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Slim Subwoofer recommendation

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#1
Hi all,

I am in search of a slim subwoofer to put under my desk (really tight room, only ~50cm leg room currently), so I am looking for some options on potential subs, my current in room measurement have only one major dip problem at ~-15db at 90hz, right now it seems the genelec 7040 with 210mm depth and a side port seemed to be my best option but the cross over at 85hz might not fully rectify my bass dip. Anymore suggestion with a <300mm depth and preferably a hard grille in the front so I won't accidentally kick into the woofer itself?
 
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#2
If you can DIY, Voxel subwoofer by Paul Carmody. Small as a shoe box. Goes down to 35hz. Should be plenty for music.
 

richard12511

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#3

HooStat

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#6
KEF T2 is an option. But you might want to put it to the side of your desk if possible. I don't think it has a hard grille. I think there are a few other options that others mentioned to me a while back. They all seem to be based on a similar 10" driver. Blanking on them at the moment.

Aperion audio makes a well-regarded sub with opposing drivers. If it fits, your feet would only hit the front of the cabinet.
 
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#7
Bk Electronics Double Gem?
 

HooStat

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#9
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Thread Starter #10
Thanks all for suggestions, quite a few are interesting but sadly few are active with cross over built in to be used with active monitors, let me dig around these options and see which one fits
 

stren

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#11
If you want something cheap and you're not looking for something that is going to go low (given that your null is so high), then you could look at the cheapo wall mount / under chair subs from Yamaha and monoprice. The sigberg is a better version of those but is quite a bit more than the genelec you mentioned. It sounds like the room might be small in which case you may not need much. Personally I'd spend more than the yamaha/monoprice, but given the cheap price you could try them and see how bad they are.

Edit - saw you wanted a crossover - there's always a minidsp. But if not, jl audio has the d108 with a built in crossover which is under 300mm in width, so if you rotate it maybe...


Width (W)10 in / 254 mm
Height (H)11.37 in / 289 mm
Depth (D)13.23 in / 336 mm
 
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#12
Regarding that measured dip...

- if your mains are crossed over currently, are you sure it's not caused by phase / time alignment issues at the crossover point?
- if your mains are currently running full range and the dip is present, and the mains are on your desk, and you place the sub beneath them, it's likely going to measure similarly and have the same null.
 
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Thread Starter #13
Regarding that measured dip...

- if your mains are crossed over currently, are you sure it's not caused by phase / time alignment issues at the crossover point?
- if your mains are currently running full range and the dip is present, and the mains are on your desk, and you place the sub beneath them, it's likely going to measure similarly and have the same null.
My mains are currently running full range, but the driver location of the sub compared to the main using the genelec 7040 as a reference thickness should be closer to front wall than then mains, so I suppose the 90hz cancellation dip of the sub should be pushed slightly higher in FR, and if crossed over at 85 hz I am thinking it might get a bit less severe and could extend the low bass to around 30hz compared to currently 57hz. That’s why I was tempted to get the 7040 or sigberg to fit in and just to get full ranged sound. I know it’s almost impossible for a single sub in small room situation that that null could be mitigated completely and just to get a budget good enough sound is ok
 
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#14
I know it’s almost impossible for a single sub in small room situation that that null could be mitigated completely and just to get a budget good enough sound is ok
You could mitigate that null completely, if you're flexible on where the sub can be placed. That said, I agree that a single sub is likely to have a null at some frequency, but its placement flexibility, at least, gives you the ability to choose which null, and/or how severe it is.

You might get lucky and find that your 90Hz null is vertical (floor to ceiling distance), and a floor-placed sub fixes that. That could easily be tested by temporarily placing one of your mains on the floor for a quick measurement. Place it where you sub will be, and you'll be able to measure expected response down to the effective frequency of your mains (a sub may obviously expose a lower null).
 
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Thread Starter #15
You could mitigate that null completely, if you're flexible on where the sub can be placed. That said, I agree that a single sub is likely to have a null at some frequency, but its placement flexibility, at least, gives you the ability to choose which null, and/or how severe it is.

You might get lucky and find that your 90Hz null is vertical (floor to ceiling distance), and a floor-placed sub fixes that. That could easily be tested by temporarily placing one of your mains on the floor for a quick measurement. Place it where you sub will be, and you'll be able to measure expected response down to the effective frequency of your mains (a sub may obviously expose a lower null).
calculating the wavelength of 90hz being 3.8m and 1/4 is slightly below 1m it's very likely the bookshelf behind my seat being the culprit, so likely the sub would just slightly reduce the null and extend the FR to full range, just to see how well it goes if I managed to get one eventually
 

sigbergaudio

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#16
The idea of placing one of the mains on the floor where you want to place the subwoofer is a good one. You could also measure your mains individually and see if the null is present in both speakers, and then make sure to move the one that isn't producing the null to the future subwoofer position.

You could also experiment with moving the speakers further/closer to the wall to see how this affects the null.

Finally as you indicate, you should ideally have a crossover higher than the null, so probably 100hz. It also sounds like you listen quite nearfield here, so even if you do have some dips, it's not necessarily very audible. Could you perhaps share a screenshot of your measurements? Even very deep dips like the one you indicate having may not be that problematic if it's narrow. One or two narrow but deep peaks somewhere in the 80-100hz area and above is very common, and not always easily fixed.
 
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Thread Starter #17
The idea of placing one of the mains on the floor where you want to place the subwoofer is a good one. You could also measure your mains individually and see if the null is present in both speakers, and then make sure to move the one that isn't producing the null to the future subwoofer position.

You could also experiment with moving the speakers further/closer to the wall to see how this affects the null.

Finally as you indicate, you should ideally have a crossover higher than the null, so probably 100hz. It also sounds like you listen quite nearfield here, so even if you do have some dips, it's not necessarily very audible. Could you perhaps share a screenshot of your measurements? Even very deep dips like the one you indicate having may not be that problematic if it's narrow. One or two narrow but deep peaks somewhere in the 80-100hz area and above is very common, and not always easily fixed.

Hi, here are my measurements without any dsp (only built in dip switches engaged with the genelec 8030C)
background, both speakers are right beside my computer monitor, both placed equal distance from wall with tape measurement (close corner 5cm, far corner 7.5cm) toeing to me.
The environment difference is that the Right speaker right side is basically free, ~ 70cm from window, but left speaker side are packed with small gadgets for my wife (files, Xmas cards, small wooden jewelry box etc. literally touching the left side of my left speaker, desk space in front of both speaker is around 40cm, with another 50cm behind being my listening position and right behind is a bookshelf with panel door.

I could see that the Right channel have the dip further at 100hz and left channel approximately at 85hz, so probably it is related to the front bookshelf door reflection being ~1m to both speaker axis causing the 1/4 wavelength cancellation. while the left channel maybe those small stuffs of my wife have been acting as some sort of bass trap so the overall bass level is lowered quite significantly.

my only space left for sub would be right at the middle of my desk in front of my listening position, on right side is my computer tower case which almost touch the bottom of my desk, and left side a bit more free, while if so using sigber or genelec 7040 would make the sub driver to bookshelf (ignore my chair and legs) approximately 80cm so I assume would at least making the null at around 100-110hz, so likely it could make flat bass till 20hz and the null would be kept at around 100hz?
L: Green, R: Red
8030C measure.jpg


L+R
L+R.jpg
 

sigbergaudio

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#20
Either way it's likely that a subwoofer will help this dip, but it needs to be crossed above the dip. And as others have mentioned, if you place the subwoofer at equal distance from whatever wall is causing the dip, you may get the same dip from the subwoofer as well.
 
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