one of those audio myth (or at least not necessarily audible) type statements but maybe it's more than that. A good testing should clarify this for us.

Bummer about the power outage.

 

[RayDunzl]

Let's see the generator waveform, harmonics, and noise...

 

[ManglerFi]

WTF? Is this for the Pro-Ject? Now I've completely lost interest in this. This is the same old crap they are still pulling in the hifi industry - upgrade your interconnects, upgrade you power cord and so on. I hate to bring this analogy over and over again, but if when people go buy a new TV and they are told they only get HDR if they buy an external power supply, how well will this sell compared to others. The hifi industry is FUBAR.

Yeah, this is kinda how I've taken these remarks. If this units are made well they shouldn't need a bunch of other stuff to do their jobs as intended. It does dull the luster of this unit a bit for sure, but if it still performs well on the test I'll be happy with it.

 

[sonci99]

These units are made with some costs and objectives in mind. You cannot cramp a high end power supply inside a 350€ pocket size dac.
The designer is not selling any power supply, he's not even working for the Pro ject any more, but audio needs good power, plain simple..

I cannot find the link now, but basically he says that ifi power supply are bad because of leakage and that you don't have to buy expensive stuff, any chinese linear on ebay can be good.
You can try the Project with any linear 5v supply, there was an error on the manual, but normally when it detects power on auxiliary usb port it use that and not the usb port.

 

[amirm]

Let's see the generator waveform, harmonics, and noise...

I don't know how much propane we have so I am not going to power more stuff than I have to. When there is power I can always force a switch to the generator and measure that.

 

[ManglerFi]

These units are made with some costs and objectives in mind. You cannot cramp a high end power supply inside a 350€ pocket size dac.
The designer is not selling any power supply, he's not even working for the Pro ject any more, but audio needs good power, plain simple..

I understand this but when we have units being pumped out like the topping d30 or dx7 that sets a standard for what should be expected from a similarly priced unit. I think we should wait and see just how the S2 digital performs before chasing this rabbit much further down the hole .

 

[sonci99]

I understand this but when we have units being pumped out like the topping d30 or dx7 that sets a standard for what should be expected from a similarly priced unit. I think we should wait and see just how the S2 digital performs before chasing this rabbit much further down the hole .

The Topping still use "high" wattage switching supply, while the 5v usb supply is weak even for a dac..

 

[amirm]

OK, power is back.

 

[punkriot]

Pre-Box S2 can be powered using only USB input from computer (this is portable version of 9038 not the Pro one). And this is how is should be used with USB input by default. The SMPS is only there to use for other inputs.
If you want to use external power supply when using USB it has to be better quality then what your USB input can deliver, that is why designer suggested that if you want to use external PSU with USB input use LPSU. This is theory, now @amirm can verify it
Also this DAC gives users possibility to play with 8 digital filters and distrortion compensation on/off. If possible it would be great to test effect of distortion compensation setting on measurements.

 

[amirm]

I just finished all the measurements, documented them only to read this about distortion compensation! And it is off by default. Grrrrr. Let me remasure some to see if it makes a difference...

 

[amirm]

Hmmm. I wonder if the distortion mitigation is implemented backward. I tested three cases and in all three enabling "distortion compensation" makes things worse, not better!

 

[RayDunzl]

Maybe it is actually "on" by default.

 

[amirm]

I turned it on and off a couple of times and it is always backward.

 

[RayDunzl]

Maybe the documentation/GUI is backward.

How do you switch it?

(I'm not even sure what device you're talking about, so feel free to do a soft ignore)

Lots of "it" in the previous posts, then, "Pro-Ject Pre Box S2 digital".

(I even said "it" just above)

 

[Wombat]

This DAC subject is reminding me of this:

Apparently there are more than 4200 religious faith-based belief systems.

Similarly, there seems to be a never-ending number of DACs and supporters out there, too.

 

[amirm]

Maybe the documentation/GUI is backward.

How do you switch it?

(I'm not even sure what device you're talking about, so feel free to do a soft ignore)

Lots of "it" in the previous posts, then, "Pro-Ject Pre Box S2 digital".

It is the Project S2. You hit menu until the option shows up then you rotate a knob until it says enabled or disabled.

 

[Blumlein 88]

Hmmm. I wonder if the distortion mitigation is implemented backward. I tested three cases and in all three enabling "distortion compensation" makes things worse, not better!

Well, there goes your good rep as an ace measurement guru on all the audio forums.

 

[ManglerFi]

Interesting results for sure, I wonder what's going on there?

 

[amirm]

ESS is secrative and doesn't have public specs that I could find. But Benchmark documents the distortion reduction effect and measurements in this graph: https://benchmarkmedia.com/blogs/application_notes/dac3-introducing-the-new-es9028pro-converter

I am going to see if I can mimic their test.