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D&D 8c / Buchardt A700

VintageFlanker

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You are making claims about a different product which actually does have more amplifier power with 4x150W instead of the 3x150W for the A500.
Actually, it's quite the opposite: 3X150W to feed three drivers equals more power per driver than 4X150W to feed six...

And as I said before, it's exactly the same backplate from Platin. Just one of the channel is not used with the A500.
 

PKAWA

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Actually, it's quite the opposite: 3X150W to feed three drivers equals more power per driver than 4X150W to feed six...

And as I said before, it's exactly the same backplate from Platin. Just one of the channel is not used with the A500.
So does it, or does it not have more power available? It might be the same backplate but it uses more power. 6 drivers at 600 watt vs 3 drivers at 450 watt so no not the same power, and yes that's less per driver obviously.
The A700 has two cardioid tunings that the A500 doesn't have. It could use that 600 watt completely different than the A500 uses the 450.
I'm sceptical too as I've been saying, I would like actual data too.
But keep going with the gifs, you seem nice.
At least I don't buy the same flawed product twice and brag about it online.
If they don't measure up to what is claimed my A700's will get send back to Buchardt audio and I will have some actual experience with them.
Where are your measurements? As far as I can see there's the one's from Napier lopez which are quite extensive.
 
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Chromatischism

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- So far, I demonstrated how the Buchardt DSP work with low end extension, and that according to the manufacturer's data. I verified the claimed "25Hz" in-room, as I also verified that past 90dB/1M, the low end will collapse, whatever you want to believe. And that applies to the A700 as well: Why? Because SB Acoustics 6" paper cone drivers cannot handle 17Hz at 90dB+/1M. Not with A500, nor with A700. Using five of them in a bigger enclosure won't do that much better either... The limitation there will be amplification before the drivers excursion: You got three more drivers to feed with the exact same power. How that may be a thing? I sure may be proved wrong, but I need data to do so. I want to see this "17Hz at 93dB". Until then, I don't believe it. Period.
If I can get flat to 25 Hz in room with the S400, certainly the A500 can do it. In a larger room, the 33 Hz spec is more realistic. I would agree that 90-95 dB is the limit as well, in room at 3M. Don't forget you get room gain to help with efficiency. The interaction with the room is as much a part of the design intent of these speakers as anything else.
 
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abdo123

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The 8C will deliver much higher output, thanks to its Pascal modules and 8" drivers.

The A700 sure looks big in pictures! I did not realize it has 6" woofers all around. the Dutch & Dutch 8C is already mid-range limited, The A700 should suffer with that sooner.

Yet again the A700 is half the price....
 

Wicky

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It's not. WISA/Hub on Buchardt A series is a total mess. Avoid. They still sound stellar wired, tho. I've now paired my A500 with Matrix Mini Pro i3 and I only began to enjoy using my speakers since."

I've also got the A500's with the Platin WISA hub. In my experience everything has worked perfectly. I'm going coax in via a streamer but also tried chromecast & airplay. The latter two options not so much but via a separate streamer I've not had any issues at all. I do understand from their forum that some owners have experienced dropouts and other issues. I'm still not sure why there are different experiences with these as I would have thought the main variable here was the software?

Anyway, I'm hoping given time Buchardt will sort these issues out and work on some of the new features they've been promising!
 

richard12511

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If I can hijack the thread... I'm looking into a700 or d&d 8c exactly because I can't add subs. Listening distance 2.5m to 3m, room width 5m ceiling 4.5m, behind listening position 5m space that opens to one side.
I think bots systems should be great, what I want to know is if a700 is as refined as d8.

Erin was able to get the 8c to 105dB at 4m, so 2.5m I would expect them to be the better speaker, mainly due to the much lower directivity control. Whether it’s 5k better is more of a personal decision. I wouldn’t worry about volume for either though at 2.5m.
 
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muslhead

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I have both the a500 (not 700) and the dutch 8cs.
@VintageFlanker's comment are spot on wrt to the platin hub and its power and the flaky nature of its performance.
Ignore him at your own risk. I was in the first shipment of the a500's and mine still dont have the original problems of paring, skipping and playing full range fixed.
Mads is a great guy and is excellent at audio marketing ... meeting promises, commitments and schedules. Not so much.
 

VintageFlanker

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Whether it 5k better is more of a personal decision. I wouldn’t worry about volume for either though at 2.5m.
I wouldn't either.;)
A700 is sure a great active speaker for the price. There are just some limitations that cannot go over physics. That's about it.
@VintageFlanker's comment are spot on wrt to the platin hub and its power and the flaky nature of its performance.
Ignore him at your own risk.
Trust be told: I actually love to listen to my music with A500s every day. Exceptional speakers, but terrible "finished" product. Glad @Wicky had no issue with his Hub.
Mads is a great guy
No doubt. He has always been responsive, arranging and helpful.:)
meeting promises, commitments and schedules. Not so much.
That is the biggest issue with this company. Constant promises and new products announcements, yet they still have to finish/fix the actual range. I'm still waiting for the "very soon" part of:
"The 5 seconds auto mute have been requested removed, we would update the files very soon with this feature removed."
6 weeks ago...
 

TimDH

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No intention of diminishing others experience with WISA and the hub for the Buchardt A500 but I’ve been using mine for about a year with minimal problems. I do have to reboot the hub occasionally but not much more often than my router or PC
 

muslhead

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No intention of diminishing others experience with WISA and the hub for the Buchardt A500 but I’ve been using mine for about a year with minimal problems. I do have to reboot the hub occasionally but not much more often than my router or PC
I hate you :)
I have two hubs, one sent by Buchardt as a replacement for a flaky first unit. The second unit is exactly the same as the first in its performance. Good for them and their ability to get similar/matching performance. Bad for them both devices just do not meet their promises.
As with @VintageFlanker, i love to listen to them but hate to fiddle with them to get them to work properly.
 

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CMB

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D&D has a very nice bass response
It cant go as loud as the F328be

The Revels are more open
Dutch have a little more forward sound

The small size factor is incredible

If the Revels wouldn't have this 4 screws apparent around the tweeter...
 

Cadguy

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View attachment 152722

D&D has a very nice bass response
It cant go as loud as the F328be

The Revels are more open
Dutch have a little more forward sound

The small size factor is incredible

Valentin, when you say the D&D sound more forward do you mean the images in the soundstage are more forward or do you mean the tonal balance of the upper midrange/low treble is more prominent?
 

Valentin R

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I would say it’s a bit of both
The d&d has les room efect and that alone changes a bit the presentation
It’s a small effect
 

PKAWA

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Buchardt A700 4 subs 6 inch 730 cm2 cone area @600 watt for 6 drivers.
Dutch & Dutch 8c 2 subs 8 inch 650 cm2 cone area @500 watt for 2 subs. 1000 watt total per speaker with 250 for tweeter and mids each.

If the Buchardt is wired to use 150 for the midwoofer and tweeter that leaves 450 for the subwoofers.

No doubt the 8c will perform better having more amplifier power, probably better drivers woofers although I can't find which ones, and passive cardioid ports. But it's also twice the price.

Mid = SEAS Prestige L22RN4X/P
Hi = SEAS Prestige 22TAF/G
Low=?
 
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VintageFlanker

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If the Buchardt is wired to use 150 for the midwoofer and tweeter
It's not. As this is an active design with no passive crossover, you have to get one amp channel for each way to get it working.
So it's 150W for the tweeter
150W for the mid woofer
150WX2 for the four subs left. (And no, you cannot add up Watts like this. 4X150W is 4X150W, not 600).
 

PKAWA

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It's not. As this is an active design with no passive crossover, you have to get one amp channel for each way to get it working.
So it's 150W for the tweeter
150W for the mid woofer
150WX2 for the four subs left. (And no, you cannot add up Watts like this. 4X150W is 4X150W, not 600).

Okay thanks for the input, I was wondering about the crossover aspect myself.
Seems they are heavily underpowered.
But if the A500 with purifi drivers hits the market they are still using the platin backplate with a max of 4 150 watt amps.
These drivers need lots of power, like 250 max each? This would make no sense to me.
 

RMW_NJ

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I wouldn't either.;)
A700 is sure a great active speaker for the price. There are just some limitations that cannot go over physics. That's about it.

Trust be told: I actually love to listen to my music with A500s every day. Exceptional speakers, but terrible "finished" product. Glad @Wicky had no issue with his Hub.

No doubt. He has always been responsive, arranging and helpful.:)

That is the biggest issue with this company. Constant promises and new products announcements, yet they still have to finish/fix the actual range. I'm still waiting for the "very soon" part of:
"The 5 seconds auto mute have been requested removed, we would update the files very soon with this feature removed."
6 weeks ago...
This is my impression as well. I bought the S300s in 2017, the S400s in 2019, and the I150 in 2021. Mads is really a solid, good guy who seems like someone that I’d want to have a beer with. However I wouldn’t buy his active speakers if I planned on using the hub at all. Too many customers out there with issues for too long, and too expensive to risk getting a half working product. Also I can’t imagine re-boxing the A700s and sending them back would be much fun if you ended up with a dud.

P.S. the app has been coming very soon for the I150…since March.
 
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