Looking for a decent entry DAC for desktop use

[Quexos]

Probably the right move on ANY budget. My personal thinking is that your budget (if you can) should be about 75% speakers, 20% amp, 5% DAC... realistically that means a budget of $2000 with a $100 DAC... but you get my point, speakers are the most important by far.

I do not disconcur! I congree! My speakers were built by my brother and designed by a bunch of 'audiophiles' on the partsexpress forums using highfalut'n meters and scopes to tune them for the specific drivers/tweeters/wood case used, and building a crossover board of actual components and coils that look like it was built in 1952. So, I can not put a dollar value to them, but I'd guess they will surpass nearly anything sold commercially for ~$1000+.

They are vastly superior to the rest of my system, but sound pretty darned good with the $37 SybaSonic + Fosi Audio V3. So my "budget" was $100 for DAC and Amp, with existing speakers. I am happy to have them, because I could never afford something of similar quality.

 

[kemmler3D]

vastly superior to the rest of my system, but sound pretty darned good with the $37 SybaSonic + Fosi Audio V3.

Yep, I think that's about how you want to do it. Even "bad" amps these days have lower noise and distortion than most people need to worry about. When it comes to DACs, even mediocre ones have been great for a long time. The main question is whether you have enough power for your needs, sounds like you do.

 

[Quexos]

The main question is whether you have enough power for your needs, sounds like you do.

More than enough. The drivers/tweeters in my speakers are only rated at 50w RMS, 100 Max and the Fosi V3 is 'stupid loud' at ~50-60% on the dial. I rarely turn it above 20-30% with the DAC/Pre at about 75%.

I have tested it out with the source being (at different times), onboard Realtek ALC1200, Xonar SE ($40) sound card, Focusrite 2i4 ($200) first gen, M-Audio M-Track Solo ($50), and the SybaSonic ($37), and the Amp being a Yamaha RX-V375 budget receiver, a SONY STR-DE945 old higher end receiver, a $30 FacMogu S800, and the $72 Fosi Audio V3, and pretty much all of them beyond the onboard Realtek (even that was not bad at all) sounded the same. I'd love to try some high dollar tube DAC/Amp, but just can't afford that sort of thing, but I expect it would be snake oil/placebo anyway.

 

[DSJR]

This cheapskate is very happy indeed with the SMSL SU1 - a cheap dinky box which I can hide, which performs very well, has a few inputs which the Topping D10S doesn't offer (I don't need the display) and which 'sounds' clean, clear and lets me hear 'into' the music tracks I play with ease.

Going higher, one could add variable balanced outs which may be very useful depending on the speakers used, a decent display and nicer casework may well appeal and going higher still, eq functions and so on could be considered. 'Sound Quality' should be largely taken for granted today as many of us have done comparisons, made conclusions only to have them changed or nulled by a proper level matched test which shows they actually sound the same and price has absolutely NOTHING to do with it unless the brain using all the senses available to it decides otherwise - 'eye-fi' rules in audio subjectivism, it really does

 

[FroNt]

Thanks for all of your guys inputs!

I have to admit, that i drew a parallel between Optical for Audio and Optical for Network, as in fiber optics. I did some research after you guys made me aware thats it's not a black and white choice and i'm still going with the Motherboard with Toslink-Out and simply try both out, but for my use case it will probably end up beeing a USB connection between PC and DAC.

As for the DAC, i've read great things about the Topping E30 II, but the remote only control is not my thing. For the SMSL SU1, as i understand i would need an extra amp.
Been thinking about settling for the SybaSonic SD-DAC63118 since it would probably be good enough for my use, but it seems a little cheap built, understandably.

So now i'm thinking about SMSL M300 SE or FiiO K11 and see now argument for me that weighs either stronger. K11 probably fits better on a desk, but thats all, audio seems to be great with both and i might reuse them once i move and get a proper listening setup with speakers.

I will keep looking in this thread, but even if no one has any more tips to consider i will report back once i've made a decision and have my stuff set up.

edit: As for headphones, i'm kinda steering away from HD560s and in the direction of Beyerdynamic, probably DT 770 Pro

 

[jooc]

Would the DAC X6 MKII mini be a good choice? Or might my budget be to small for a decent DAC?

I own the previous model of this ^ DAC (DAC X6) and bought this newer version for my brother for a small stack I built him (well, had shipped to him.) The headphone amp stage in these are very good for the price and these are pleasing to listen to HPs through.

If you want to use a HP amp in the actual amplifier instead, something close to 'DAC state of art' can be had for under $100 right now:

 

[m0nsieur]

If you get the HD560s they are efficient and easy to drive. I have the DROP + SENNHEISER PC38X which is a gaming headset based on the same drivers as the 560s. I use an Apple USB-C Dongle DAC (US version) and it has plenty of clean power to drive these. If your new PC doesn't have USB-C, then you can get a USB-A to USB-C converter/cable. Spend the rest of your money on music to enjoy.

The Apple dongle is ~10Euro. I think the non-US version is power limited (0.5Vrms) in comparison to the US version (0.9Vrms), but depending on how loud you want to go it may still be enough for you. I don't ever turn mine up above about 40%. Try it out and if you need more power try a different USB DAC.

Review: Apple vs Google USB-C Headphone Adapters

This is a review, detailed measurements and comparison of Apple's USB-C adapter to the current and last version of Google Pixel headphone adapters. The Apple adapter costs just $9 including one day shipping for free. The Google dongle costs $12. Not that any of these are large by any stretch...

www.audiosciencereview.com

Another suggestion: Meizu Mblu Lifeme (1.5Vrms)

Meizu Mblu Lifeme Pro Portable DAC/Amp Review

This is a review, listening test and measurements of the Meizu Mblu Lifeme portable DAC and headphone amplifier. It is on kind loan from a member and costs US $23. Not much to say about the form factor other than it terminates in 3.5mm unbalanced headphone connection. If you are not familiar...

www.audiosciencereview.com

 

[Daviede]

DE: SybaSonic SD-DAC63118
US: SybaSonic SD-DAC63118

Some may point and laugh at me, but I just got one of these for $37, and it's great so far via PC USB > SybaSonic DAC/preamp > Fosi Audio V3 amp > very nice home built speakers.

The optical/coax is output/passthrough only though, so this one is just USB input, but why use onboard sound drivers (I disabled mine in the BIOS) and all that just to get digital audio out to another device? Anyway, I find the audio quality to be as good as anything else I've heard (Focusrite 2i4, SONY STR-DE945 receiver, etc.)...keeping in mind, I've never owned $x,xxx tube amps, etc. though I suspect my speakers would surpass $1000 commercial stuff.

More info on the variations of this thing from what I could gather (I got #1 just in case that op-amp was better as reported):
#1 - Syba (sliver), model: SD-DAC63118, Op-Amp TI-LM4562 (better in theory)
#2 - Syba (black), model: SD-DAC63116, Op-Amp TI-LM358 (worse in theory?)
#3 - Syba (sliver), model: SD-DAC63057, Op-Amp TI-LM358 (worse in theory?)
#4 - NEOHIPO H1 (black, rebrand), presumably this is a "Syba #2" SD-DAC63116

All use DAC/ADC: C-Media CM6533?

I have seen this product and it seems that NEOHIPO has a DAC&headphone amp with the same appearance, which seems to be several dollars lower in price. The main feature is the excellent MIC function, which is similar to the FOSI AUDIO K5PRO function and parameters, but the price is only about half of it. However, for ASR members, the parameters are much lower. Looking at the comments and parameters, they are still good. Those who only care about the function and do not need extreme parameters can consider it

 

[Daviede]

I own the previous model of this ^ DAC (DAC X6) and bought this newer version for my brother for a small stack I built him (well, had shipped to him.) The headphone amp stage in these are very good for the price and these are pleasing to listen to HPs through.

If you want to use a HP amp in the actual amplifier instead, something close to 'DAC state of art' can be had for under $100 right now:

View attachment 340789

The SMSL SU1 is great, and I also bought one. Except for the need to press a few more times when selecting input mode, everything else is almost perfect. I don't need MQA. It would be even better to have a version that removes the MQA function and saves a few dollars in cost. Oh, I may ask too much, haha

 

[Quexos]

I have seen this product and it seems that NEOHIPO has a DAC&headphone amp with the same appearance, which seems to be several dollars lower in price. The main feature is the excellent MIC function, which is similar to the FOSI AUDIO K5PRO function and parameters, but the price is only about half of it.

Yep, that NeoHipo was $31 when I was shopping and it's clearly just a rebadged SybaSonic.
I was eyeballing the Fosi K5 Pro myself, until I read about how the EQ stage on it is BORKED! With the dials centered, the low and high ends are -5db, and if you try to correct it, it scoops the mids out by -5db! It WILL NOT do a flat EQ. Deal breaker, big time!

More on the SybaSonic. Mine has disconnected about 3 times in 2 weeks (reading the Amazon reviews, it's common). It just "disappears" in Windows, then comes back after a minute or so. Odd. I am going to try a better USB cable with a Ferrite Core in it for a while and see if that sorts it out, but full disclosure, it ain't behaving perfectly for me now. If it poopoos on me, I'll just use my onboard ALC1200 (it's really not that bad, if you believe the specs it's much better than the SybaSonic, but just doesn't sound as good) or one of my audio interfaces instead. I mainly wanted the Syba for the convenient mic input and a bit of pre-amp for the Fosi V3.

 

[Daviede]

Yep, that NeoHipo was $31 when I was shopping and it's clearly just a rebadged SybaSonic.
I was eyeballing the Fosi K5 Pro myself, until I read about how the EQ stage on it is BORKED! With the dials centered, the low and high ends are -5db, and if you try to correct it, it scoops the mids out by -5db! It WILL NOT do a flat EQ. Deal breaker, big time!

More on the SybaSonic. Mine has disconnected about 3 times in 2 weeks (reading the Amazon reviews, it's common). It just "disappears" in Windows, then comes back after a minute or so. Odd. I am going to try a better USB cable with a Ferrite Core in it for a while and see if that sorts it out, but full disclosure, it ain't behaving perfectly for me now. If it poopoos on me, I'll just use my onboard ALC1200 (it's really not that bad, if you believe the specs it's much better than the SybaSonic, but just doesn't sound as good) or one of my audio interfaces instead. I mainly wanted the Syba for the convenient mic input and a bit of pre-amp for the Fosi V3.

Yes, if the functions and parameters are the same or similar, I would choose a product that is more cost-effective.Maybe I will buy a NEOHIPO H1 and see how the product costs for a burger.

 

[Quexos]

More on the SybaSonic. Mine has disconnected about 3 times in 2 weeks (reading the Amazon reviews, it's common). It just "disappears" in Windows, then comes back after a minute or so.

I wound up getting a replacement and the new one has been perfect for four months so far. No problems, sounds great and built solid. It does not feel like a cheap plastic thing. It's actually kind of heavy. These Syba or Neohipo things are great for the price, assuming you're good with just plain old stereo sound and the in/outs provided on them. I like the fact they have mic inputs and headphone amp built in with the DAC. Nice for gaming w/coms or video call type stuff.

One thing I've noticed is the Neohipo claims Dolby/DTS support, and the Syba does not mention it. I do wonder if Neohipo has ordered they're own custom (improved?) version of these from Syba or if it's just a straight re-badge.

 

[TonyJZX]

Yes, if the functions and parameters are the same or similar, I would choose a product that is more cost-effective.Maybe I will buy a NEOHIPO H1 and see how the product costs for a burger.

you guys have $30 burgers?

i kid.. one thing I note is that these devices use MINI-USB which is pretty anachronistic but may give an idea as to age

the fact that the owner here says its drops in and out may annoy some

it depends how much you guys can tolerate janky electronics

i have the M300SE and its not jank at all given its $120 but i feel there must be something cheaper but just as good and doesnt waste money on stuff like XLR that most people dont have a use for

 

[Daviede]

I wound up getting a replacement and the new one has been perfect for four months so far. No problems, sounds great and built solid. It does not feel like a cheap plastic thing. It's actually kind of heavy. These Syba or Neohipo things are great for the price, assuming you're good with just plain old stereo sound and the in/outs provided on them. I like the fact they have mic inputs and headphone amp built in with the DAC. Nice for gaming w/coms or video call type stuff.

One thing I've noticed is the Neohipo claims Dolby/DTS support, and the Syba does not mention it. I do wonder if Neohipo has ordered they're own custom (improved?) version of these from Syba or if it's just a straight re-badge.

maybe

 

[Daviede]

you guys have $30 burgers?

i kid.. one thing I note is that these devices use MINI-USB which is pretty anachronistic but may give an idea as to age

the fact that the owner here says its drops in and out may annoy some

it depends how much you guys can tolerate janky electronics

i have the M300SE and its not jank at all given its $120 but i feel there must be something cheaper but just as good and doesnt waste money on stuff like XLR that most people dont have a use for

How about FIIO K11?