Review and Measurements of KORG DS-DAC-100

[Headphonaholic]

I think the problem is due to the single power input over USB. There is simply too much going on to get power from USB only.

I just wondered if they went usb for power to avoid international power issues? It sounds silly so perhaps unlikely but it probably does make it cheaper to make.

The original price was a lot higher from what I can find of old reviews:

View attachment 20162

Wow! Honestly considering that it's a company that makes pro gear it's not surprising that it would be so pricey. The performance however is not befitting of the price.

 

[bennetng]

true 1bit

True 1bit = Dishonest Sony Deception

 

[GGroch]

Its not. I believe the original price was $180-200.

According to Keepa Amazon price tracking.. the DAC 100 was released in January 2014 at $600, and gradually dropped to about $400 in January 2015.
I believe that some of the price was justified by the included full license to Korg's Audiogate software.

The lowest price available through Amazon hovered between $160-$135 in the 1st half of 2017...when I guess the remaining major stocks of big distributors were sold off, and as with many discontinued products, the price has risen since then to $400ish for remaining new stock now.

I also purchased a couple at the $150 price, and agree that it is one of the handsomest components I have owned. The included solid brass tripod spikes with sockets and all cast chassis are very classy. Made in Japan I think. I had a consistent problem of losing my USB connection when my Windows 10 desktop fell asleep...requiring the Korg to be turned off and on.

I think the performance in unbalanced mode is not bad for an early 2014 DAC. But more of a novelty item now.

Note that the MOBILE version of this DAC, the DS-DAC-100M with some similar features (but unbalanced only) is still available at a good price. $80 on Amazon and eBay. This comes with the same Audiogate License...and was also originally released in January 2014 at $400.

There is a quite positive 2016 review with measurements of the DS-DAC-100M here.

 

[DosThou]

Be interesting to see if adding usb powered hub would have any effect on devices like this.

Something like this:

 

[folzag]

I"m confused by the multi-tone test. It's not showing any of the spurious harmonics that the single tone tests show. I was expecting that to look horrible. It looks more or less like all the other multi-tone tests Amir has performed.

 

[graz_lag]

Be interesting to see if adding usb powered hub would have any effect on devices like this.

In fact I am powering my Korg DAC from the 2A socket out of a battery pack.

 

[amirm]

I"m confused by the multi-tone test. It's not showing any of the spurious harmonics that the single tone tests show. I was expecting that to look horrible. It looks more or less like all the other multi-tone tests Amir has performed.

The amplitude of the extra tones is similar to the distortion spikes so it doesn't change the overall envelop in multitone.

 

[Kyle / MrHeeHo]

I think the problem is due to the single power input over USB. There is simply too much going on to get power from USB only.

I just looked and their entire DS-DAC is designed like that

 

[solderdude]

Perhaps there is no jitter at 4kHz ?
I assume it is packet noise (8kHz) which is present in the SE signal (common mode noise) as it isn't there in the balanced mode where these cancel out.
The 16kHz could be harmonics or mirrored on 12kHz ?

 

[folzag]

The amplitude of the extra tones is similar to the distortion spikes so it doesn't change the overall envelop in multitone.

Sorry, I still don't understand. The single tone distortion spikes were at -100dB. In the multi-tone test, there were no distortion spikes, only the noise floor at sub -130dB.

Also, the distortion spikes did not correspond to any of the multi-tone frequencies, so they aren't being masked by test tones either. No?

Thx.

 

[PuX]

I got one for $135 new.

the original price was $600. and it is not a recent product, it was released about 5 years ago, which explains why it's a bit outdated.

the performance can't be explained that way though

my experience with it is the same:
- lack of power:
headphone out is very weak
but I expected the line out to be less than 2V because JDS Labs OL DAC seemed louder to me
- horrible drivers
although ASIO works reasonably well for me (until I skip too often and it crashes)
windows system sound can break if the frequencies don't match i.e. DAC is at 44.1k and the sound being played is at 48k

the real advantage of this DAC is that it can play DSD natively without DoP etc. I even managed to set it up to work in foobar2000.

I wonder how good the measurements would be without those suspicious spikes.

 

[bravomail]

Elvis and the choire:
We won't go on together
With suspicious spikes!

suspicious spikes.

 

[teej]

Ah, the it is/was a good deal! Did you buy it new for $100?

Yep - brand new. It may have been 120-ish.

 

[jsrtheta]

It comes with feet for the spikes which I didn't include when I sent it. I've been quite happy with the sound of this one, but I can def. see the power being lacking. Also it's the coolest-looking piece of gear I've ever owned.

Guess you missed out on the old Audio Innovations gear:

 

[graz_lag]

@amirm I have unscrewed the case of my unit, I attach the pics ... I keep it open for a while if someone is interested in additional pics ...

 

[rando]

I believe that some of the price was justified by the included full license to Korg's Audiogate software.

Note that the MOBILE version of this DAC, the DS-DAC-100M with some similar features (but unbalanced only) is still available at a good price. $80 on Amazon and eBay. This comes with the same Audiogate License...and was also originally released in January 2014 at $400.

Late last year I considered registering here to see if @amirm would be interested in testing a Korg DS-DAC-100m. Though this review only piqued my interest I will kindly ask he flush more meaningful items out of his overflowing queue.

After the requisite amount of research into where exactly the usable lower end for a mobile DAC exists. I ended up purchasing one for a Christmas gift. A few months early so I could run it through the paces and return if necessary. Overall I was (subjectively) satisfied enough to rebox and wrap it up (without pleas to rush a review and return shipping). The appeal was easy to fly with and being able to implement with portable speakers at the vacation destination. While still being long term usable in a domestic setting using their phone and laptop. Obviously the only intended headphone use was to be a few hours on a noisy plane. I bumped the outlay up another $10 for an Acoustic Research 3.5 to RCA cable and threw in a good thick USB cable without ferrites. Two cords (+OTG) and a modern smartphone sized metal DAC that will take some abuse is all it added to their clutter/carry on.

Somewhere(?) on a forum I came across a fairly in depth examination of the differences between 100 and 100m by someone who ultimately regretted purchasing the former. They were not kind enough to post their test results, but the result was reasonably assured that roughly $70 premium bought audio jewelry. It is attractive enough to display instead of hide unobtrusively.

Audiogate is a bit clunky and I'm fairly sure a look under the hood at upsampling would draw some uninspired commentary. Taken with the purchase price there is some worth there though. On top of that the ASIO driver is fairly robust and I had zero issues on W10.

 

[NewfieKayakHead]

Hello,

I am fairly new to DSD. What is curious is the volume control on AudioGate. It is digitally. I can understand PCM volume control by over sampling. I wonder if any one know how it is done digitally on DSD?

 

[Veri]

I can understand PCM volume control by over sampling.

Oversampling hasn't really got anything to do with volume control though? Unless you're thinking of digital bits overhead to loslessly control volume.

Anyway, if a DSD product allows volume manipulation you can deduce it is transcoded to PCM, basically. Example, RME ADI DAC, when using DSD the digital processing is off, if you want processing on it will be converted to PCM..

 

[NewfieKayakHead]

Thank you Veri. I was referring to lossless volume control using bits overhead.

Converting to PCM is what I suspect KORG does on their software, but will this remain lossless when it is converted back to DSD. Interestingly, for many classical music DSD recording, because of the increased headroom, the average level is about 6dB or so lower than the CD versions. KORG has a feature to normalize (increase) the volume. I try to ask their engineer to see if there will result in clipping, but I never got an answer back. What is your take on this?

 

[Veri]

Thank you Veri. I was referring to lossless volume control using bits overhead.

Converting to PCM is what I suspect KORG does on their software, but will this remain lossless when it is converted back to DSD. Interestingly, for many classical music DSD recording, because of the increased headroom, the average level is about 6dB or so lower than the CD versions. KORG has a feature to normalize (increase) the volume. I try to ask their engineer to see if there will result in clipping, but I never got an answer back. What is your take on this?

Yes several software/hardware players bump up the volume by 6dB to compensate for the DSD lower gain. I'm not technically versed enough to explain why this happens, or how this 6dB is compensated. Sorry! I just looked it up and this should be the explanation:
"Scarlett Book (SACD) specifications require that the input signal be limited to -6 dBFS (meaning, 6dB less dynamic range than the original signal)."

But I'm quite sure, in any proper design, it should not result in clipping no. It is merely compensating for a loss in volume.