Legal fund for Reviewers/Erin?

[Hanson]

如果我误解了你，请道歉，但我不同意这一点：斯宾诺拉玛没有感觉或情绪。 Spinorama 结果是可重复的（在规格范围内）。我相信它符合客观衡量的标准。
Spinorama 结果可能无法完全表征演讲者的特征，我同意这一点，但这与客观与主观无关。

对不起，请允许我说一句题外话。我想知道图中的数据是怎么得到的。你能帮我吗？

 

[solderdude]

For the non English speaking folks:

Excuse me, but allow me to digress. I would like to know how the data in the graph is obtained. Can you help me?

I reckon, you should ask your question at Erin's audio corner (in English ?)
You posted at ASR and your question is about a completely different speaker the PSB Imagine B50 (which is your digress ?)

Both Amir as well as Erin use the Klippel NFS to obtain data (which can be shown in plots).
That's how data is obtained.

 

[TheBatsEar]

对不起，请允许我说一句题外话。我想知道图中的数据是怎么得到的。你能帮我吗

You should be able to see the tonality index referenced in the book by @Floyd Toole called "Sound Reproduction: The Acoustics and Psychoacoustics of Loudspeakers and Rooms". The guy mentions all the papers he got his knowledge from in detail. I suspect the people at Klippel read the same references.

Also it might be worth it to ask the guy that made the spinorama.org site, @pierre, it seems to me he sometimes shows tonality index for speakers measured without a Klippel NFS, he might be able to give you his math.
The code for the site is also in Github, maybe that helps as well:

GitHub - pierreaubert/spinorama: A library to display and compare spinorama (speakers measurements) graphs.

A library to display and compare spinorama (speakers measurements) graphs. - pierreaubert/spinorama

github.com

BTW, cheers @pierre, your work is very much appreciated.

I never put to much stock into the tonality index, add a subwoofer and the tonality index vastly changes. Add EQ and it changes as well. Maybe it should be split into low, mid, high tonality index. You could then compare mids and highs of the KEF R11 with the LS50, but ignore the lows.

For the non English speaking folks

I use firefox and find the "Simple translate" plugin to be useful. You highlight some text, click the symbol of Simple translates that appears near it, and it guesses the language and translates it for you.

Also, welcome to ASR @Hanson

 

[Hanson]

For the non English speaking folks:



I reckon, you should ask your question at Erin's audio corner (in English ?)
You posted at ASR and your question is about a completely different speaker the PSB Imagine B50 (which is your digress ?)

Both Amir as well as Erin use the Klippel NFS to obtain data (which can be shown in plots).
That's how data is obtained.

Sorry, my browser is translated into Chinese by default. It was translated into Chinese when I edited it in English and sent it out. Thank you very much for your reply!

 

[Hanson]

You should be able to see the tonality index referenced in the book by @Floyd Toole called "Sound Reproduction: The Acoustics and Psychoacoustics of Loudspeakers and Rooms". The guy mentions all the papers he got his knowledge from in detail. I suspect the people at Klippel read the same references.

Also it might be worth it to ask the guy that made the spinorama.org site, @pierre, it seems to me he sometimes shows tonality index for speakers measured without a Klippel NFS, he might be able to give you his math.
The code for the site is also in Github, maybe that helps as well:

GitHub - pierreaubert/spinorama: A library to display and compare spinorama (speakers measurements) graphs.

A library to display and compare spinorama (speakers measurements) graphs. - pierreaubert/spinorama

github.com

BTW, cheers @pierre, your work is very much appreciated.

I never put to much stock into the tonality index, add a subwoofer and the tonality index vastly changes. Add EQ and it changes as well. Maybe it should be split into low, mid, high tonality index. You could then compare mids and highs of the KEF R11 with the LS50, but ignore the lows.


I use firefox and find the "Simple translate" plugin to be useful. You highlight some text, click the symbol of Simple translates that appears near it, and it guesses the language and translates it for you.

Also, welcome to ASR @Hanson

First of all, thank you very much for your reply. It helped me a lot. I think it's going to take a long time to learn and I'm going to get into it right now

 

[DanielT]

Ha ha, check starting at 11:20 as Erin comments on resonances. What could he be referring to:

 

[jharkness]

I will say that any company that threatens to sue over a review in the land of freedom of speech does not deserve my business. I understand about the feet not being supplied but this should have been an "Excuse me. Did you not use the feet?? Can you please retest with the feet installed and re-edit your video?". Instead, we got a typical Karen response of threats and litigation vs discussion and resolve.

This should have been an "You were missing the feet to these speakers." - Tekton

"Feet? what feet?" - Erin

"The ones that were in the boxes. It would fix the issues you had. I can loan you a set. Please remove video until you re-test with feet. - Tekton

"Really? Did not get from the patron who loaned them to me. I'll take down video for now and re-evaluate once feet are installed? - Erin

"Thank you. The feet are on the way to you" - Tekton

Now, Tekton is also facing issues is defaming their credit and business by acting like an @ss and threatening a reviewer.

I am all for this Legal defence fund. Maybe Erin can counter sue for defamation of his character, potential loss of income from ads, and emotional distress.

 

[DLS79]

I will say that any company that threatens to sue over a review in the land of freedom of speech does not deserve my business. I understand about the feet not being supplied but this should have been an "Excuse me. Did you not use the feet?? Can you please retest with the feet installed and re-edit your video?". Instead, we got a typical Karen response of threats and litigation vs discussion and resolve.

This should have been an "You were missing the feet to these speakers." - Tekton

"Feet? what feet?" - Erin

"The ones that were in the boxes. It would fix the issues you had. I can loan you a set. Please remove video until you re-test with feet. - Tekton

"Really? Did not get from the patron who loaned them to me. I'll take down video for now and re-evaluate once feet are installed? - Erin

"Thank you. The feet are on the way to you" - Tekton

Now, Tekton is also facing issues is defaming their credit and business by acting like an @ss and threatening a reviewer.

I am all for this Legal defence fund. Maybe Erin can counter sue for defamation of his character, potential loss of income from ads, and emotional distress.

Could have been even simpler than that.

Can you plug the threaded holes with some 1/4-20 bolts from the hardware store and re-test the unit?

 

[welwynnick]

Could have been even simpler than that.

Can you plug the threaded holes with some 1/4-20 bolts from the hardware store and re-test the unit?

That.
Or even just a few bits of Blu-tack

 

[Victor Martell]

I will say that any company that threatens to sue over a review in the land of freedom of speech does not deserve my business.

Sincerely posting to improve my understanding - no controversy intended. Coming from a different country, it took me a bit to grok the concept of free speech in the US. Because free speech laws are different over there and (from what I understand) similar to many other countries, I had difficulty internalizing how it works here. Once I internalized the key part ("government shall not...") and put it together with how private endeavours are paramount, I finally understood.

My point and question is I think that mounting a free speech counterargument or a request for dismissal based on it to a possible Tekton lawsuit is improbable. With two private entities involved, they would let the issue run thru the court system with all the negative consequences possible, specially for the little guy.

Pls correct me if I am wrong

 

[DLS79]

My point and question is think that mounting a free speech counterargument or a request for dismissal based on it to a possible Tekton lawsuit is improbable. With two private entities involved, they would let the issue run thru the court system with all the negative consequences possible, specially for the little guy.

Read this, it will help.

Strategic lawsuit against public participation - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

 

[CedarX]

The TektonDesign “The Perfect SET 15” speaker has just been reviewed at Positive Feedback:

Tekton Design Perfect SET 15 Loudspeakers - Positive Feedback

Tekton Design Perfect SET 15 Loudspeakers

positive-feedback.com

It doesn’t say whether the review was solicited or not, or if their lawyers already sat down with Tekton’s ones to get a ‘win-win’, but I found the conclusion quite interesting: “They get my highest recommendation if what they offer fits your needs.”

So… the review is neither positive or negative, it’s up to the end-user: if the speaker offer nothing for me… I guess they are not recommended. But if they fit all my needs, they are highly recommended!

Is this the perfect anti-lawsuit ‘fine print’ statement that should be added to any review?

Example: reading these reviews at Positive Feedback gets my highest recommendation if what they offer fits your needs.

 

[amirm]

They are called "positive" feedback for a reason. They won't give negative feedback....

 

[MattHooper]

That magazine never met a tweak they didn’t love.

 

[Dialectic]

Against my better judgment, I pulled up the review, and the reviewer said he had the speakers for three years before publication of the review.

 

[Newman]

They are called "positive" feedback for a reason. They won't give negative feedback....

From the PF editorial philosophy page: "When we review equipment, we concentrate on gear and combinations of equipment that have something worthy to offer. ...If we work hard, but cannot find the "magic," then the gear is returned without review. ... We wish to tell our readers where the gold is, not where it ain't. Those seeking "trash 'em, gut 'em" reviews will find several other high end journals to be more helpful."

 

[MattHooper]

From the PF editorial philosophy page: "When we review equipment, we concentrate on gear and combinations of equipment that have something worthy to offer. ...If we work hard, but cannot find the "magic," then the gear is returned without review. ... We wish to tell our readers where the gold is, not where it ain't. Those seeking "trash 'em, gut 'em" reviews will find several other high end journals to be more helpful."

Seems fair enough for a publication to adopt that approach, and let the readers know up front.

I occasionally read and enjoy some reviews in positive feedback. I mostly get turned off at the amount of dubious tweaky stuff they review and promote. They are like your first stop for cable and tweak reviews.

 

[Soria Moria]

From the PF editorial philosophy page: "When we review equipment, we concentrate on gear and combinations of equipment that have something worthy to offer. ...If we work hard, but cannot find the "magic," then the gear is returned without review. ... We wish to tell our readers where the gold is, not where it ain't. Those seeking "trash 'em, gut 'em" reviews will find several other high end journals to be more helpful."

I would be fine with this if they were reviewing video games or books or movies or whatever. Not a bunch of phony scam products.

 

[CedarX]

From the PF editorial philosophy page: "When we review equipment, we concentrate on gear and combinations of equipment that have something worthy to offer. ...If we work hard, but cannot find the "magic," then the gear is returned without review. ...

Is the time to publish a review—or return the equipment—another “opportunity” for lawsuits?

This PF review was 3 years in the work… Some audio products are EOL by then! Whether we like PF or not, could Tekton sue them for not deciding to review their speakers for 3 years?

 

[amirm]

Whether we like PF or not, could Tekton sue them for not deciding to review their speakers for 3 years?

I can review a 50 year old car. It is none of company's business. As long as I don't mispresent the car as being brand new, I am OK.