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Can we trust our ears?

ahofer

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#85
Its not so easy to discern between them. But a louder volume does help pick up the subtleties better for me at least even then, I could only pick out the lowest 128kbps MP3 consistently. The uncompressed and 320kbps MP3, I could never get a consistent answer in that list of tracks.
THat was my experience, at least through the PC and cheapish headphones. I did get more lossless right than wrong, but only by one sample. 320 to 128 I got 100% correct.
 

milosz

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#86
We can trust our ears. It's our BRAINS we can't trust.

Hearing takes place in the brain.
 
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#88
Never understood audiophiles who get offended that modern lossy codecs are fantastic for there job and DAP/Phones that are limited to 64GB. To my ears i can't tell Apple AAC at 144kbps from lossless and sounds way better than vorbis and MP3 needs 192k+ to shine.
 

trl

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#89
Well, it's still lossy, no matter if we can notice the differences with ease or not. I wouldn't pay money for high dynamic music recorded in a lossy format, but I would probably pay for compressed music (summer hits, radio songs).

I'm sure we won't notice any differences between a DAC with a SINAD of 16-bits vs. a DAC with SINAD of 18-bits, but we'll still be inclined to purchase the 18-bits one, at least this is what I would do.

L.E.: Differences between lossy formats is more audible at bitrates below 128kbps.
 
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#90
Radio and TV/DVD were lossy, any dolby digital stereo soundtrack was 192kbps while Radio was usually MP3 . I highly doubt people can even tell a 80kbps Opus 1.3 in a DBT, yet everyone is fine with 256kbps AAC/Vorbis for streaming. Even with good headphones/speakers.

Nearly 90% of games used Vorbis for audio to save space since on PC its DVD - DL or 15GB for PS3/360 era PC versions on steam.
 

Blumlein 88

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#92
Radio and TV/DVD were lossy, any dolby digital stereo soundtrack was 192kbps while Radio was usually MP3 . I highly doubt people can even tell a 80kbps Opus 1.3 in a DBT, yet everyone is fine with 256kbps AAC/Vorbis for streaming. Even with good headphones/speakers.

Nearly 90% of games used Vorbis for audio to save space since on PC its DVD - DL or 15GB for PS3/360 era PC versions on steam.
I think the info in bold above is going too far. I think most people could tell that in a blind test.
 

milosz

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#93
I find it amusing that the "subjectivists" value the opinions of a bunch of Stereophile / Absolute Sound critics who are mostly old guys, unlikely to be able to hear accurately above 10,000 Hz. Which, of course, does not stop them from offering their opinions on the high frequency extension and treble detail and resolution of gear they listen to. Which means that they are evaluating products with sounds they cannot hear. And to the subjectivist guys, this is perfectly OK.

I once asked Stereophile to publish hearing test results for their equipment reviewers. I was treated to a rousing chorus of "that doesn't matter."
 

Sal1950

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#94
I find it amusing that the "subjectivists" value the opinions of a bunch of Stereophile / Absolute Sound critics who are mostly old guys,
I've no problem with picking on subjectivists,,,, or Stereophile/TAS reviewers.
But picking on "old guys" is going a bit too far. :mad::p
 

Blumlein 88

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#95
I find it amusing that the "subjectivists" value the opinions of a bunch of Stereophile / Absolute Sound critics who are mostly old guys, unlikely to be able to hear accurately above 10,000 Hz. Which, of course, does not stop them from offering their opinions on the high frequency extension and treble detail and resolution of gear they listen to. Which means that they are evaluating products with sounds they cannot hear. And to the subjectivist guys, this is perfectly OK.

I once asked Stereophile to publish hearing test results for their equipment reviewers. I was treated to a rousing chorus of "that doesn't matter."
I remember when Corey Greenberg wrote for Stereophile. In a music review he talked about the treble extension of a horribly mastered rock recording. He also used it regularly as a touchstone of treble quality in his equipment reviews. Then someone put it in a sound editor to find said recording had no response above 4500 hz. Don't know how it ended up that way, but some mastering decision resulted in a steep filter removing anything higher. (This was one the successful band recorded, mixed and mastered themselves one of its selling points being this one sounds the way the band wanted it to sound). So much for treble extension................maybe the rock band couldn't hear above 4500 hz anymore.
 

milosz

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#98
I was in an elevator with Richard Vandersteen at Axpona in 2018 and I told him "You know, it's really a shame .... I finally have the money to afford high end gear but at my age I can't hear above 12 kHz..."
 

j_j

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#99
I was in an elevator with Richard Vandersteen at Axpona in 2018 and I told him "You know, it's really a shame .... I finally have the money to afford high end gear but at my age I can't hear above 12 kHz..."
Yeah, tell me about it! :)
 
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