Active horn speaker from German Abacus

[oivavoi]

Discovered this speaker on a german hifi forum dedicated to active speakers:

They are to be produced by German speaker and electronics producer Abacus, in tandem with Audiovero, another German company. Audiovero is the company that makes Acourate, a highly regarded DSP and room correction system. Apparently the crossovers/eq/room correction etc are done with Acourate, with drivers and amps provided by Abacus.

Reasons it seems exciting:
- all the serious horn guys I know have told me that with horns, bigger is always better. So a bigger horn like this has advantages over smaller waveguides.
- I have yet to read a negative review of Acourate
- the people who've heard them in the German thread say that they sound excellent, and actually don't sound "like horns"
- there are very few active horn offerings. The only other one I can think of is the one from Avantagarde. To my ears, the Avantgarde speaker sounds colored.
- Price! 7900 euros per pair. While this is much money for most of us, it's still cheaper than the competing offering from Avantgarde, or offerings such as the Kii Three. And all inclusive of course.
- EDIT: And the whole reason I'm interested is that horns can have something about them IME - a kind of immediate presence in the sound - which I perceive as different from other speakers

They will probably come to the market soon, according to what I see in the thread. Hope to be able to audition them.

 

[RayDunzl]

I have yet to read a negative review of Acourate

A.J. came by, heard my little JBLs and said that "with" dsp the sound was pulled to the left vs "without" (raw).

DSP in this case was AcourateDRC. (My measurement/setup may be flawed. I don't critically listen to them, nor can I hear problematic highs if that was the issue).

For the mains, he thought the transients were good, no bass overhang, lacking chest thump (maybe my 50Hz phase hole) , and rolled off high highs. Didn't play them raw for comparison.

Price! 7900 euros per pair.

What's included?

I could be interested...

 

[oivavoi]

What's included?

I could be interested...

Hm, it's not on the market so far so I don't know... but amplifiers are included at least. I assume that some DSP unit from Audiovero would be included as well, since it wouldn't be possible to have crossovers without. But whether this DSP unit will be able to apply additional room correction as well - no idea!

 

[Frank Dernie]

They don't look like they are horn loaded to a very low frequency - around 500Hz and up by the look of them. The mid range horns on my speakers (Tune Audio Anima) are about twice that diameter and go down to 250Hz. Below that these aren't horns at all, but then full range horns are very rare, the Animas are good to around 40Hz.

 

[oivavoi]

They don't look like they are horn loaded to a very low frequency - around 500Hz and up by the look of them. The mid range horns on my speakers (Tune Audio Anima) are about twice that diameter and go down to 250Hz. Below that these aren't horns at all, but then full range horns are very rare, the Animas are good to around 40Hz.

Crossover at 350, according the German forum guy. Fairly low. The horn driver is coaxial, so both mid and high is covered by the same horn.

EDIT: But I don't have any doubt that DIYers can get even better sound from horns, if one knows what to do. But this seems like a very easy horn speaker, no further amps or cabling needed.

 

[DonH56]

Curious: It looks like two speakers plus a sub? That looks like a massive driver on the back end of the horn.

 

[Jakob1863]

Curious: It looks like two speakers plus a sub? That looks like a massive driver on the back end of the horn.

It is - according to the german forum - a BMS 4590 coaxial compression driverd.

 

[oivavoi]

Curious: It looks like two speakers plus a sub? That looks like a massive driver on the back end of the horn.

Supposedly this one: https://www.thomann.de/gb/bms_45908.htm
Yap, massive. 9.5 kg.

EDIT: Just saw that Jakob already mentioned it

 

[Frank Dernie]

Crossover at 350, according the German forum guy. Fairly low. The horn driver is coaxial, so both mid and high is covered by the same horn.

EDIT: But I don't have any doubt that DIYers can get even better sound from horns, if one knows what to do. But this seems like a very easy horn speaker, no further amps or cabling needed.

Well I suppose that depends whether one considers 350 fairly low! Middle C on the piano is around 261 Hz, meaning that the Horn isn't covering half the audio bandwidth of a piano, though it will cover the harmonics (overtones).
I am always amazed using an analyser how most of the sound energy in the music I listen to is below 1kHz!

 

[Frank Dernie]

Supposedly this one: https://www.thomann.de/gb/bms_45908.htm
Yap, massive. 9.5 kg.

EDIT: Just saw that Jakob already mentioned it

The spec of this driver is 500Hz up on that page, fwiw.

 

[jhaider]

The spec of this driver is 500Hz up on that page, fwiw.

For PA use. At a short listening distance they can be used much lower. The horn cutoff is the determining factor, not the driver.

 

[Frank Dernie]

For PA use. At a short listening distance they can be used much lower. The horn cutoff is the determining factor, not the driver.

?????
Certainly the horn cutoff frequency is crucial but why would listening distance mean the driver spec is not relevant, or it could operate outside its spec in such an application?

 

[oivavoi]

?????
Certainly the horn cutoff frequency is crucial but why would listening distance mean the driver spec is not relevant, or it could operate outside its spec in such an application?

I would guess it has to do with volume and how hard they are driven. But I'm far from being a horn expert.

 

[Purité Audio]

Just written to Uli the speakers look interesting, I like a DSP active!
We will try and get a pair here,
Keith

 

[jhaider]

?????
Certainly the horn cutoff frequency is crucial but why would listening distance mean the driver spec is not relevant, or it could operate outside its spec in such an application?

The specifications are written to prevent blown drivers in PA use. When the demands on a driver are lower, the driver can be pushed lower in frequency. Depending on the natural rolloff and horn cutoff, EQ (passive or active) may be needed to extend the low end.

Here's an analogy: a speaker with a 4-5" woofer may do just fine on a desktop, but try to set up the same speaker in a living room and you won't get nearly the output or extension.

 

[Frank Dernie]

I would guess it has to do with volume and how hard they are driven. But I'm far from being a horn expert.

That makes sense.

 

[Cosmik]

Why are horn people so much into bright red horns? I can imagine what a psychologist might suggest it represents.

In order to make a speaker disappear, don't you need it to be visually low key, as well as transparent sonically? I have recently started turning off the computer monitor that sits in the middle between my speakers, and I think it helps to remove that visual focus.

 

[oivavoi]

Why are horn people so much into bright red horns? I can imagine what a psychologist might suggest it represents.

In order to make a speaker disappear, don't you need it to be visually low key, as well as transparent sonically? I have recently started turning off the computer monitor that sits in the middle between my speakers, and I think it helps to remove that visual focus.

Agree completely.

EDIT: That's the reason I want my DSP done by a separate box I can install and forget about. A computer between the speakers kind of breaks the illusion for me.

 

[oivavoi]

Furthermore, on horns: I'm not 100% sure what to think. My experience is that horns do sound different. They can have a certain rawness, a certain grunt and dynamic punch, that is special. It sounds more live, in a way. Dynamic speakers usually sound "smooth" in comparison. I'm not sure whether horn speakers are more faithful to the signal, with the implication that dynamic speakers smooth over something which is there, or whether horn speakers actually introduce small types of distortion that can be difficult to measure, and that this mini-distortion makes them feel more raw and immediate. Maybe both things are true.

But I do think that eq and DSP is absolutely necessary with horns. Out of the four horn setups I've heard, two have been very colored, while two have been amazing. The two good ones were run digitally with DSP.

 

[FrantzM]

Furthermore, on horns: I'm not 100% sure what to think. My experience is that horns do sound different. They can have a certain rawness, a certain grunt and dynamic punch, that is special. It sounds more live, in a way. Dynamic speakers usually sound "smooth" in comparison. I'm not sure whether horn speakers are more faithful to the signal, with the implication that dynamic speakers smooth over something which is there, or whether horn speakers actually introduce small types of distortion that can be difficult to measure, and that this mini-distortion makes them feel more raw and immediate. Maybe both things are true.

But I do think that eq and DSP is absolutely necessary with horns. Out of the four horn setups I've heard, two have been very colored, while two have been amazing. The two good ones were run digitally with DSP.

More and more of the advice that DSP is always necessary, to get the best of any speaker system. DSP in the DIY-style preferred by many , yours included is not a simple affair however. I marvel for example at the measuring prowess of some here, RayD in particular, these are necessary skills to fully utilize DSP.

Back to the OP these seem interesting. Very much so. Is there a quiet revolution under way? Is it DSP time , this time around?