Arendal 1723 vs Revel Performa3 208

[sarumbear]

Remind me to include you in my Hate List.

I am lucky to have the funds and replace most of my systems relatively often but more importantly I have quite a few moneyed friends whom I can cajole in buying expensive audio systems. That makes me in a very good position against my dealer

 

[blueone]

I have very recently auditioned a pair of 8351B + W371A as well, also in my room. They are indeed very good. I may consider them if something happens to my Salon2 but I’m so content with them that I really can’t be bothered. Also, I still think Salon2 beats Genelec in bass. Then again that may be due to the room.

My room and the Salon2s aren't especially happy together, at least not without counseling. The best positions for imaging and mid/highs smoothness results in poor bass smoothness. I use a sub with DSP to fill in dips and raise the overall level by a few db (the Salon2s run full-range), but the placement of the speakers dictate the relative positions of the other furniture. I was hoping the 8361As would be more flexible for optimum placement. Acoustic treatments like you have just aren't practical for that room (I'm envious, actually), so I was thinking perhaps the Genelecs would mitigate the placement problems. Like you, I'm happy with my Salon2 set-up once I tuned it to near perfection, but I also admit to having a debilitating optimization disease, so I'm always looking for something better in any product I care about. I try to constrain myself, but it's like resisting Cherry Garcia ice cream, which is why CG isn't allowed in our home.

BTW, interesting tidbit... for determining whether or not imaging is good enough in a given configuration, I have what has proven to be a binary test. This will sound ridiculous, but for me it works, and has for about 30 years. On the original Stereophile Test CD from 1990, track 10 is a solo piano recording of Anna Maria Stanczyk playing Chopin's Scherzo in B-flat. The performance is very good, but the interesting moment is at the end of the track, where AMS's manager says "Well Done!" John Atkinson used a Calrec Soundfield microphone for the recording, and the manager was apparently standing well off to the left side of the piano. When the imaging of a stereo speaker system is very good, his voice comes so far from the left speaker it is eerie. When imaging isn't so good in a system, you don't get the same effect. Some speakers haven't been able to reveal this effect at all, and some need very careful placement to do it (like the Salon2s in my room). I left several dealers dumbstruck by this test over the years, and I find any system unacceptable that can't do it well. I spent numerous hours over a three-day weekend when I initially set up the Salon2s in our current house. And then the bass wasn't right...

 

[blueone]

Just noticed that you were considering the 8361a. If you are planning on replacing your Salon2 and not going to use a subwoofer you will find that 8361a is much capable in bass. That is why I auditioned the smaller 8351B with the matching sub. That is what Genelec suggested. 8361A is as good as it gets for a stand mount speaker but not a match to a big floor stander of a subwoofer when it comes to low frequency energy. 8351B is the same as 8361A in all aspects but bass.

Notice that most Genelec marketing shows studios using 8351B paired with the W371A. Genelec is in fact offering a competition to Salon 2 as a two box solution.

I've been thinking about the 8351B/W371A combination too...

 

[sarumbear]

My room and the Salon2s aren't especially happy together, at least not without counseling. The best positions for imaging and mid/highs smoothness results in poor bass smoothness. I use a sub with DSP to fill in dips and raise the overall level by a few db (the Salon2s run full-range), but the placement of the speakers dictate the relative positions of the other furniture. I was hoping the 8361As would be more flexible for optimum placement. Acoustic treatments like you have just aren't practical for that room (I'm envious, actually), so I was thinking perhaps the Genelecs would mitigate the placement problems.

A sub with Salon2, now I heard it all

I am joking, I understand how a sub and DSP can be used to eliminate room modes. Have you considered the elusive AVAA?

BTW, my music room does not have the same level of acoustic treatment as my home theatre/living room. It does have a lot of diffusers though and the walls are not parallel. Obviously the bass is not flat but not too much to cause concern to me. I am though considering a pair of AVAA. The problem is they don't have a stockist in the UK. I must buy and sell at a loss if not happy.

 

[sarumbear]

I've been thinking about the 8351B/W371A combination too...

You must made a typo on your earlier post then.

 

[blueone]

You must made a typo on your earlier post then.

No. 8361 with subs, or 8351/W371. Of course, the investment in the latter combo is much larger.

 

[sarumbear]

No. 8361 with subs, or 8351/W371. Of course, the investment in the latter combo is much larger.

I'm confused. Isn't W371 also a sub?

 

[blueone]

I'm confused. Isn't W371 also a sub?

Sort of. The W371 is also a woofer system. I view it as different.

 

[jhaider]

I noticed the new Revel Performa3 line is on sale now. Buying 2 Revel F208 towers and one c208 center cost about the same as 2 Arendal 1723 towers and a 1723 center. Does anyone have an opinion on which would be preferable now that they are similar in price? The Arendal are a newer design maybe they are better despite being less expensive.

Roger

IMO if you can stand them all up then it’s a comparison worth making yourself. If the center has to lie down then it is not. A toppled MTM is only an absolute last resort, not something to willingly pick.

 

[ruzun]

Ok. I found the problem with my system. I had the Salons pushed into the corners very close to the corner walls. I moved them about 15” from the back and side walls to give them some space behind. I then ran ARC Genesis again and this time I did the auto phase adjust for the subwoofer which is an extra step. The difference is night and day. Finally these Revel Ultimas sound great. On par with the newer setups I have been listening to. I can’t believe the difference. I don’t think I need new speakers, it’s just the Salons do poorly when pushed into a corner (more than most speakers).

 

[GabrielPhoto]

I’m curious about this too (unfortunately, I don’t have any experience with either). I’m very curious about the Arendals, but would currently lean toward the Revels because of the 3-way center design. Other than it’s size, every comment I’ve seen about the C208 has labeled it pretty much as the best center channel out there…

Doing a quick Google search, Arendal seems to be downplaying that difference (their basic logic is that doing a 3-day design would impact timbre matching, mids would obviously be coming from a smaller woofer, and who listens off 30 deg of the center and actually cares?). Sort of good points - I’ve heard nothing but good things about Arendal speakers.

Curious what everyone’s takes are.

Of course they will down play it. Doesn't mean they are right, in fact, they are not. Their "logic" is flawed

 

[Laserjock]

I'm seriously considering ordering a pair of Genelec 8361a speakers to do a side-by-side with the Salon2s. Of course, I've been thinking about this for a few weeks now, and am still procrastinating. The long lead times on the Genelecs are stifling my impulse buying.

@echopraxia has some insight

 

[Ashley Salmond]

I’m curious about this too (unfortunately, I don’t have any experience with either). I’m very curious about the Arendals, but would currently lean toward the Revels because of the 3-way center design. Other than it’s size, every comment I’ve seen about the C208 has labeled it pretty much as the best center channel out there…

Doing a quick Google search, Arendal seems to be downplaying that difference (their basic logic is that doing a 3-day design would impact timbre matching, mids would obviously be coming from a smaller woofer, and who listens off 30 deg of the center and actually cares?). Sort of good points - I’ve heard nothing but good things about Arendal speakers.

Curious what everyone’s takes are.

I have 1723 S thx . After having a two way speaker studios from Ron Cooper s Audio sound laboratories the Arendal after break in do offer a improvement and I can recommend that brand.

 

[Bettersound59]

Revel versus Arendal. I chose Arendal over revel. I had the c208, the m126be, and the m106s. The c208 was especially good as reviewed here on ASR. 126be was of course very accurate yet little hard on my ears and a little too small for this large room. M106s fine for HT. Decided to give Arendal 1723 monitors with accompanying center channel a shot. I was not expecting the Arendal 1723 center to be better than the revel C208 yet I found the arendal center sound to be a little bit clearer and more responsive to EQ than the c208. I do think however that the off axis is a little better with the C208. The greater tipping point for me were the left and right speakers. The Arendal 1723 monitors were an improvement in this room over the 126be. More definition more clarity without being forward or Be bright. Arendal Imaging, depth of sound, and instrument and vocal realism was noticeably superior as well in two channel.

The only question mark remaining for me is the Wharfedale Elysian center and 2s instead of these Arendals. I am quite confident the Elysian center would be superior to the Arendal center having listened to the Elysian Center. I don’t know if I could get better than the Arendal 1723 monitors with the Elysian 2s.

 

[GabrielPhoto]

I will be testing the 1723 center next week (Monday likely) finally thanks to a local that owns one. Will be bringing my C208 for the test.

 

[MarcT]

I will be testing the 1723 center next week (Monday likely) finally thanks to a local that owns one. Will be bringing my C208 for the test.

Excellent. If you can, please let us know your impressions of them.

 

[GabrielPhoto]

Excellent. If you can, please let us know your impressions of them.

Yes I will.

 

[Bettersound59]

Yes I will.

What did you think?

 

[GabrielPhoto]

What did you think?

Sorry it's actually happening today in a out 4 hours. For delayed due to bad weather with snow storms hitting over and over around here. Will report back.

 

[GabrielPhoto]

Ok just got back home from testing it but got a lot to do...but to summarize...I ain't moving from my c208 to the Arendal that's for sure.
More thoughts later