how many DACs are out there?

[SoundGuy]

Your evidence on the results from DBT of various DAC's when listened to under tightly bias controlled conditions please.

I don’t work for you or report to you but you can always ask.

 

[Sal1950]

I don’t work for you or report to you but you can always ask.

You made the claims, it's only expected to provide the supporting evidence here.
Anybody can tell fairytales..

 

[pma560]

DACs do differ significantly but it won’t be material to you without the highest end front end - great speakers.

The speakers are Stirling LS3/5A V2,
I like them but I guess they're not "highest end"

 

[BDWoody]

I don’t work for you or report to you but you can always ask.

I'll ask too. Any evidence? We try to go more on evidence than anecdote around here.

You make a common claim, but one that has no backing with evidence.

 

[BDWoody]

I'm thinking it'd be the main DAC == best DAC == the one that goes into your best amplifier.

I have so many, and I doubt I could tell any from any others when playing music.

My main system uses JBL 708Ps that have a DAC built in if using a digital source, or my Denon receiver if sending analog. I'm sure both are far from SOTA numbers, but good enough to be transparent to me.

Topping D70 and SMSL M500 are probably my best measuring DACs, but they don't improve anything over anything else from what I've heard so far.

 

[HarmonicTHD]

The speakers are Stirling LS3/5A V2,
I like them but I guess they're not "highest end"

From reading, it appears to me that you might be slightly overthinking the task of choosing a DAC. I am with SIY, pick the one in the top10 or top20 list of this site which meet your feature requirements and which fits your budget or even keep your old one. Given the minute influence, if any at all, on sound from electronics (incl. the cables), money and effort is usually better spent on upgrading speakers, RoomEQ, even room treatment. Just some food for thought.

 

[pma560]

Thanks for all the feedback so far, very helpful

It is key that any new DAC sounds better than my current one (otherwise, what's the point, may as well keep my current setup).

Even though it wasn't a blind test, I did hear (/think (?)) that the Naim sounded better than the Dacmagic.

I wasn't so sure about the Arcam ST60 (which retails here at 1400 euros), and thought it maybe was worse than the Dacmagic.

The sales guy of course rated them in order of price

 

[Count Arthur]

The sales guy of course rated them in order of price

And likely, also in order of his commission.

As I understand it, all the DACs at the top end of Amir's review list will be sonically transparent, and idistinguisable from one another in a listening test. As such, you can buy according to the price you want to pay and the features you need, for example do you want balanced or single ended out, need a pre amp function, want a headphone amp etc.

I liked the latest Topping that Amir looked at: https://www.audiosciencereview.com/forum/index.php?threads/topping-dx7-pro-review-dac-hp-amp.36978/

I like the shape.

 

[Bob from Florida]

Thanks for all the feedback so far, very helpful

It is key that any new DAC sounds better than my current one (otherwise, what's the point, may as well keep my current setup).

Even though it wasn't a blind test, I did hear (/think (?)) that the Naim sounded better than the Dacmagic.

I wasn't so sure about the Arcam ST60 (which retails here at 1400 euros), and thought it maybe was worse than the Dacmagic.

The sales guy of course rated them in order of price

Most modern DACS test relatively well - if you look at the reviews here. There seems to be a trend in higher priced offerings not testing as well. However, as long as the noise floor is below our perception and dynamic range meets the 96 db of CD’s, I highly doubt a difference will be heard. My view is other things have greater significance.

1. Reliability - I don’t want to be bothered with returning items for repair.
2. Getting it fixed if it does break - what kind of service support is available?
3. Cost - is it reasonable?
4. Features - does it decode the files I use? Do I need a remote control to switch inputs or select phase?
5. Ease of use - plug and play or hours of bug and play.
6. Aesthetics - can I tolerate the looks?

That is how I looks at things and need to remember when I get an itch to change something.

 

[Trell]

I'm thinking it'd be the main DAC == best DAC == the one that goes into your best amplifier.

Like many I’ve lots of DACs but they are not interchangeable.

As an example: My best measurable DAC is the RME ADI-2 DAC FS that I use on my desktop for active monitors and headphones, but that one is of no use for my 5.2 setup in my living room where I use a 2015 model Denon AVR to watch movies and listen to multichannel music.

 

[Tom C]

I have so many, and I doubt I could tell any from any others when playing music.

My main system uses JBL 708Ps that have a DAC built in if using a digital source, or my Denon receiver if sending analog. I'm sure both are far from SOTA numbers, but good enough to be transparent to me.

Topping D70 and SMSL M500 are probably my best measuring DACs, but they don't improve anything over anything else from what I've heard so far.

Do you send AES to your 708’s?

 

[BDWoody]

Do you send AES to your 708’s?

I have, from a couple of different sources. Right now I am feeding analog outs from my receiver.

 

[Tom C]

DACs do differ significantly but it won’t be material to you without the highest end front end - great speakers.

At first, I thought you were joking. Because what you say simply isn’t true.

 

[pma560]

Found a few more through this forum: JDS Labs, TEAC, Lindemann, cocktailAudio, Emotiva

79 now

Found a few more DAC brands:
Henry Audio, Metrum Acoustics, Rega, Lyngdorf, RME, Marantz, Zappiti
(but the last one doesn't do standalone DACs it seems)

so a new total of 86
(https://the.dac.guide/dac_brands)

edit: and Rotel, Advance Acoustic, Burson (89)

more streamer-only brands are Sonoro, X-odos, Fusion Research, but maybe I should leave those out.

 

[Trell]

Found a few more DAC brands:
Henry Audio, Metrum Acoustics, Rega, Lyngdorf, RME, Marantz, Zappiti
(but the last one doesn't do standalone DACs it seems)

so a new total of 86
(https://the.dac.guide/dac_brands)

There are many DACs available but only a few DAC IC.

 

[MCH]

But if you need more than 2 channels, the long list gets really very short

 

[Trell]

But if you need more than 2 channels, the long list gets really very short

Yup, and audio interfaces becomes popular. Then there are AVR and AVP as decoding codecs along with copy protection is not what audio interfaces or multichannel DACs are good at.

 

[pma560]

edit: and Rotel, Advance Acoustic, Burson (89)

added Weiss, Prism Sound, Metric Halo (maybe more a studio brand?), Apogee, Exasound, miniDSP, ESI
so 96 now

it is now my theory there are 100 brands in the world selling DACs

 

[Jimbob54]

Are you only talking about standalone desktop/ rack devices sold for home hifi - the only function of which is to take a digital input signal, convert and output as analogue to an amp of some kind?

Or are you talking about any device that can convert Digital audio signal to Analogue - which would include, well, everything. But I am thinking particularly about mobile dac/amp dongles and devices. Thats a whole new world of brands if so.

Regardless, I am still not sure I understand why a list of brands that make DACs is particularly useful.

 

[pma560]

Are you only talking about standalone desktop/ rack devices sold for home hifi - the only function of which is to take a digital input signal, convert and output as analogue to an amp of some kind?

yes, home hifi only.
It basically came from me looking to buy a new DAC / streamer, so I wanted to know what was out there..
(a lot, it turns out)