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Behringer Truth B2031A - how truthful is it? (review / modding)

pseudoid

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excessive capitalism
are we talking (A)made-in-EU? or (B)made-in-USA? or (C)made-in-China?
or... (D)all-of-the-above?
Please don't make the consumer feel guilty for being able to enjoy their hard earned cash.
 
OP
R

roci_big_ear

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It's amazing what it appears you have done with 50 cents worth of parts, very cleaver.
Thanks. 50 cents to me, zero cents to Behringer if they had put the proper values to begin with. I don't think speaker-to-speaker variation can make things that much off. But perhaps over time production and materials drifted, while the schematic didn't change to accommodate.

This is probably the truth, welcome to the annoying world of excessive capitalism.
That's their best monitor, no? If they tune it properly, they can easily charge double. That's what I would do...
 

Chrispy

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TLDR for the most part but as an older person forgot why I wanted to comment on this after looking at the beginning....but for the price these speakers seem to have been a reasonable value for a while....whether they meet "audiophile" standards,, well, that only means so much at all
 

Rhizomatic

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are we talking (A)made-in-EU? or (B)made-in-USA? or (C)made-in-China?
or... (D)all-of-the-above?
Please don't make the consumer feel guilty for being able to enjoy their hard earned cash.
What are you talking about? What does the country of manufacture have to do with the well known and well documented marketing strategy of making products that perform poorly to justify the high price points of products higher up the product line?
 

PeteL

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That's their best monitor, no? If they tune it properly, they can easily charge double. That's what I would do...
For what it's worth, Behringer own Tannoy, which historically would be a higher end brand, but I looked at their proposition in powered studio monitors and they are also relatively low cost. As for the reason they would chose different values than you, and I am one to defend what you did there and impressed by it, but I highly doubt also absurdities like "let's make it sound bad because it's cheap" That's a little far fetch. I think that some engineers believe that they have put there the correct values, maybe motivated by other motive than yours, maybe a signature they wanted, maybe loads of different reasons, there are thousands of speakers out there that could be "improved". I think that you did something right but going all out and trying to find the why a speaker manufacturer chose to do this or that will remain unanswered and I think there is a little more complexity to this than "this was wrong and this is right." I know I may appear to be shooting both way, but I liked that post as: "Hey look at what I have been able to do with these cheap speakers". Much more pertinent and positive than: "Hey look how incompetent this speaker company is, not even able to get the right crossover values". That's a whole other debate and yes in this case the achievement you made don't demonstrate that fully. That said, Behringer is a huge corporation, with hundreds of products in their catalog, thousands if we count all the brands they own. Yes the engineering money they would put on each products is slim. They make money by putting out new products all the time and do it fast. They are also strong into the reverse engineering business, in other word, let's copy instead of develop. This choice of component, In my opinion, may also simply be because they overlooked some specificities of the design they where copying (Genelec). Because that's what they do, that's exactly their business model to release cheap versions of classic designs in all fields of pro audio and electronic music instruments. The Ethic of this company is very elastic. They are known for this and have been doing that for many years.
 
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voodooless

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For what it's worth, Behringer own Tannoy
They don't (unless you mean the guy, not the company). Music Tribe own's both Behringer and Tannoy. Coincidentally, the Behringer CEO is also Music Tribe CEO. They also own Lab.Gruppen, of high-quality PA equipment fame.
 
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PeteL

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They don't. Music Tribe own's both Behringer and Tannoy. Coincidentally, the Behringer CEO is also Music Tribe CEO.
Come on you get the idea, the corporate structure, the branding and naming don't matter, first paragraph of the link you posted: "It is chaired by Uli Behringer, founder of Behringer." Behringer started buying companies a decade ago, the fact that they call this holding Music Tribe is just words, fiscal considerations.
 

voodooless

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Come on you get the idea, the corporate structure, the branding and naming don't matter, first paragraph of the link you posted
No need to follow the link, it's right there in my post ;) And yes, facts do matter.
 

voodooless

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We'll probably never know why they apparently left performance on the table. it's not at all uncommon. For example, one could say the same of the KEF Q series with their simple crossovers: A few €$ more to the crossover could make for a much better performing product. But yet, they won't do it. And there are many more examples of this across the board. Behringer is not special in this. Seeing how massive their conglomerate is, they must be doing something right.

On the other side, we see companies like Kali, that actually bring updates with valuable improvements.
 

beagleman

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Just about ANY speaker can be improved.
But having discussed choices with some of the guys that have engineered and designed speakers, including some fairly well known Retail brands, they make choices, not so much based on "saving money overall", but about a dozen other things only semi related to the issue, that we think we are solving.

There is a combination of requirements, including dispersion, impedance, phase, and sensitivity, and goals from marketing, customer expectations and other things, that often determine and dictate some choices.

Usually on only on the cheapest speakers are the choices simply ONLY financial. Most choices are well thought out, and simply differ with what we expect.
 

Rick Sykora

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Alternatively, remove the tweeter grills…
http://noaudiophile.com/Behringer_Truth_B2031A/
(I haven’t actually done this myself. Just ‘putting it out there’.)

Nice!

Thanks for sharing...

This is much more complete look at this speaker. When you said tweeter grill, did not realize he ripped the tweeter apart. He includes before and after measurements with off-axis ones too. The measurements confirm the OPs claim about the highs, but also show the that it could be tamed by the contour settings. The noaudiphlle measurements show this here...
1645799965505.png


This does seem like a pretty decent speaker for $200. The ugliest aspect looks to be poor control of the port between 250 and 400 Hz and a dip in the 500-600 range. The switches do not address some drooping over about 14 kHz, but is questionably audible and readily addressed with external eq.

Will know more when @amirm does a full review. :)
 

Remlab

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  • From the Zaph DIY website...

  • Behringer B2031P system measurements.

  • It's passive but will give some insights...

  • B2031P.jpg

  • [Image] - System frequency response
  • [Image] - System horizontal off axis, 0,15,30,45,60
  • [Image] - System vertical off axis, 0,+15,-15
  • [Image] - Tweeter off axis, in waveguide, on infinite baffle
    System response seems smooth enough to be very listenable. Vertical off axis shows that the primary lobe is directly in front of the speaker and the crossover point seems to be around 2500 Hz. Looking at the horizontal off axis and tweeter waveguide infinite baffle plots, I would have hoped for better control over directivity. But who can complain when the price is this low. Overall an excellent system for someone who wants a completed system for cheap.
  • Tested: Behringer B2031P drivers...
    B2031P.jpg

    Tweeter, infinite baffle...
  • [Image] - Frequency response
  • [Image] - Harmonic distortion
  • [Image] - Impedance zoom
  • [Image] - Cumulative spectrum decay
    Woofer, infinite baffle...
  • [Image] - Frequency response
  • [Image] - Harmonic distortion
  • [Image] - Impedance zoom
  • [Image] - Le(x) plot - impedance at excursion
  • [Image] - Cumulative spectrum decay
  • [Image] - Thiele / Small parameters
    I've been listening to this set and it's really an impressive speaker for the price. Both the cabinet and drivers are very well built and the design is good overall with few obvious flaws. After a good couple weeks of listening, I pulled the drivers to test. Individually the drivers tested well on my infinite baffle, with the only real hiccup being a slight dip in the woofer's response. I didn't find it too noticeable in listening. The tweeter is tested without the waveguide. I'll have more tests on the assembled system, but rest assured anyone buying this system will get their money's worth. For the enclosure size, I expected a bit more low end extension but that's easily solved by most folks with a subwoofer. The tonality seems well balanced, and the 4 component crossover seems to do it's job acceptably.
    March 31, 2011
 

AlexanderM

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And then this is the active version. I may consider using these with a sub, so looking forward to Amir testing them, he said it will be soon but I am in no rush. So 2 of these for $500.00 total, then one of the good inexpensive DAC's that Amir has tested, I want one with a sub, for around $200.00, then a cheap but good sub, and then for around $1K one has a pretty nice system, in theory at this point.

 

The Jniac

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And then this is the active version. I may consider using these with a sub, so looking forward to Amir testing them, he said it will be soon but I am in no rush. So 2 of these for $500.00 total, then one of the good inexpensive DAC's that Amir has tested, I want one with a sub, for around $200.00, then a cheap but good sub, and then for around $1K one has a pretty nice system, in theory at this point.
I recommend against a sub; once you go below about 400Hz, the room modes will ruin any attempt at a flat response. In fact, if you already have a usable source, it might be a good idea to just go with the best speakers you can, since the transducers are almost always going to be the weakest part of a chain. Then, if needed, you could use a MiniDSP Flex as a DAC+Sub crossover with solid EQ to create a really good system.
 

ZööZ

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And then this is the active version. I may consider using these with a sub, so looking forward to Amir testing them, he said it will be soon but I am in no rush. So 2 of these for $500.00 total, then one of the good inexpensive DAC's that Amir has tested, I want one with a sub, for around $200.00, then a cheap but good sub, and then for around $1K one has a pretty nice system, in theory at this point.

You have pretty much described my system, I bought a pair of 2031a for 279€ and presonus temblor T10 (which may or may not fulfill the cheap but good part) for 379€ almost three years ago. Umc 204hd I acquired a year or two before that based on Amir's initial review and measurements for 88€ or so, the later updated review doesn't paint as a pretty picture of it's performance, but hey, it gets the job done and sounds clean to me.

The original set was quite good after playing with the treble switch on the Behringers ( and after finding the lp filter and gain that suit my room on the T10), but what really transformed it to a whole new level was when I finally got myself into measuring and eq (again thanks to Amir, through headphone EQ) . The T10 really needs the EQ as it really can't go anywhere near the stated spec of 20hz without it (in my room atleast) but the behringer sounds just so much better when the treble is tamed more, dare I say, precisely than the treble switch in the back is capable of.

After that I have acquired a second T10 (b stock) and it made a significant improvement also (after measurements and eq) AND 2 more pairs of b2031a after that for a surround setup. The surrounds have been waiting for denon x3700h for over five months already but luckily it might arrive as soon as tomorrow. I'm not one to bother soldering my speakers any time soon so hoping that audyssey can do nearly as good of a job as umik and equalizer apo can correcting the response errors of my Behringers and boosting the low end on T10.

As you can surmise I'm quite anxiosly waiting to see these (and also Wharfedale Diamond 12.2, which I purchased as my height channels) properly measured by Amir but what OP has done is also very interesting and useful.
 

strummr

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OIC! You mean people use to many CAPITALS.;)
Take a chill pill man... I meant that often times, there's usually too strong a focus for the bottom line by manufacturers. (let me offer an analogy in another area of personal interest: cars... Porsche knows the Boxster/Cayman is a better design: mid-engine vs rear-engine, but for many years noted it would never have more power than the base 911 as not to cannibalize the sales of their core model)
 

AlexanderM

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You have pretty much described my system, I bought a pair of 2031a for 279€ and presonus temblor T10 (which may or may not fulfill the cheap but good part) for 379€ almost three years ago. Umc 204hd I acquired a year or two before that based on Amir's initial review and measurements for 88€ or so, the later updated review doesn't paint as a pretty picture of it's performance, but hey, it gets the job done and sounds clean to me.

The original set was quite good after playing with the treble switch on the Behringers ( and after finding the lp filter and gain that suit my room on the T10), but what really transformed it to a whole new level was when I finally got myself into measuring and eq (again thanks to Amir, through headphone EQ) . The T10 really needs the EQ as it really can't go anywhere near the stated spec of 20hz without it (in my room atleast) but the behringer sounds just so much better when the treble is tamed more, dare I say, precisely than the treble switch in the back is capable of.

After that I have acquired a second T10 (b stock) and it made a significant improvement also (after measurements and eq) AND 2 more pairs of b2031a after that for a surround setup. The surrounds have been waiting for denon x3700h for over five months already but luckily it might arrive as soon as tomorrow. I'm not one to bother soldering my speakers any time soon so hoping that audyssey can do nearly as good of a job as umik and equalizer apo can correcting the response errors of my Behringers and boosting the low end on T10.

As you can surmise I'm quite anxiosly waiting to see these (and also Wharfedale Diamond 12.2, which I purchased as my height channels) properly measured by Amir but what OP has done is also very interesting and useful.
Thanks!! I may end up doing something similar, which I guess I already said.
 
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