JBL Conceal C62 Invisible Speaker Review

[Mr. Widget]

It is massively better than any TV speaker. Not even close. On soundbar, I think they are better in mid to high frequencies but likely not in bass.

Thanks for this Amir, definitely an unusual product for ASR.

We have been installing invisible speakers for decades when the architectural/design dictates demand them. Years ago we sold and installed Stealth, but they really sounded pretty poor. They have undoubtedly upped their game, but I haven't listened to a pair in many many years.

It would be very interesting if you could do a comparison across the field and take similar measurement of the offerings from Amina and the latest invisibles from Sonance. When properly EQ'd and run with a sub like this one from James Loudspeakers, both of these can sound quite acceptable and are still magic... since you don't see anything except for a small grille that looks like an electrical wall plate.

 

[Mikig]

I'm not quite understanding. There have been some decent products coming out of the Harman groups. Perusing Amir's speaker ratings, a fairly objective measure, I found 12 out of 60 speakers (20% or 1 out of 5) in the top rankings. I don't really dispute that there has been some slippage in their speaker quality. Revel which makes up most of the highest rated Harman speakers has not come with a new model in 5 years or so except for an in wall model. It seems like it may be phased out at some point like Infinity which also had several high rated models in Amir's tests. It seems like as time has passed they've strayed from the Floyd Toole/Todd Welti/Sean Olive research into sound reproduction. Some of it is the usual problem of a too large company that loses it focus and also that other companies have caught up in some cases surpassed them such as KEF.

considerations:

1) there are 7.8 billion people on earth and, if the audiophile group reaches a few tens of thousands of people, that's a lot. The bulk of the market is made up of: portable devices, non-audiophile headphones, sounbars, Wi-Fi single speakers.

2) much of the audiophile market, given the prices, is based on second hand.

3) there are two types of companies: those that produce new products continuously, often identical to each other, and those that produce few new models, but each one is well thought out.

4) fashion factor of the brand: every year we see a brand that becomes over-advertised, which perhaps hits a range, and then everyone must have that brand. Then clearly after a short time they forget everything

5) Jbl is famous for its production 40..., clearly not everyone has a dedicated listening room, therefore these speakers with such shapes do not always fit into the living room of the house. Nowadays, lacquered, discreet and small speakers are the most popular, which go well with the bookcase and the sofa...

 

[mhardy6647]

Seems like the (much less expensive) approach of a transducer and a piece of -- well, pretty much anything (typically suspension ceiling material) -- is cheaper and might even yield better results(?). I think drywall will work, too. I am just sayin'.

You know... this kind of thing.

 

[Thomas_A]

Invisible or not, this speaker is garbage. It should be possible to get much better result for a built-in speaker.

 

[Mr. Widget]

Invisible or not, this speaker is garbage. It should be possible to get much better result for a built-in speaker.

It is not garbage it is magic.

I had a client who paid for a pair of Steinway Lyngdorf in-walls with custom boundary woofers. By every objective and subjective measure they were significantly superior to any invisible speaker. We were able to hide the right channel behind a fabric panel. The subs were concealed in the cabinetry of the room, but the left channel was a color matched in-wall speaker grille.

I was called back to make the system sound "better" after the interior designer fixed the speakers. The designer placed a very large framed piece of artwork with glass on top of the speaker. There was nothing I could do to "fix" it.

Had we just gone with lower cost and lower performing invisible speakers, the results would have been better. Not everyone is willing to see speakers or even a speaker grille on their walls.

 

[Thomas_A]

It is not garbage it is magic.

I had a client who paid for a pair of Steinway Lyngdorf in-walls with custom boundary woofers. By every objective and subjective measure they were significantly superior to any invisible speaker. We were able to hide the right channel behind a fabric panel. The subs were concealed in the cabinetry of the room, but the left channel was a color matched in-wall speaker grille.

I was called back to make the system sound "better" after the interior designer fixed the speakers. The designer placed a very large framed piece of artwork with glass on top of the speaker. There was nothing I could do to "fix" it.

Had we just gone with lower cost and lower performing invisible speakers, the results would have been better. Not everyone is willing to see speakers or even a speaker grille on their walls.

Not sure what you are trying to say.

 

[Sal1950]

Not everyone is willing to see speakers or even a speaker grille on their walls.

Then they're idiots to spend any real money on a system only to end up with garbage.
Just hide a sound bar somewhere and be done with it.

 

[phoenixdogfan]

I think a room with these C62 covering every square inch of wall space would be really fun.

Imagine the kind of effects you could create if every wall and all the ceiling space were lined with these. With the right kind of processor, you could have things walk right up to you, or have something or someone surround you. Probably with enough of them, the individual limitations of the unit would mater a great deal less as well.

 

[Mart68]

I reckon you could slap plaster and paint on that thing all day and it's probably going to make it worse not better.

Back in my day we took the indirect approach to concealing the loudspeakers for domestic bliss thing - hide the speakers in plain sight with the Jordan Watts 'Flagon':

 

[KenA]

It is not garbage it is magic.

Not sure the word ‘magic’ as a positive descriptive for audio gear is well respected at this site.

 

[Axo1989]

Seems like the (much less expensive) approach of a transducer and a piece of -- well, pretty much anything (typically suspension ceiling material) -- is cheaper and might even yield better results(?). I think drywall will work, too. I am just sayin'.

You know... this kind of thing.

Interesting. Despite our host disparaging TV speakers, I was impressed (despite no/low expectations) by the sonics delivered by a Sony TV I bought some time back, with their system of actuators working on the screen panel itself (for the upper bass and mid-treble, the lower bass uses a too-small conventional driver facing the rear). This video gives some insight into how that typology works in general terms. I'd never thought of using the materials this guy is suggesting.

I'm not in the category of people needing/wanting an invisible solution, however. But it would be interesting if I could figure out how to employ it (meaning the Sony screen-speaker) as centre if I ever decide to use the multi-channel capability of my DAC (a vague longer-term plan).

The entire-wall-as-speaker thing that several posters mention is interesting also.

Edit: that was one live listening room. Shame he didn't record with a dummy head for my headphone listening. Or apply DSP. And of course they need a bass solution that works. I won't be selling my loudspeakers to go flat, but still interesting. Probably more in the casual listening/background music category. As is the case with the DUTs here.

 

[MAB]

Imagine the kind of effects you could create if every wall and all the ceiling space were lined with these. With the right kind of processor, you could have things walk right up to you, or have something or someone surround you. Probably with enough of them, the individual limitations of the unit would mater a great deal less as well.

Yeah, just what I was thinking, but of course you are right and extend to the entire room.
Doc Brown couldn't have said it better:

But built to-scale and painted this time around...
Both L/R stereo and immersive sound.
Who needs sheetrock?

 

[Matt_Holland]

It would be very interesting if you could do a comparison across the field and take similar measurement of the offerings from Amina and the latest invisibles from Sonance.

This would require a lot of prep work. Unless they (especially Amina) are fully installed into a wall exactly as per the instructions, the measurements will be meaningless.

Even when fitted in one of its back boxes an Amina measures and sounds nothing like its intended to unless it is flush with a drywall surface, filled correctly all around the edges and then skimmed over with 2mm of compound.

I really don’t think it’s worth Amir’s time. These products aren’t about performance. And with any measurements made, YMMV is an understatement.

 

[Axo1989]

This would require a lot of prep work. Unless they (especially Amina) are fully installed into a wall exactly as per the instructions, the measurements will be meaningless.

Even when fitted in one of its back boxes an Amina measures and sounds nothing like its intended to unless it is flush with a drywall surface, filled correctly all around the edges and then skimmed over with 2mm of compound.

I really don’t think it’s worth Amir’s time. These products aren’t about performance. And with any measurements made, YMMV is an understatement.

You have a point but I disagree. Certainly the measurements are non-comparable in the very strict sense (vs an actual installation) but it's still interesting to get some more info on unusual speaker typologies. Amir should do whatever he's interested in I think. For me, I read this one. I probably won't read the 999th test of a transparent DAC.

 

[Matt_Holland]

You have a point but I disagree. Certainly the measurements are non-comparable in the very strict sense (vs an actual installation) but it's still interesting to get some more info on unusual speaker typologies. Amir should do whatever he's interested in I think. For me, I read this one. I probably won't read the 999th test of a transparent DAC.

Fair point regarding the interest of such speaker types. I just think it’s worth pointing out that unless they are installed fully, the measurements will be misleading.

Apologies to Amir if I’ve wrongly presumed he would be too lazy to get his drywalling tools out, scrim tape and jointing compound, etc.

 

[Axo1989]

Fair point regarding the interest of such speaker types. I just think it’s worth pointing out that unless they are installed fully, the measurements will be misleading.

Apologies to Amir if I’ve wrongly presumed he would be too lazy to get his drywalling tools out, scrim tape and jointing compound, etc.

Yes, measuring different speaker typologies is a bit of a rabbit warren, and warren spelunking is a personal choice.

I assume some level of interest on our host's part, given the photo of an invisible speaker client installation he posted upthread.

 

[Mr. Widget]

Not sure what you are trying to say.

When you walk into room where there is no speaker visible and no place to hide one and yet you have music, it is a full on David Copperfield moment.

Then they're idiots to spend any real money on a system only to end up with garbage.
Just hide a sound bar somewhere and be done with it.

I wouldn't say idiots, but I would say they should have been better communicators.

Fair point regarding the interest of such speaker types. I just think it’s worth pointing out that unless they are installed fully, the measurements will be misleading.

Yes, to do such a test properly would be a fair amount of work and why I have never attempted it! That said, as @Axo1989 points out, to me at least it would be far more interesting than reporting on another speaker cable, power conditioner, or DAC.

 

[Axo1989]

When you walk into room where there is no speaker visible and no place to hide one and yet you have music, it is a full on David Copperfield moment. ...

... Yes, to do such a test properly would be a fair amount of work and why I have never attempted it! That said, as @Axo1989 points out, to me at least it would be far more interesting than reporting on another speaker cable, power conditioner, or DAC.

An installation wall and a hemispherical measurement/analysis algorithm from Klippel would be on my setup list. Entirely hypothetical for me though.

 

[Thomas_A]

When you walk into room where there is no speaker visible and no place to hide one and yet you have music, it is a full on David Copperfield moment.

My comment was on the measured performance of the reviewed speaker. Hidden or not, it is garbage.

 

[GaryY]

One thing I really wonder is some of sharp peak might be from really the standing wave of plate. Why doesn't plate have any chamfer at least.