Conditions triggering EU sound level warnings on Android

[Atanasi]

I wonder what are the conditions that trigger an Android phone to apply the EU sound level warnings. In my case, the phone is Samsung S20 FE 5G. EU standards stipulate that mobile devices have to obey some rules regarding sound levels. The device has to present warnings before the sound level may exceed the specified limit. The user to has opt in in order to pass the limit, and the warning and opt-in have to be repeated after every 20 hours of usage.

However, this does not apply to all output devices. I think it is supposed to apply to headphone outputs, but in my experience, the implementation is inconsistent. Some devices that don't have any headphone outputs trigger the warning, like Topping E30.
A USB-S/PDIF bridge doesn't trigger it, and neither does MOTU M4.

I suppose the behavior depends on the endpoint type included in the USB audio class descriptors. If the endpoint type is headphone output, the warning would trigger, but an S/PDIF output doesn't trigger it. I would expect Topping E30 to specify its endpoints as line outs, and I wonder why E30 triggers the warning but M4 doesn't.

 

[Lambda]

What a stupid idea
How is the phone supposed to know what Amplifier or headphones your using.
or if you are using speakers...

So i have no idea but maybe it's for the included headphones?

 

[Doodski]

The user to has opt in in order to pass the limit, and the warning and opt-in have to be repeated after every 20 hours of usage.

Big time rolling eyeballZ.

 

[antcollinet]

Big time rolling eyeballZ.

Aye

The initial iphone implementation was particularly brain dead. It simply limited the maximum volume x time out of an audio device. It didn't care if that was a headphone, a bluetooth speaker or anything else. Didn't care what the actual SPL was for a volume settting.

People were complaining that they couldn't hear their tiny little speaker at an "allowed" volume. I saw a complaint from a fitness instructor who kept having her classes interrupted when her speaker volume was turned down.

After a few months they implented a scheme where you could tell the phone what device was connected. With profiles for some headphones. If you tell it the device is a speaker, then the limit is not applied.

 

[half_dog]

What a stupid idea
How is the phone supposed to know what Amplifier or headphones your using.
or if you are using speakers...

So i have no idea but maybe it's for the included headphones?

Big time rolling eyeballZ.

But he's right. Smartphones with 3.5mm outputs can recognize (speculate) if you are connecting a headphone or non headphone device by detecting the device's impendance. Some dongles have this function as well and it controls the output capacitibily of the dongle. This information is sent to the smartphone triggering the warnning. Maybe his smartphone sees the E30 as headphone dongle.

 

[antcollinet]

But he's right. Smartphones with 3.5mm outputs can recognize (speculate) if you are connecting a headphone or non headphone device by detecting the device's impendance. Some dongles have this function as well and it controls the output capacitibily of the dongle. This information is sent to the smartphone triggering the warnning. Maybe his smartphone sees the E30 as headphone dongle.

It has no idea of the sensitivity of the headphone though. So no idea about the SPL.

 

[Trell]

What a stupid idea
How is the phone supposed to know what Amplifier or headphones your using.
or if you are using speakers...

So i have no idea but maybe it's for the included headphones?

A sensible requirement to protect hearing, and it’s defeatable after all.

RME does similar for their ADI-2 DAC/PRO headphone output of the volume level corresponds to hi-power when you plug in the headphone: A warning and you have to confirm with a button press or turn down the volume. There is also a slow volume ramp up when plugging in, changing output or turn on the device, so that you have a chance to turn down the volume. All of this to protect the users hearing. You think RME are stupid too?

 

[JJB70]

At one time it was very easy to bypass the volume limit on mobile devices but they seem to have tightened up on things. I think the warning is sensible and I support it, but limiting output is going too far and the auto volume down can be really annoying. I find the power output obsession with headphone amplifiers silly and an invitation to hearing loss (not just prolonged high volume listening, volume knob mistakes could be nasty) and listen at pretty modest volume but freedom without freedom to be stupid isn't really freedom. It's the same reason that as a teetotaler non-smoking non-drug user I am not really supportive of banning things except for restrictions in public places for the reason that it affects others.

 

[Lambda]

A sensible requirement to protect hearing, and it’s defeatable after all.

If it has no idea what sensitivity the headphones are it cant make any meaningful Waring.
This gives a false sense of safety and is worse then no warning.

 

[Trell]

If it has no idea what sensitivity the headphones are it cant make any meaningful Waring.
This gives a false sense of safety and is worse then no warning.

It does not have to be perfect to be a useful feature on a mobile phone to protect hearing. Given statistics on what most people use for headphones on a mobile phone a reasonable workable guess can be made.

Same for RME they don’t know exactly which headphones a user connect to the DAC, but they have a pretty good overview of commonly used headphones I would think.

With so many very powerful headphone amps available today it would be very nice if more manufacturers where to implement safety features like RME.