Review and Measurements of Sabaj D5 DAC & Amp

[maxxevv]

That is not correct. The discounted price for the SU-8 was 170€ for a short time.

That was your mistake, for whatever reason you are correcting it in reply to me.

I was saying not to mix sales discounted prices with the MRSP.

 

[Silou]

That was your mistake, for whatever reason you are correcting it in reply to me.

I was saying not to mix sales discounted prices with the MRSP.

I am referring to the german Amazon prices which I watched for the last months.
Normal: 180€
Raised after review of ASR: 210€
Sale: 170€

 

[maxxevv]

I am referring to the german Amazon prices which I watched for the last months.
Normal: 180€
Raised after review of ASR: 210€
Sale: 170€

You probably didn't realise but those listings are by Shenzhen Audio, not some Germany based seller.
Which means that is the discounted price that they are selling at as Amazon.de seems to only show the selling price, not the original MRSP in their listings.

This is their listing on their own website:
https://www.shenzhenaudio.com/hifi-...khz-dsd64-dsd512-dsd-balance-dac-decoder.html

And to add, their Aliexpress listing:

https://www.aliexpress.com/item/32884977254.html

 

[Nango]

are you suggesting to change methodology to check if you get the same results?

Yes, exactly that!!

i thought the idea behind reproducible results is that another person will get the same results if you follow the exact methodology as outlined? wouldn’t independent verification by a third party to check if there isn’t any shenanigans being pulled be the way to go rather than changing test methodology?

Yes, exactly what I said!! But this "Certificate" certainly costs a lot. And ASR delivers it for free.

If I have access to an APX I wont send-in my gear until it measures perfect. But this is extremly unfair to those mfr/diy'ler who also are good engineers but have no access to the APX and send the gear neverthereless.

 

[JohnYang1997]

Yes, exactly that!!



Yes, exactly what I said!! But this "Certification" certainly costs a lot. And ASR delivers it for free.

If I have access to an APX I wont send-in my gear until it measures perfect. But this is extremly unfair to those mfr/diy'ler who also are good engineers but have no access to the APX and send its gear neverthereless.

No. Good engineer will have ways to measure their distortion. There is nothing crazy about AP. Except for something like ultra low jitter or other stuff in the digital domain. For pure distortion it's really possible to measure down even to -140db range for cheap. It's just that AP is a complete package, easy to use, plus some high end features. Btw don't say APX it's AP and the APx555, APx525 is the model number. You can get away saying AP 555 and everyone will understand. But APX is not a terms that's easily understandable to most of us.

 

[JohnYang1997]

There is nothing fair about everything in this world. It's us that make it happen. It's better to have an AP but is it necessary? For the most part, it really isn't.

 

[Dialectic]

Yes, exactly that!!



Yes, exactly what I said!! But this "Certificate" certainly costs a lot. And ASR delivers it for free.

If I have access to an APX I wont send-in my gear until it measures perfect. But this is extremly unfair to those mfr/diy'ler who also are good engineers but have no access to the APX and send the gear neverthereless.

If you're selling audio gear to the public, you had best make sure that it measures well. If that means that you must invest in an AP unit, so be it.

 

[Nango]

No. Good engineer will have ways to measure their distortion.

Yes of course. But my understanding was until now that only few, if any, use the AP, they use other inferior devices. And Amir verifies their measurements with the "state-of-the-art" AP.

 

[JohnYang1997]

Yes of course. But my understanding was until now that only few, if any, use the AP, they use other inferior devices.

So what? They can still have ways to measure their distortion without AP. For a few hundred dollars you can measure -120db distortion without tricks. With notch filters, oscillator, etc you can even measure -140db range distortion. For noise, make a preamp or mod an o2 with 40db gain, and divided by 100 afterwards. There are always ways to measure. Otherwise, how can Audio Precision make their first Ap analyzer?

 

[metal571]

Nothing like a nice fresh coffee in the morning and a new DAC review from Amir. Unit looks promising, thanks.

 

[amirm]

Both Khadas and Sabaj sent the items in, it was not someone "discovering" them. It is not the right "ethic". Edit: But it would be ethical if they paid (significantly) for maintenance the site if they want to doublecheck their measurements.

I have had a ton, and I mean a ton, of requests to review the D5. People want to see things presented the way I do and compared identically to others. This is true even if the manufacturer publishes measurements. Theirs are usually with different settings, and are usually harder for people to understand.

From my point of view, to the extent a device is well-engineered, I am more than OK to promote it here. We need to encourage this kind of practice (equipment verified with measurements). And if our bit here creates sales, that is more than good in my book.

The above is the value these companies are after, not double checking their measurements. They want publicity for their well designed equipment and I see no reason to hold back on that. After all, their competitors are enjoying the same.

And oh, this unit was "discovered" by many members here and elsewhere. I was close to buying one due to that demand.

 

[amirm]

My point is simply: If I already know the results, there is no added value for us, nor for the mfr itself, other than getting publicity.

I did not know their measurements until just a couple of days ago when they sent me a dashboard view. And an IMD chart. There is no comparison to other products as I do. Nor the full suite of tests I do.

Also note that my tests are exploratory in nature. If there are issues I see, I investigate further.

Anyway, I have tested gear from other companies who have measured them themselves, and I will continue to do that. It is a win-win for consumers and manufactures and frankly us.

 

[amirm]

If I have access to an APX I wont send-in my gear until it measures perfect. But this is extremly unfair to those mfr/diy'ler who also are good engineers but have no access to the APX and send the gear neverthereless.

I offer such testing service for them for a fee. A couple of companies have reached out for me for that service although neither have gone through with it yet.

 

[amirm]

By the way, notice the discovery of warm-up performance increase in my testing. That would not be visible from any measurements from the manufacturer.

 

[escalibur]

@amirm How is the sound compared to 789 or Atom?

 

[amirm]

@amirm How is the sound compared to 789 or Atom?

Exactly the same except with high impedance headphones it doesn't get nearly as loud. As such, it lacks bass if you choose to listen at elevated levels I do for testing. WIth low impedance it is loud enough so no difference there that is material.

 

[AndrewDavis]

They say this:

View attachment 31046

Maybe it quickly gets to temp normally without a heatsink.

Thank you for investigating this, Amir.

A lot of my listening happens within 30 minutes of sitting at my desk. A two career household and a young family means a 60 minute listening session is a gold-plated luxury. So I would only realize the benefit of this DACa roughly half the time (probably more because warm-up:SINAD would be a curve, but still). This quirk diminishes the advantages of this unit for me substantially.

I'll stick with my d70. Both are probably transparent to my mediocre ears anyway.

 

[zym1010]

Thank you for investigating this, Amir.

A lot of my listening happens within 30 minutes of sitting at my desk. A two career household and a young family means a 60 minute listening session is a gold-plated luxury. So I would only realize the benefit of this DACa roughly half the time (probably more because warm-up:SINAD would be a curve, but still). This quirk diminishes the advantages of this unit for me substantially.

I'll stick with my d70. Both are probably transparent to my mediocre ears anyway.

You can buy some smart switch and let the unit on 30m before you arrive at home I suppose...

 

[maxxevv]

You can buy some smart switch and let the unit on 30m before you arrive at home I suppose...

Those are extremely useful in my experience.

On a warm day, you could remotely switch on the room fan or air conditioner to cool down the house before getting home.
Turn on/off the porch lights on schedule or even the lawn sprinkler based on temperature (tied to a smart thermometer that is) !

 

[wadec22]

Thank you for investigating this, Amir.

A lot of my listening happens within 30 minutes of sitting at my desk. A two career household and a young family means a 60 minute listening session is a gold-plated luxury. So I would only realize the benefit of this DACa roughly half the time (probably more because warm-up:SINAD would be a curve, but still). This quirk diminishes the advantages of this unit for me substantially.

I'll stick with my d70. Both are probably transparent to my mediocre ears anyway.

why not just leave the unit on all the time?