Message to golden-eared audiophiles posting at ASR for the first time...

[antcollinet]

That is up to the person who is doing the buying to decide if it is necessary or not.

Yep, that is true. Each person must (and does with every purchase) decide for themselves.

That doesn't stop any of us expressing an opinion as to whether in our view the expense of a particular item is necessary. Especially if in so doing and in giving reasons, we can help someone else reach a more rational personal decision than they might otherwise.

 

[DavidEdwinAston]

That is up to the person who is doing the buying to decide if it is necessary or not.

Some people buy expensive entertainment with no tangible value because they have the money to spend. I have (some extra) money to spend and I not only unapologetically but also with pride spend it for reasons that I deemed necessary.

Perhaps your pride could tell you to give it to charity? Or Amir?

 

[Emlin]

Recent experiences since 2019 has taught us that we cannot always trust scientific papers and sites which publish those which are not peer reviewed, perhaps multiple reviews at that. It has now been proven that in today's world of unlimited money printing it is quite easy to sway anyone's opinion or research. After all, there must be engineers and scientists on this forum with several thousand man hours experience and research some of who might have valid different ideas to challenge everything, including spinorama or every other machine based measurement which might sway the public away from trusting the ultimate instruments of ears and brains which God has engineered.

If I were a God I wouldn't go around engineering ears out of the jawbones of lizards, but maybe that's just me.

 

[CleanSound]

Yep, that is true. Each person must (and does with every purchase) decide for themselves.

That doesn't stop any of us expressing an opinion as to whether in our view the expense of a particular item is necessary. Especially if in so doing and in giving reasons, we can help someone else reach a more rational personal decision than they might otherwise.

I think you're may have missed the earlier part of the conversation. I stated it is ok to buy snake oil, so long as you know it's snake oil. For example, I spend over $100 for a pair of Blue Jeans assembled Canares cables instead of $.75/ft Monoprice. I like the audio jewelry and I like the locking banana. And I know it won't improve sound.

So there are no opinions one can express that will "help" me with "rationale."

 

[CleanSound]

Perhaps your pride could tell you to give it to charity? Or Amir?

But how do you know if I don't already donate to charity? Or I don't donate to ASR? (After all, like you, I do have a Forum Donor badge next to me name.)

And why is it that I need to be the utmost altruistic person? Why can't I spend my own hard earn money on myself? Even if it's wasteful.

Not being confrontational, but just being thought provocative, what if I intentionally choose to be a "bad" person and not give to society and I am perfectly happy with it and can sleep extraordinary well at night? And do so with an extraordinary amount of pride?

 

[Deleted member 21219]

But how do you know if I don't already donate to charity? Or I don't donate to ASR? (After all, like you, I do have a Forum Donor badge next to me name.)

And why is it that I need to be the utmost altruistic person? Why can't I spend my own hard earn money on myself? Even if it's wasteful.

Not being confrontational, but just being thought provocative, what if I intentionally choose to be a "bad" person and not give to society and I am perfectly happy with it and can sleep extraordinary well at night? And do so with an extraordinary amount of pride?

Elon? Is that you, Elon?

Jim

 

[Ken1951]

That's one very long oxymoron...

And yet another addition to the Ignore list found.

 

[fpitas]

That's one very long oxymoron...

You're tactful. I was prepared to simply give the ASR uh-huh.

 

[CleanSound]

Elon? Is that you, Elon?

Jim

No, I would probably need to live few hundred million lifetimes to get that kind of wealth.

Oh, and I literally just made another purchase for some wasteful snake oil and would I like to publicly announce because of the beaming pride that I have in doing so instead of donating it to those less fortunate around the world.

 

[DavidEdwinAston]

But how do you know if I don't already donate to charity? Or I don't donate to ASR? (After all, like you, I do have a Forum Donor badge next to me name.)

And why is it that I need to be the utmost altruistic person? Why can't I spend my own hard earn money on myself? Even if it's wasteful.

Not being confrontational, but just being thought provocative, what if I intentionally choose to be a "bad" person and not give to society and I am perfectly happy with it and can sleep extraordinary well at night? And do so with an extraordinary amount of pride?

Not confrontational, just plain bizarre!
I'm sure we can both leave it at that.

 

[CleanSound]

Not confrontational, just plain bizarre!
I'm sure we can both leave it at that.

I'm not sure if that is any more bizarre then telling a stranger to donate to charity on a HiFi forum

 

[egellings]

Brutally, bluntly put. Now I have to read 149 pages!

The scales have fallen from my eyes! I can see clearly now.

 

[steve59]

Very precise. And after the first buy, we are ready to be conned absolutely similarly the next time, in a bigger shop, by a salesman wearing a more colourful tie, with a bigger brand, multiple x on the dollars spent. And bingo, we are back where we were at stage zero. We cannot bear to listen to the system. Eventually we even forget how to set it up again after it is taken apart once during the room cleaning up exercise, forgotten till such time as the next go out and buy better bug bites again.

Hopefully some of us learn from our mistakes.

 

[bigdewil]

Hello. I am 71 years old. I have been a member here for 10 days. my eyes opened. thank you.
This is my second entry here.

 

[CleanSound]

Hello. I am 71 years old. I have been a member here for 10 days. my eyes opened. thank you.
This is my second entry here.

Welcome. . .the one question I always ask, is there any science or the engineering that can explain the HiFi mystique presented, if not, then it's suspicious. Because in the 21st century, we know there is no such thing as magic or voodoo.

 

[bigdewil]

Welcome. . .the one question I always ask, is there any science or the engineering that can explain the HiFi mystique presented, if not, then it's suspicious. Because in the 21st century, we know there is no such thing as magic or voodoo.

I have been an admin on the audio forum for years. I find that people believe in magic. In fact, they are certain of it. Until now, I believed it too, although I had a few setbacks in the past, but it's good that I found this forum, so I won't die stupidly. )))

 

[Anton D]

Welcome. . .the one question I always ask, is there any science or the engineering that can explain the HiFi mystique presented, if not, then it's suspicious. Because in the 21st century, we know there is no such thing as magic or voodoo.

I gotta confess: turning 1s and 0s into Mozart or Miles still seems like magic.

Heck, just hearing my standard car radio let me listen to Tom Petty is voodoo.

Makes me feel lucky, for sure.

Cheers!

 

[Killingbeans]

Any sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from magic.
-Arthur C. Clarke

I was recently reminded of the difference between bottom-up and top-down processing.

It seems to me that bottom-up thinkers are drawn to this hobby like moths to a flame for some reason. They aren't necessarily stupid, but just allow stimulus itself to shape their perception, leaving a huge back door open to snake-oil and self delusion, and they don't really care.

That's why top-down thinkers like me can debate with them from now till hell freezes over, and nobody will move an inch.

 

[Gringoaudio1]

Any sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from magic.
-Arthur C. Clarke

I was recently reminded of the difference between bottom-up and top-down processing.

It seems to me that bottom-up thinkers are drawn to this hobby like moths to a flame for some reason. They aren't necessarily stupid, but just allow stimulus itself to shape their perception, leaving a huge back door open to snake-oil and self delusion, and they don't really care.

That's why top-down thinkers like me can debate with them from now till hell freezes over, and nobody will move an inch.

Hey there. Can you provide a citation for a description of these two types of processing/thinking? Thank you. I would like to understand it.

 

[Anton D]

Any sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from magic.
-Arthur C. Clarke

I was recently reminded of the difference between bottom-up and top-down processing.

It seems to me that bottom-up thinkers are drawn to this hobby like moths to a flame for some reason. They aren't necessarily stupid, but just allow stimulus itself to shape their perception, leaving a huge back door open to snake-oil and self delusion, and they don't really care.

That's why top-down thinkers like me can debate with them from now till hell freezes over, and nobody will move an inch.

Well, not everybody can be an Operating Thetan Level 8.