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SMSL SP400 Review (headphone amp)

JB5150

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Correct max volume would go to the A90, due to the higher gain structure. Power and gain are separate even though they sound like the same specification. Some have complained about the SP400 for the same reason, it has higher power, but it has a low gain structure, so isn't really louder volume wise than SH-9 or SP200 etc.

Yeah, I was expecting SP400 to be louder than SP200.
It was very disappointing to me when I heard it. :(
SP200 is THE LOUDEST AMP I'VE HEARD.
It still blows me away the value it is! I don't think I'll ever sell mine!

I think both amplifiers are amazing. Looks like the Singxer you have to change the gain somewhere on the bottom of the unit vs having a nice switch on the front, but that may be a minor inconvenience.

The gain switches on the bottom of SA-1, would be my only very minor issue.
I never use low gain on any amps I own. Turn it to 11! :)
 
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Inkey31

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Well.... take care of your ears :p

Veri, you seem very smart in regards to this stuff, if an amp does 6.4 watts at 32 OHM, how would you measure that at 80 OHM?

Is there a formula?
 

Veri

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Veri, you seem very smart in regards to this stuff, if an amp does 6.4 watts at 32 OHM, how would you measure that at 80 OHM?
Is there a formula?
Let me call for help @solderdude if he has time. I'm not really sure.
 

Noob

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Veri, you seem very smart in regards to this stuff, if an amp does 6.4 watts at 32 OHM, how would you measure that at 80 OHM?

Is there a formula?

2.56W if the voltage remains constant.

and the relevant formulas Watts = Amps * Volts
Amps = Volts/Ohms

So 80 = 2.5 * 32 then just divide 6.4 by 2.5 and you get 2.56W at 80ohms
 

Noob

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Yeah, I was expecting SP400 to be louder than SP200.
It was very disappointing to me when I heard it. :(
SP200 is THE LOUDEST AMP I'VE HEARD.
It still blows me away the value it is! I don't think I'll ever sell mine!



The gain switches on the bottom of SA-1, would be my only very minor issue.
I never use low gain on any amps I own. Turn it to 11! :)

It seems to me that you prioritize loud volume far more than others on this forum. Do you own an FA-10 PRO? It seems like that would be the ideal end-game amp for you. The sp200 has very high gain, but will distort if you try to push he6 or some other crazy headphone through them at the volumes you seem to enjoy because it doesn't have the current delivery for extremely low sensitivity headphones, or at least that is what I gather from other reviews.

If you want truly limitless headroom to power any headphone to insane level, I think you should probably get an FA-10 PRO from Flux Labs.

Just a suggestion since it's probably the most powerful dedicated headphone amp on the market right now both in gain level and in max output power, and very low noise and distortion if the measurements are correct.

Just thought you might be interested in that. It's definitely overkill for the vast majority, but it seems like it was made for you.
 

Inkey31

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2.56W if the voltage remains constant.

and the relevant formulas Watts = Amps * Volts
Amps = Volts/Ohms

So 80 = 2.5 * 32 then just divide 6.4 by 2.5 and you get 2.56W at 80ohms

Thank you very much, if I could ask you one more question, what's the difference between discrete amps and these types of amps that use chips?

Why do people say discrete sounds better despite measuring worse?
 

Noob

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Thank you very much, if I could ask you one more question, what's the difference between discrete amps and these types of amps that use chips?

Why do people say discrete sounds better despite measuring worse?

I'm definitely not knowledgeable enough to describe the differences in types of amp design. I am an audio technician, not an engineer. So I know enough to use the equipment, but I don't build the things.

And the reason someone might say something sounds better to them is because it probably does. We engineers actually intentionally add and manipulate very specific types of distortion to create certain musical effects that honestly make the music sound better. So depending on the amp, some of them might have a particular type of distortion at just the right level and in just the right frequency range that someone finds it enjoyable with the kind of music they listen to. That particular sound coloring may not work for all types of songs and recordings, but it might be just the right sound that someone wants in their system. Speakers and headphones also have their own distortion, and certain harmonics can sound better through some systems and worse through others due to the rate of decay of the driver, which can be seen in a waterfall graph, and resonances of the equipment or even the listening space. So all that factors into what we call synergy and preference.

But if you just want what is on the recording with no embellishment, you need to start with removing physical resonances and the rate of decay of the acoustic space as much as possible. Then you get the least distorting and flattest speakers and headphones you can buy. And then you get a low THD+N DAC and Amp.

And if the engineers and producers did their job, you will still get rich and pleasant harmonics in the music, because the engineer put them there.

But if the music itself isn't all that tonally rich, then your very linear and dry system will show you that the engineer should have done a better job.

For those who just want to enjoy and relax and not actually analyze the music, having a system that just adds a layer of tone onto everything and blurs any production issues can be extremely preferable.

The only downside is that perfectly recorded and produced music sounds better on a more dry and linear system that reveals everything the engineer did right.

But most music isn't perfectly made. It's a trade-off.
 

JohnYang1997

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That AMP looks pretty good, Class A with these numbers? WOW! That rare right?

This seems to do a lot of power too, but correct me if I am wrong, it says 16Ω10W 32Ω5.5W 68Ω3.1W in the review here: https://www.l7audiolab.com/f/measurements-of-singxer-sa-1-headphone-amppre-retail/

That is on par with the A90 right? Seems the power is about the same once you get into the 32OHM mark.
This has 30mA of quiescent current so not pure class A. Balanced output distortion is ok.
 

JohnYang1997

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Thank you very much, if I could ask you one more question, what's the difference between discrete amps and these types of amps that use chips?

Why do people say discrete sounds better despite measuring worse?
There are always different opinions, different assumptions, different biases.
 

JohnYang1997

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Which amp has more power, THX SMLS, A90, the SA-1?
sp400 should have the most power due to higher supply voltage. A90 and SA1 use same smps modules with same voltages. Sa1 is slightly higher than A90 in all loads. But A90 is not far off. Distortion wise A90 is the lowest.
 

cursive

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sp400 should have the most power due to higher supply voltage. A90 and SA1 use same smps modules with same voltages. Sa1 is slightly higher than A90 in all loads. But A90 is not far off. Distortion wise A90 is the lowest.
I've seen several people mention in reviews of the SP400 that SMSL should update the firmware and raise the gain, alluding to the fact that this is somehow set, or controlled by software.

Do you know if this is an accurate statement? Is the gain level purely a setting in the software, or is it more a product of the actual circuit layout and design?
 

mkawa

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Audiophiles are terrible at giving recording engineers credit for all the variables they have to take into account when recording mixing and mastering. Making something sound good on a wide range of transmission mediums, equipment and listeners is blood sweat and tears and while we get to argue pointlessly about veils and sinad, because it is a hobby, it is their livelihoods. Credit where credit is due.
 

JohnYang1997

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I've seen several people mention in reviews of the SP400 that SMSL should update the firmware and raise the gain, alluding to the fact that this is somehow set, or controlled by software.

Do you know if this is an accurate statement? Is the gain level purely a setting in the software, or is it more a product of the actual circuit layout and design?
Even though this is controlled by program, I don't think SP400 has the means to upgrade it. So not helpful. But I say why bother where the number is at if it's loud enough.
 

JohnYang1997

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Audiophiles are terrible at giving recording engineers credit for all the variables they have to take into account when recording mixing and mastering. Making something sound good on a wide range of transmission mediums, equipment and listeners is blood sweat and tears and while we get to argue pointlessly about veils and sinad, because it is a hobby, it is their livelihoods. Credit where credit is due.
Well. Almost all recording, mixing engineers are also guilty of this.
And then reproduction is a completely different game from recording. Sound good is just their job. Reproduction is to play back what is on the record.
 

mkawa

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When they argue about veils it is their money on the line though ;)
 

Inkey31

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sp400 should have the most power due to higher supply voltage. A90 and SA1 use same smps modules with same voltages. Sa1 is slightly higher than A90 in all loads. But A90 is not far off. Distortion wise A90 is the lowest.

When Amir reviewed the SP400 and the A90 the A90 had a higher output watt at 4.8 @ 50ohm vs the SP400 at 4 at 50ohm both XLR in and Out.

Why would the a90 have almost a whole watt on the SP400 when measured? Seems the SP400 when your pumping with higher then normal V's from the dac can you hit those numbers, or am I way off?
 

JohnYang1997

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When Amir reviewed the SP400 and the A90 the A90 had a higher output watt at 4.8 @ 50ohm vs the SP400 at 4 at 50ohm both XLR in and Out.

Why would the a90 have almost a whole watt on the SP400 when measured? Seems the SP400 when your pumping with higher then normal V's from the dac can you hit those numbers, or am I way off?
The gain on SP400 is a bit low. So it needs a bit higher DAC voltage it seems. It's kinda similar to L30 situation.
My take is that in real world use it doesn't really matter unless someone actually max it out and still doesn't have enough loudness.
 
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