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ELAC Debut 2.0 B5.2 Bookshelf Speakers too boomy please test

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Audioordeal

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What are the room dimensions (width, length)? I'm also curious about "front ports are behind the monitor". It would help us understand your arrangement if you post photos.
I've attached a photo of my limited space situation for better understanding, wanted to avoid comments about placement since there's not much I can do besides tear down the wall and expend to my neighbors flat which probably won't go unnoticed. :D
 
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Audioordeal

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Well, you mentioned it was at medium to high volume that it was boomy. A 5.25 inch driver is just not going to reproduce what you want. Getting a sub will easily fix your problem and you can cross your sub over at 100 to 120hz if that is available. You need to kill the low bass going to the 5 inch driver and send it all to the sub. You are within a whisker of fixing your problem. Good Luck!

Update: "bass heavy songs don't sound as they should", you just nailed the problem. It is exactly what I mentioned. Luckily it is an easy fix. Now, which sub do want? :)
Thank you for encouraging words that's what I wanted to hear... there is still hope. I'll probably buy a SVS sub and set it to 80hz or higher and it will hopefully be a sub 1000€ sub:D. Speakers can shake the whole room almost as well than the sub from 5.1 system but you are probably right about the relatively small driver. Thank you for your comment.
 
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Audioordeal

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Erin's review identifies some issues with this speaker.
I did not encounter 'boomy' bass when I tried a pair. Mine were over 4 ft from the front wall, with a sub. The crossover peak was, to me, quite obvious.
Thank you for your comment I'll watch this video again, better placement could help but it's not possible for my use case.
 
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Audioordeal

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Interesting. Since we have the data I'm sure someone could figure out an EQ to somewhat improve the situation. Based on what I'm seeing I would eyeball an EQ at 100hz with Q=2 and start with -3dB.
Thank you for the suggestion I have though about trying to remove the lower frequencies with EQ but I haven't so far and am not familiar with how the software works, I have tried a recommended profile for this speakers in Equalizer APO but I'm not certain if I listened to the tracks with it so it's on to do list. Hopefully a sub will fix this problem and I'll try your settings when I find the time and will.
 
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Audioordeal

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Your English is fine! My reading comprehension (or, more likely, my attention span) may have been a problem, though!

Both of the measurements quoted above may relate to your "issue". I understand that you're constrained by the space available to you but, for testing purposes, try increasing both distances and see what, if any effect it has.

Why do you have the loudspeakers upside down?

EDIT: In full disclosure -- I had a pair of these for a while and tried many different things with them -- but I was never very pleased with the way they sounded.
I never felt they were boomy though.
I only used them well away from the side or back walls in my (moderately large) listening room.
Looks like my reply didn't go where it should so I'm posting it here instead sorry for the confusion, figuring out how this forum works or should work.

I'll try a different position eventually, I'm taking many breaks from testing and researching to keep my sanity and when I find the time I'll give it a try.
They are upside down because the PC monitor is in front of them and would cover the twitter and it seemed better that it covers the port... there's about 5 cm of space between port and monitor. That is why I'll probably switch to Kef with tweeter in the acoustic center of the mid-bass cone... monitor won't cover anything important.
Thank you for sharing your experience with this speakers. Perhaps boomy isn't the best way to describe what is happening but it is very unpleasant sound and something isn't right sound is decent most of the time but bass heavy songs don't sound as they should. Glad that someone else didn't find them as great as the internet seems to think, they have potential but after a lot of tinkering I'm not convinced they are worth keeping.
 

pseudoid

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You are going to hate me for being the MoPO (Master of Painfully Obvious) in the crowd, but I am not going to suggest you get a new flat!;)
I notice that your current setup seems to have a 2nd monitor [24"?] to the right of the right Elac.
Voila! You just found more room than you are showing us... which expands the possibilities
wanted to avoid comments about placement since there's not much I can do
At worst you can get a single - but a larger - monitor to replace current two.
Then, you may possibly be able to upright the Elacs properly, where your tweeters level-ish w/your ears. Probably at about your "eye-level" at the center of new monitor.
This will allow the placement of the Elacs on sides of monitor which will locate them to get better stereo/center effect.
 
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Audioordeal

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You are going to hate me for being the MoPO (Master of Painfully Obvious) in the crowd, but I am not going to suggest you get a new flat!;)
I notice that your current setup seems to have a 2nd monitor [24"?] to the right of the right Elac.
Voila! You just found more room than you are showing us... which expands the possibilities

At worst you can get a single - but a larger - monitor to replace current two.
Then, you may possibly be able to upright the Elacs properly, where your tweeters level-ish w/your ears. Probably at about your "eye-level" at the center of new monitor.
This will allow the placement of the Elacs on sides of monitor which will locate them to get better stereo/center effect.
I have 2x 32" monitors which I use for work and occasionally share the second one with girlfriends PC and no I can't remove one and can't place them higher than they are, at least not high enough that they wouldn't cover a part of speaker.

Originally wanted to place them on the sides so that each one would double as monitor stand but that way I wouldn't be in the middle which isn't a good option either.

One bigger monitor wouldn't work for two PCs at the same time and wouldn't be cheap either.

Thought about placing the amp somewhere else but it's not exactly tiny and I'm using the volume dial often so it's a good position.
 

Penelinfi

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Tbh, trying to avoid comments about placement is like you avoiding mentioning boominess. Placing speakers in a tri-wall corner is how you get the most boominess.

Is it possible to somehow mount the speakers above the monitors? You may need to angle the tweeters towards your ear.

Equaliser APO and PEACE GUI will help you; you can use szynalski tone generator to play a sine tone to identify major bass resonance, then use equaliser to add a notch at that frequency; maybe try -7dB and q5 as a start.

If adding a sub, would still be good to use equaliser APO.

Could possibly try an amp like the Fosi ZA3 or similar to get a smaller footprint if that's an issue, and you'll still have the physical volume control.

You could also use headphones. I use equaliser APO with them too.

Not sure on budget but isn't that Kali desktop system good for this kind of situation?
 
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dfuller

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20240120_194853.jpg
Found your problem - this is about as non-optimal as placement can get. They're boomy from desk bounce and there's no high end because you're way off axis from the tweeters.
 
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Update: Somehow figured out how to use Equalizer APO and sounds like problem is around 100 hz to 130 hz if I lower points on graph in that range the problem is "fixed".

My question is is it normal to set low pass filter on the sub once I buy one to around 130 hz or is it to high?

I'll eventually buy other speakers, most likely Kef LS50, but I'm not sure if I should keep these speakers or return them while I still can. Thank you everyone for your contributions.
 
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Audioordeal

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Tbh, trying to avoid comments about placement is like you avoiding mentioning boominess. Placing speakers in a tri-wall corner is how you get the most boominess.

Is it possible to somehow mount the speakers above the monitors? You may need to angle the tweeters towards your ear.

Equaliser APO and PEACE GUI will help you; you can use szynalski tone generator to play a sine tone to identify major bass resonance, then use equaliser to add a notch at that frequency; maybe try -7dB and q5 as a start.

If adding a sub, would still be good to use equaliser APO.

Could possibly try an amp like the Fosi ZA3 or similar to get a smaller footprint if that's an issue, and you'll still have the physical volume control.

You could also use headphones. I use equaliser APO with them too.

Not sure on budget but isn't that Kali desktop system good for this kind of situation?
Thought about mounting them above the monitors but it's not exactly simple if anything I might tilt them back a little if I ever want to point them to ear level but I lowered my head for a test and it's not bad the way it is in my opinion.

Looks like I'll have to play more with Equalizer APO and get a sub. A few minutes ago I posted a comment that problematic region is from 100 hz to 120 hz.

Speakers are a bit power hungry and amp is most likely good am not planing to switch it anytime soon.

I don't like headphones only use them in the office occasionally and watch movies with girlfriend on same setup.

Read all about monitor speakers and decided they aren't for me if you wrote about Kali speakers. Thank you for your comment and time.
 

pseudoid

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I'll eventually buy other speakers, most likely Kef LS50, but I'm not sure
You admit you really don't have the room but thinking of KEF LS50...:facepalm:... how about trying something like the smaller KEF LSX2s concentric?
ADD: KEF even makes wall mounts for them.
Tbh, trying to avoid comments about placement is like you avoiding mentioning boominess. Placing speakers in a tri-wall corner is how you get the most boominess.
Is it possible to somehow mount the speakers above the monitors? You may need to angle the tweeters towards your ear.
imo @Penelinfi has a great reply for your dilemma.^^
Perhaps shelving above the monitors is worth contemplating.
 
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Audioordeal

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Found your problem - this is about as non-optimal as placement can get. They're boomy from desk bounce and there's no high end because you're way off axis from the tweeters.
I'm well aware it's not optimal but it's the best I can do with space I have. Might tilt them so that tweeters point higher but I've lowered my head to test and sound is ok for a non audiophile. For the boomy sound in 100 to 130 hz range a sub should help.
 
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Audioordeal

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The Kali unf. It's built with setups like yours in mind and has switches built in to compensate (not sure how well it works, but it's something)
Might need to get a USB volume control knob thingy or get one on your keyboard

https://www.kaliaudio.com/in-unf

Kali_Audio_IN_UNF_Setup_With_Monitor_Horizontal_Bass_Unit_800.jpg
Thank you for the recommendation I'll check it out but don't thing that's what I'm looking for.
 
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Audioordeal

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You admit you really don't have the room but thinking of KEF LS50...:facepalm:... how about trying something like the smaller KEF LSX2s concentric?
ADD: KEF even makes wall mounts for them.

imo @Penelinfi has a great reply for your dilemma.^^
Perhaps shelving above the monitors is worth contemplating.
KEF is actually smaller and is concentric so monitors wouldn't cover anything and I could just tilt it a bit so believe it or not it is a good option for me.

Read enough threads about LSX2 problems, not looking for expensive powered speakers that tend to die in 2 years time especially now that I have a decent apm.

Tried powered Triangle Elara LN01A and it didn't go well, for starters someone forgot to connect a connector in one of the speakers so I actually repaired them before even testing them.

Sure I'll just mount them above the monitors and tilt them at 45 degree that will look great and so what if I cover the little part of windows that is left.
 

Penelinfi

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Seems like you don't need any help as you've got it all figured out .

I read all about that King beds are fantastic to sleep on but can't understand why it's not comfortable when I use it inside my wardrobe
 
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Audioordeal

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Seems like you don't need any help as you've got it all figured out .

I read all about that King beds are fantastic to sleep on but can't understand why it's not comfortable when I use it inside my wardrobe
I did get some helpful pointers for which I'm grateful and some less helpful suggestion, for example buy a new flat, replace the amp that you just bought and is the best and biggest investment into decent setup so far.

King bed would be just as comfortable inside a walk in wardrobe as it is in on the floor and if you are looking for a comfortable bed try natural lateks.

Is one suppose to not have a mind of his own and just do whatever someone recommended in comments?

Concept of limited space shouldn't be to hard to grasp even if ones garage is as big as my flat and should I be sorry for trying to make the best of what I have?

Anyway for anyone following I'll buy a sub, set sub and speaker filters properly, EQ the frequencies around 125-130 hz and it should be fine, later I'll probably invest in Kef LS50.

Thanks again to everyone that helped even to those that weren't really helping.

If you are facing similar problems this video should help you pinpoint the problematic frequency range, 120 to 130 hz seems to be common range for the boominess I was describing.
 

Zek

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Anyway for anyone following I'll buy a sub
If you can, try sub first, then decide if you need it or not.
You will probably place the sub under the table and again in the corner, so it may happen that you get even more boom.
 
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