Apollon Hypex NC2K Amplifier Teardown

[restorer-john]

There was also a nationwide Japanese effort to overcome the "Jap Crap" image the country's low-cost exports had acquired as their industries dug out of the wreckage of WW2 and well into the 1950s. My old boss at Arrow Electronics' audio sales operation warned Avery Fisher and Hermon Scott circa 1960 that Japan was getting its quality act together and that Arrow would soon making long term purchasing commitments to Japanese suppliers. By the time I came aboard in 1969, Arrow was all about Kenwood, Sansui, Pioneer, and Sony when it came to electronics -- although we kept selling McIntosh and Dynaco gear to wealthy professionals and budget audiophiles respectively -- while both Fisher and Scott were in the process of selling their brand names to Japanese companies. By the time I left, Onkyo and Matsushita's Technics brand has joined the successful Japanese invasion of Arrow showrooms.

They are really interesting recollections. Way more interesting than arguing about cheap capacitors.

 

[PeteL]

As I understand it, Bruno was only ever an employee at Hypex. IIRC he is a Co-Founder of Purifi and also Co-Founder/CTO of Kii Audio. Hypex, Purifi, and Kii are separate companies.

I figured something like that, but still he owns the patents on NCore, not Hypex as an entity. So he must gets something out of this somehow, and the fact that Purifi seam to sell Hypex PSUs, makes me think that he’s not completely out of this, altough I know that officially, he had a job at Hypex but lines are sometimes blurred. Also, let’s not forget Mola Mola... migth be some more fuel for those here against the Product here being TOTL and deserveving top tier Caps... I bet Mola mola amps have good caps... Just pointing out that Hypex products, put in perspective of the whole Putzey’s pedigree, is in fact entry level, and yes, he moving to other things, he probably don’t have a say on the Stock NCore cap selection

 

[Billy Budapest]

Not on my list. I have owned one of their amps and their quality is weak.

Fine, add Neurochrome to the list then.

 

[March Audio]

John, I have no issue with Appollon wanting to "market" other options to clients but until you can clearly demonstrate there is a problem to be solved you are going nowhere.

Its you that is combative and unconstructive here. I have asked you to demonstrate that there is an actual problem of failing caps on Hypex products and you have failed to do so which fundamentally defeats your argument. Instead you keep repeating yourself and arguing the contrary.

Can I also remind you of your solid track record on this forum of bashing class D which any regular readers are quite aware of. You bet I am going to correct your assertions if they are wrong and give an incorrect impression to other readers that there is a reliability or longevity issue here.

Now, unless you have any actual evidence of failing capacitors on Hypex products to present can you please desist from derailing the thread and let people discuss the excellent and reliable Appollon product?

 

[March Audio]

Wondering, in term of branding administration and ownership, if Purifi just the higher end serie of Hypex or if they are fully separated entities. Is Putzeys still at Hypex or is there somesort of breakup?

As mentioned my understanding is that Bruno was only ever an employee at Hypex and has left the company. AFAIK there is no current commercial connection (this of course may be wrong, but there isnt anything in the public domain about it). We purchase the power supplies from Hypex and amp modules from Purifi. It takes time for a small company to develop a product range, so Purifi may well offer PSUs in the future (thats not an indication I know this to be the case BTW, just speculation)

 

[amirm]

Let's move on folks. What needed to be said on caps, has been said....

 

[samsa]

View attachment 88867

So assuming life rating of 5000 hrs at 105 dec C and a real world operating temp of 65 deg C:

L = 5000 x 2 x 5
L= 50000 hours

Umh. Let's get the math right.

For L₀ = 5000 hrs, T₀=105 ℃ and T=65 ℃, we have (T₀-T)/10=4, so

L = L₀ × 2⁴ = 80000 hrs.

At 8hrs/day, that's 27 years of operation.

Perhaps there are other factors affecting the lifetime. But, seriously, 27 years isn't long enough?

 

[March Audio]

Umh. Let's get the math right.

For L₀ = 5000 hrs, T₀=105 ℃ and T=65 ℃, we have (T₀-T)/10=4, so

L = L₀ × 2⁴ = 80000 hrs.

At 8hrs/day, that's 27 years of operation.

Perhaps there are other factors affecting the lifetime. But, seriously, 27 years isn't long enough?

Thats the peril of mutitasking on other things at the same time, obviously I didnt read it correctly. Yes there are other things that affect life but I think the point is made.

 

[Universal Cereal Bus]

but still he owns the patents on NCore, not Hypex as an entity

Where do you see that? I only see his inventions being assigned to Hypex, Philips, and Purifi. It is unusual for an inventor employee to be the patent owner. The employment agreement typically creates an obligation to assign inventions to the employer.

"Inventor", "owner/assignee", and "applicant" are different. The application can be filed in the name(s) of inventor and then later the applicant name can be changed to the owner.

 

[Bruce Morgen]

Now, consider this. Why would Apollon do all that, if there wasn't very good reasons for doing so?

You might want to consider that those "good reasons" -- like the "good reasons" they used discrete-component op amps on their buffer boards -- may well be as much or more about marketing to folks with certain concerns than substantive benefit to customers in general. Just a thought -- I obviously have no way of knowing a manufacturer's actual motivations in that regard.

 

[John1959]

Where do you see that? I only see his inventions being assigned to Hypex, Philips, and Purifi. It is unusual for an inventor employee to be the patent owner. The employment agreement typically creates an obligation to assign inventions to the employer.

"Inventor", "owner/assignee", and "applicant" are different. The application can be filed in the name(s) of inventor and then later the applicant name can be changed to the owner.

Bruno Putzeys designed the forerunner of nCore, the UcD class modules, when working for Philips as a young designer. As far as I know Hypex bought the UcD patent from Philips first and then hired Putzeys who developed, as a then Hypex employer (not co-owner!) this into nCore. nCore is further developed into Purifi 1ET400A. As I understand there are some new patents involved with this Purifi design, owned by Putzeys and/or Purifi.

All this information is based on several interviews with Putzeys and forum contributions of him.

I guess there are still some Hypex patents on the Purifi units as it is still partly nCore or UcD. I mean the idea to incorporate the output coil in the feed back loop and keep the thing stable.

 

[wwenze]

Yes indeed.

I have talked with Hypex few hours ago and unfortunately custom modules with better caps are not an option from them. So better caps are only possible with a later upgrade replacement from us.

The problem with switched-mode designs is the ESR (or ESL?) of the caps become part of the design.

 

[wwenze]

Umh. Let's get the math right.

For L₀ = 5000 hrs, T₀=105 ℃ and T=65 ℃, we have (T₀-T)/10=4, so

L = L₀ × 2⁴ = 80000 hrs.

At 8hrs/day, that's 27 years of operation.

Perhaps there are other factors affecting the lifetime. But, seriously, 27 years isn't long enough?

If you routinely see dead caps that are less than 27 years old, then your "perhaps" becomes a "yes".

I'll be a broken record, but these numbers are just estimates, not guarantee.

And since the answer to the question is a "yes", people will discuss what those factors are.

 

[andreasmaaan]

Where do you see that? I only see his inventions being assigned to Hypex, Philips, and Purifi. It is unusual for an inventor employee to be the patent owner. The employment agreement typically creates an obligation to assign inventions to the employer.

"Inventor", "owner/assignee", and "applicant" are different. The application can be filed in the name(s) of inventor and then later the applicant name can be changed to the owner.

I’m no expert on European patent law, but in general I understand it to be a little different to the common law systems in which there is a presumption that IP rights vest in the employer. In the EU (IIUC), the inventor generally retains some IP rights in their invention, even if made in the course of employment.

 

[Apollon Audio]

The problem with switched-mode designs is the ESR (or ESL?) of the caps become part of the design.

Yes correct. You can not just stick in any cap with similar values for a replacement. In these modules it can have an impact on the performance of the module if the values are not closely matched. The ESR (ESL) is also very important and has to be very closely matched to the removed caps. We use special ESR meters to do that. Like I’ve mentioned before, this process takes a lot of time and that is why we charge this much for recapping. In my opinion this is not the best choice and is not necessary at all but we still offer it for customers that prefer better caps. Please lets not forget the fact that we don’t see many cap failures in these modules. I haven’t seen any cap failures so far. The very few failed modules I have seen had other issues. Hypex modules are the most reliable class D modules I have come across.

 

[Universal Cereal Bus]

I’m no expert on European patent law, but in general I understand it to be a little different to the common law systems in which there is a presumption that IP rights vest in the employer. In the EU (IIUC), the inventor generally retains some IP rights in their invention, even if made in the course of employment.

I think most employers make their employees sign employment contracts and, especially in the case of R&D, virtually all of those contracts will stipulate that the employer owns all of the inventions the employee creates in the normal course of their work. I only know of one organization that does not do this in their contract. Of course someone can work without a contract, in which case yes I agree the relevant EU or NL law concerning IP ownership would prevail.

 

[DS23MAN]

The original ucd patent is owned by Philips, Hypex licenced it.

 

[mcdn]

As mentioned my understanding is that Bruno was only ever an employee at Hypex and has left the company. AFAIK there is no current commercial connection...

The connection in all of these companies is Peter Lyngdorf, who founded or owned NAD, DALI, TacT and more besides. Peter, Bruno and associates have driven incredible change.

 

[andreasmaaan]

I think most employers make their employees sign employment contracts and, especially in the case of R&D, virtually all of those contracts will stipulate that the employer owns all of the inventions the employee creates in the normal course of their work. I only know of one organization that does not do this in their contract. Of course someone can work without a contract, in which case yes I agree the relevant EU or NL law concerning IP ownership would prevail.

Is this the case in NL specifically? Here in Germany these kinds of agreements are not the norm in my (very limited) experience.

 

[Universal Cereal Bus]

Is this the case in NL specifically? Here in Germany these kinds of agreements are not the norm in my (very limited) experience.

Oh I just referenced NL because of Bruno/Hypex. Very interesting note about German custom--I'm now quite curious to ask my German colleagues about it!