Elac Debut Reference DBR-62 Speaker Review

[holbob]

I recently replaced my DBR62 with Kef R3, and as far as dynamics and slam go, the DBR62 trumps the R3.

 

[Benedium]

Also, I only just realised how beneficial it is to have a thick carpet/rug/mat on the floor between speakers and listener. For coaxial/concentric speakers, it can even prevent phase issues during auto room correction. I guess it's all about reflected sounds vs direct sounds.

 

[Boxermotor]

Purchased these recently based on Amir's speaker listening tests. I'm waiting for my custom speakers to be assembled (2 month lead time), so I needed a budget speaker option decent enough til I receive them.

They were disappointing to say the least. I listened to them on-axis only, as I do all my speakers, and without the tweeter grills. I do have the original Elac B6 speaker. I was driving them with the Benchmark AHB2.

My immediate impressions were the lack of rhythmic drive, dynamic punch and attack. Then the lack of treble energy which overall made these speakers sound extremely dull.

I went back to the measurements Amir took to see if I could identify the problem and I see it's scooped in the 2.5khz-4.2khz region:

View attachment 117771


This confirms the laid-back and undynamic character of the sound I was hearing. I do hear quite a bit of a muffled sound. Drum hits don't have the power they should so drum kits sound like they are caked in mud but you can clearly hear the hi-hats.

With typical studio recordings where a singer is front in center, I can hear the vocals more present above the rest of the mix. But the instruments around and behind the singer are too muddy, not well outlined. Veiled with a smearing of poo. Bass was also one-note and indistinct at times, with much too early roll-off.

They are an exceptionally smooth, rounded sound that would be great for elevator music, smooth jazz, a capella. They simply do not have the bite, buzz, bark, crispness, snap, attack and growl that is necessary for pop/rock recordings to "pop" out of the speakers for an engaging listen. I actually found the original Elac B6 to have more drive and energy.

I cannot recommend these speakers. If you want this kind of sound, you could save half your money and pick up a pair of the Elac Debut 2.0 B6.2s.

Hi, I just received a new pair of the ELAC DBR62's to replace my DB62's in a near-field setup and I have the same impression - boy, am I disappointed! Just for kicks, I bought a cheap speaker switcher and connected two Klipsch Reference Theater speakers and went back and forth between the two. Exentuated the dulness of the ELACs (I know the Klipsch speakers are bright to start off, but the soundstage was wider and crisper). I can't imagine 120 hours of burn-in will remedy. Selling the ELACs for sure...anyone want a new (minus one hour) DBR62's?

 

[Phidel]

Hi, I just received a new pair of the ELAC DBR62's to replace my DB62's in a near-field setup and I have the same impression - boy, am I disappointed! Just for kicks, I bought a cheap speaker switcher and placed two Klipsch Reference Theater speakers and went back and forth between the two. Exentuated the dulness of the ELACs (I know the Klipsch speakers are bright to start off, but the soundstage was wider and crisper). I can't imagine 120 hours of burn-in will remedy. Selling the ELACs for sure...anyone want a new (minus one hour) DBR62's?

Same here, I am using it at a distance of 2m and I can tell there is something missing from its sound. Maybe the explanation is in RobS's post, identifying the problem in the 2.5kHz-4.2kHz region, I don't know, but I'm disappointed with the DBR62 sound. They lack rhythm and dynamism everywhere, what a disappointment.

 

[Pilot]

I don't know how accurate might be the source but they measure significant stifling by the grilles:

 

[frki16]

Purchased these recently based on Amir's speaker listening tests. I'm waiting for my custom speakers to be assembled (2 month lead time), so I needed a budget speaker option decent enough til I receive them.

They were disappointing to say the least. I listened to them on-axis only, as I do all my speakers, and without the tweeter grills. I do have the original Elac B6 speaker. I was driving them with the Benchmark AHB2.

My immediate impressions were the lack of rhythmic drive, dynamic punch and attack. Then the lack of treble energy which overall made these speakers sound extremely dull.

I went back to the measurements Amir took to see if I could identify the problem and I see it's scooped in the 2.5khz-4.2khz region:

View attachment 117771


This confirms the laid-back and undynamic character of the sound I was hearing. I do hear quite a bit of a muffled sound. Drum hits don't have the power they should so drum kits sound like they are caked in mud but you can clearly hear the hi-hats.

With typical studio recordings where a singer is front in center, I can hear the vocals more present above the rest of the mix. But the instruments around and behind the singer are too muddy, not well outlined. Veiled with a smearing of poo. Bass was also one-note and indistinct at times, with much too early roll-off.

They are an exceptionally smooth, rounded sound that would be great for elevator music, smooth jazz, a capella. They simply do not have the bite, buzz, bark, crispness, snap, attack and growl that is necessary for pop/rock recordings to "pop" out of the speakers for an engaging listen. I actually found the original Elac B6 to have more drive and energy.

I cannot recommend these speakers. If you want this kind of sound, you could save half your money and pick up a pair of the Elac Debut 2.0 B6.2s.

last sentence totaly not true! I did that and finally got dbg62. debuts get sucked from distorted highs and if you not too drunk you can’t listen them long

 

[Bernard23]

Either this is an interesting observation of the different subjective response to a measurable characteristic, or another overblown hyperbole storm!
I'm always sceptical of the subjective evaluation that uses phrases like night and day, huge change etc etc. They're rarely that significant, but serves to highlight how meaningless a subjective review is when attempting to share data. Lots of buyers (me included) find them to be dynamic, hard hitting, punchy etc etc. Bit laid back in the upper mids, but fine for rock, EDM any genre really.
Of course we can't compare in room responses, so there's a big unknown, but it would appear from the different reactions that there is a difference in different people's sensitivity to the FR profile. Works for me, not for you. Doesn't make them bad, doesn't make them good. But they measure how they measure, so you could make a future purchase decision based on a correlation of the measured data and what you hear.

Out of interest, have you tried correcting with EQ?

 

[Boxermotor]

Either this is an interesting observation of the different subjective response to a measurable characteristic, or another overblown hyperbole storm!
I'm always sceptical of the subjective evaluation that uses phrases like night and day, huge change etc etc. They're rarely that significant, but serves to highlight how meaningless a subjective review is when attempting to share data. Lots of buyers (me included) find them to be dynamic, hard hitting, punchy etc etc. Bit laid back in the upper mids, but fine for rock, EDM any genre really.
Of course we can't compare in room responses, so there's a big unknown, but it would appear from the different reactions that there is a difference in different people's sensitivity to the FR profile. Works for me, not for you. Doesn't make them bad, doesn't make them good. But they measure how they measure, so you could make a future purchase decision based on a correlation of the measured data and what you hear.

Out of interest, have you tried correcting with EQ?

Maybe I got a bad pair, but after comparing with the DB62's, JBL 308P MKII's, and even little Klipsch Theater Pack speakers, the DBR62's sounded poor (I mean really poor - muddy, even). Listening to some of Amir's test tracks, and my go-to classical, rock, bluegrass, and Celtic mixes it sounded like listening through a down comforter and not in the forth row at a concert hall. Dull and muted detail across the spectrum, especially mid-range.

I'm thinking of biting the bullet and trying the Revel M106's. Not sure if they're a good near field option, though.

 

[Benedium]

Maybe I got a bad pair, but after comparing with the DB62's, JBL 308P MKII's, and even little Klipsch Theater Pack speakers, the DBR62's sounded poor (I mean really poor - muddy, even). Listening to some of Amir's test tracks, and my go-to classical, rock, bluegrass, and Celtic mixes it sounded like listening through a down comforter and not in the forth row at a concert hall. Dull and muted detail across the spectrum, especially mid-range.

I'm thinking of biting the bullet and trying the Revel M106's. Not sure if they're a good near field option, though.

Pictures of the room and speaker placement/isolation? Also after a year with dbr62, I tried Polk S20 which were just too bright for me. So pretty sure our hearing or taste is a moving target. So maybe give it more time and experiment with placement or in a different room?

 

[Bernard23]

Maybe I got a bad pair, but after comparing with the DB62's, JBL 308P MKII's, and even little Klipsch Theater Pack speakers, the DBR62's sounded poor (I mean really poor - muddy, even). Listening to some of Amir's test tracks, and my go-to classical, rock, bluegrass, and Celtic mixes it sounded like listening through a down comforter and not in the forth row at a concert hall. Dull and muted detail across the spectrum, especially mid-range.

I'm thinking of biting the bullet and trying the Revel M106's. Not sure if they're a good near field option, though.

Worth returning as faulty?

 

[Boxermotor]

Pictures of the room and speaker placement/isolation? Also after a year with dbr62, I tried Polk S20 which were just too bright for me. So pretty sure our hearing or taste is a moving target. So maybe give it more time and experiment with placement or in a different room?

I agree, very subjective when it comes to preference. Here's my office/studio setup:

Speakers are 67.5" apart, set at 60 degrees, focus slightly behind my head. Ideally front ported speakers because of proximity to the front wall.

 

[Boxermotor]

Worth returning as faulty?

I did initiate a return. Now the question is, do I try another pair or get something else...? I feel a bit gun shy with ELAC now, although I really liked the DB62's. Definitely not as good as the JBL 308P studio monitors.

 

[Bernard23]

Straight off that's much more inert than my room. Pretty sure AJ designed these for an average listening room, rather than one specifically treated?

I have to apply this for my room, which is an approximation using my ears and a handheld dB meter, but it's an improvement over standard. I have a sub set at 45Hz. At 80+dB parts of my room furnishings are rattling, I have some big bass resonances going on, the sub is set to a low volume, barely operating.

 

[cavedriver]

I found the speakers "recessed" near the crossover, not as bad as you describe but I have no reason to think I got a bad pair and was A/B'ing them against about 7 other pairs at the time. I would expect another pair to be similarly, if perhaps less, disappointing. That said, I also don't have any alternatives to offer. I moved up in price after coming to the conclusion that none of the ones in that range that I tested were satisfactory.

 

[Boxermotor]

Straight off that's much more inert than my room. Pretty sure AJ designed these for an average listening room, rather than one specifically treated?

I have to apply this for my room, which is an approximation using my ears and a handheld dB meter, but it's an improvement over standard. I have a sub set at 45Hz. At 80+dB parts of my room furnishings are rattling, I have some big bass resonances going on, the sub is set to a low volume, barely operating.

You're inspiring me toward my next project - learning the science of DSP and what to use to adjust equalization. Some have suggested miniDSP with Durac Live.

 

[Bernard23]

I did initiate a return. Now the question is, do I try another pair or get something else...? I feel a bit gun shy with ELAC now, although I really liked the DB62's. Definitely not as good as the JBL 308P studio monitors.

If it were me, something else. I know not comparable, but I've got some krk rokit 5s on my office desk. They sound pretty good for what they are, but out in a big wide room and not near field they're pretty uninspiring. The debuts weren't designed as a near field monitor, so the compromises in design will be different perhaps? You'd imagine that the wave guide is unimportant, the enclosure resonance more obvious, less room interaction generally, yet that's what it was designed for with whatever compromises that that required?
Im guessing as I'm not an acoustic engineer, just some theories.

 

[Benedium]

Since room is acoustically so good, then maybe try less or zero toe in? It's in all the elac manuals. Also level matched?

 

[TheBatsEar]

I did initiate a return. Now the question is, do I try another pair or get something else...? I feel a bit gun shy with ELAC now, although I really liked the DB62's. Definitely not as good as the JBL 308P studio monitors.

Bro, you need to measure the heck out of them as long as they are still there.

If you don't, you will never know if they where defective or you where just accustomed to your previous Klipsch so much, you couldn't handle precise speakers anymore.

 

[Bernard23]

You're inspiring me toward my next project - learning the science of DSP and what to use to adjust equalization. Some have suggested miniDSP with Durac Live.

I'm trying to work out what's the most cost effective solution too. A one off investment is just that, once you've set your room, unless you keep moving stuff around in your house, it's going to spend a lot of time in a cupboard. I've been looking at hiring some room correction stuff, but that's aimed at pro / industrial users and whilst comprehensive is prohibitively expensive, so Roon and LF sweep test tracks with the verbal Fr callouts for the time being. I use a £20 dB meter from amazon, its uncalibrated, no idea of its accuracy but its better than my ears above 500Hz. Below that I'm sure it's sensitivity drops right off, so I use my ears, it's pretty obvious when your room lights up.

EDIT - OT, but what's the avatar? I've owned a couple of boxers years ago, both from Italy.

 

[Boxermotor]

If it were me, something else. I know not comparable, but I've got some krk rokit 5s on my office desk. They sound pretty good for what they are, but out in a big wide room and not near field they're pretty uninspiring. The debuts weren't designed as a near field monitor, so the compromises in design will be different perhaps? You'd imagine that the wave guide is unimportant, the enclosure resonance more obvious, less room interaction generally, yet that's what it was designed for with whatever compromises that that required?
Im guessing as I'm not an acoustic engineer, just some theories.

Okay, you have me rethinking powered monitors (I'm going to expose myself to ridicule here, but I didn't like reaching behind and turning them on and off every day and occasionally moving the speakers off angle). A few weeks back I won an eBay auction for a pair of Rokit 8 G4's, but the seller flaked out and didn't send them (I don't think he liked my winning bid of $225 - dang!). I may try finding some again since they're a basic DSP solution and have good reviews. I also can solve the on/off switching annoyance by using a desktop power conditioner.