Anyone considered DIY speakers?

[Digby]

My thinking is that once you get beyond a certain price point, then value for money tends to drop off rather significantly ( e.g. The JBL M2 is 5 times the price of the 708s, which are 8-10 times the price of 308s). I was wondering if anybody had tried their hand at DIY speakers?

One idea that is interests me is something like a 10" driver + waveguide in a relatively small sealed enclosure supplemented by subwoofers. I think for medium and bigger rooms a 8" driver will likely always be something of a limiter if playing down to 80hz, I imagine a 10" driver might have that extra needed oomph without being too visually imposing.

Also, I know there is a fanatic portion of audiophiles who like using full range drivers and, for reasons of distortion/SPL I wouldn't want to use one of these on its own, but what about from around 300hz all the way through to 5khz+. Is there any advantage to having the most sensitive range of human hearing served by one driver? Are those guys onto something with that...

Anyway, has anyone undertaken a DIY design, if so what were your reasons for doing so and what were the results.

 

[Vini darko]

Hi the issue with using big drivers at higher frequency is they beam. This makes it very obvious where sound is coming from and messes up the off axis frequency response. I think a 10 inch driver will start beaming around 1khz. So the trick to using a ten inch driver is finding a tweeter that can get low enough to meet it. Wich is why so many big driver speakers use horn/waveguide loaded tweeters. As when well designed they allow the tweeter to reach lower in frequency and better match the dispersion of the woofer.
There are many talanted diy builders here at asr. Look forward to hearing the advice and hopfully seeing some pics of builds

 

[LearningToSmile]

I'm thinking of going DIY eventually for the living room setup. I don't have too high of a budget, and while I'm sure I could get speakers with the satisfying sound for the money, I'm not sure I could get speakers with satisfying sound AND aesthetics within my budget. Plus it's a fun project.

 

[RHO]

I've build DIY speakers for years. It's fun, but you need the tools and time to get it right.
If you are on a limited budget I think it's best to start with a kit. That saves quite a bit of your budget you would otherwise need for measurement equipment and tweaking x-over components. (Simulations don't always match reality)
Also woodworking tools cost money. So your first DIY speaker can become rather expensive if you don't have those already.

 

[somebodyelse]

This thread probably wants moving to the DIY section where you'll find several threads on DIY speakers, including some fairly large ones. It sounds like you're thinking along the lines of an Econowave or one of the Danley Synergy clones, or perhaps this jbl based one. The Philharmonic BMR gets close to what you're proposing regarding a 'full range' driver for the mid, although its 600Hz - 3kHz range is a little narrower than you suggested,

 

[LTig]

My thinking is that once you get beyond a certain price point, then value for money tends to drop off rather significantly ( e.g. The JBL M2 is 5 times the price of the 708s, which are 8-10 times the price of 308s).

What about the Neumann KH420 at twice the price of the 708 (in the EU)? 3-way with 10" woofer and I think end game speakers for many audiophiles.

 

[Pluto]

I would like to have the opportunity to listen to the stuff offered by kit provider Wilmslow Audio. Many of their kits appear excellent value for what you get, particularly their larger, floor-standing designs. For me, true woodworking is beyond my skill set but merely screwing pre-cut and drilled parts together is not a problem.

 

[somebodyelse]

I would like to have the opportunity to listen to the stuff offered by kit provider Wilmslow Audio. Many of their kits appear excellent value for what you get, particularly their larger, floor-standing designs. For me, true woodworking is beyond my skill set but merely screwing pre-cut and drilled parts together is not a problem.

I'd be more tempted if they had some measurements - something like:
https://heissmann-acoustics.de/dxt-wave-fusion/

 

[Juhazi]

https://www.diyaudio.com/forums/multi-way/
http://techtalk.parts-express.com/forum/tech-talk-forum
https://www.audiosciencereview.com/forum/index.php?forums/diy-audio-forum.39/

https://www.parts-express.com/speaker-components/speaker-subwoofer-kits
https://www.madisoundspeakerstore.com/speaker-kits/
https://www.lautsprechershop.de/hifi/kkits_en.htm

etc. etc. etc. (Google is your friend)

 

[Pluto]

Few of the above named appear to offer the comprehensive choice of cabinet options available from Wilmslow. Flat-pack / factory built / veneered / painted etc. Unlike most kit makers, they don't send you elsewhere for the cabinet; they sell complete, one-stop kits.

Hence my enquiry: are they good?

 

[Jim Matthews]

Check your PM.

 

[voodooless]

If you really want to cover 300 Hz to 5 kHz and also control directivity, you’ll need a large horn and a midrange compression driver. The horn alone will be 15 to 18” wide. Nowadays however you can also get coaxial compression drivers that can cover 300 Hz to almost 20 kHz. Expect some HF beaming bough, but depending on age, that might not be an issue. They are expensive though, and usually not very easy to incorporate.

There are some alternatives though, which for a home environment should be very usable: a large horn with a small fullrange driver. On DIYAudio several people have done this using the SB 65 fullrange driver on various 1.4” horns. Some made 2-way synergies with 8” woofers. I’m also thinking along the same lines for a new build. It’s a relatively cheap solution, and if you want you can find designs that will work. You will need some 3D printer parts or other means to create some adapters though.

About your original idea: that could word with a 10” wide horn that can play to about 1kHz. Several 1”’drivers will do that quite happily, for instance from BMS.

 

[Digby]

Thank you for your replies. I suppose the main question for me is whether such a project is worth the time, money and energy for the results achieved. Someone suggested I Google/ask on a dedicated DIY forum, but the reason I didn't do that is because I think many people there are interested in the process itself (nothing wrong with that) and will therefore be advocates for DIY, because they like the DIY/tinkering aspect.

 

[voodooless]

Well, yes, what do you expect .
So question to you: what do you expect to get out of it? How much time are you willing to spend? What is your skill level with fabrication, and can you (or other in house) except the eventual result? Depending on budget you could also leave parts of the fabrication to a carpenter.

 

[abdo123]

If you're looking for a 'cheap fix' then DIY is not really for you. mass produced speakers are much cheaper in comparison.

if you want something that 'you made yourself' while acknowledging that you will spend more money and shit ton of time then go ahead.

 

[RHO]

If you're looking for a 'cheap fix' then DIY is not really for you. mass produced speakers are much cheaper in comparison.

if you want something that 'you made yourself' while acknowledging that you will spend more money and shit ton of time then go ahead.

If you are going for your own custom design, I agree.
If you find a kit to your taste, DIY can definitely outperform a mass produced product at the same price.

 

[No. 5]

Anyway, has anyone undertaken a DIY design, if so what were your reasons for doing so and what were the results.

Yep, quite a number of times for myself and others. The big motivations for me were the realization that I could get a lot more for my money and that an entire system could be designed for the environment it would be setup in. Case in point: in order to have 5.1 in my living room, but not have it look like a room that's full of speakers, I'm in the early stages of making a pair of very slim, on-wall, full height line arrays for the surround channels. There is no commercial offering like it.

I'm proud of the speakers that I make now, although there's always something that can be improved. My early projects were more learning experiences, but along the way, I have made many speakers that myself, my musician friends and others were very happy with.

I suppose the main question for me is whether such a project is worth the time, money and energy for the results achieved.

In my experience/opinion, each one made makes the next one better, and cabinet finishing is the hardest part to get right, so if all you are after is one set of speakers... maybe. If you put in the legwork beforehand to make sure that all the things that you will need to do are things that you can competently do, that will help a lot. There's a lot of help that can be had online (or friends, in my case) for the engineering and design, so for that part of it, it's conceivable that it would be worth it, but then do you have the tools and ability to build and finish it?

 

[sergeauckland]

Thank you for your replies. I suppose the main question for me is whether such a project is worth the time, money and energy for the results achieved. Someone suggested I Google/ask on a dedicated DIY forum, but the reason I didn't do that is because I think many people there are interested in the process itself (nothing wrong with that) and will therefore be advocates for DIY, because they like the DIY/tinkering aspect.

I think DIY is worth it, mostly for the satisfaction in doing it. It's not worth the money usually, as it's often cheaper to buy something factory-made than to buy the components for DIY. Whether it's worth the time, only you can judge, as it's clearly going to take a lot longer to build something than to buy it. As to the results achieved, yes, DIY can be as good or better than something factory-made, but that depends greatly on your level of skill. In the case of loudspeakers, especially, the look, finish and style of a factory-made loudspeaker is usually superior to what can be achieved at home unless one is very skilled, and/or don't mind spending many hours over the cosmetics. To make a loudspeaker look like a piece of furniture takes a lot of work.

One compromise that I found was to buy a decent pair of vintage loudspeakers, with quite respectable performance and still decent cosmetics, then upgrade them using modern DSP crossovers and equalisers, into something a lot better than the original, and approaching what can be achieved today. This side of the water, we have KEF and B&W, but there's also Yamaha, JBL and many others that can form a very good starting point for an active conversion. That way, you get something of acceptable looks and excellent performance with rather less work and cost than a full DIY new build.

S.

 

[Wolf]

I've designed quite a few of them myself and enjoy the process and experience. If you don't design and just build kits, that's okay. You can save money on predesigned kits, not so much if you do your own R&D.

 

[LearningToSmile]

If you really want to cover 300 Hz to 5 kHz and also control directivity, you’ll need a large horn and a midrange compression driver. The horn alone will be 15 to 18” wide. Nowadays however you can also get coaxial compression drivers that can cover 300 Hz to almost 20 kHz. Expect some HF beaming bough, but depending on age, that might not be an issue. They are expensive though, and usually not very easy to incorporate.

There are some alternatives though, which for a home environment should be very usable: a large horn with a small fullrange driver. On DIYAudio several people have done this using the SB 65 fullrange driver on various 1.4” horns. Some made 2-way synergies with 8” woofers. I’m also thinking along the same lines for a new build. It’s a relatively cheap solution, and if you want you can find designs that will work. You will need some 3D printer parts or other means to create some adapters though.

About your original idea: that could word with a 10” wide horn that can play to about 1kHz. Several 1”’drivers will do that quite happily, for instance from BMS.

Speaking of large horns, I've been wondering, are there any existing DIY designs for something in the vein of JBL 4367 or M2(but not necessarily a copy of them)? 2 way with a 15 inch woofer with a huge horn. I just love that aesthetic.