No, I just see a stunt a mile away. It is like you suggesting that Jeff Bezos leave Amazon and go help Wal-Mart get a handle on ecommerce. Surely he has the qualifications, don't you think?
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Now we know why Amir is pro-MQA
- Thread starter agtp
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Oh, heaven help us with folks this sensitive, and this emotional. They were lied to? Backlash on a free forum devoted to audio science and objectivity? What else would they want? Free dinners every night at the pier?
Have you ever bought a Blu-ray disc? Did you feel it was a fraud because the format is fully closed and costs at least $20 for patent royalties? That the format is so closed that they won't even let you make a copy didn't make you mad? That if you broke its copy protection you could be liable big time didn't bother you? Were you part of some revolt there that I missed?
You know the royalties for MPEG-2 decoder in each DVD player and set-top box was $2.50? For each bloody player? And for years and years? Billions of dollars paid for just one technology and you are going to tell me your feelings are hurt that someone has to play MQA royalties?
What's that? No one needs high-res? Well, maybe they don't need UHD video either? That is boatload more patent royalties on top of Blu-ray format. Were you in streets marching against that format too?
There has been next to no precedent for free anything in audio/video. When did that sense of entitlement come from all of a sudden?
Folks invent things, companies evaluated and decide to support it or not. You are sitting here with no industry experience second guessing what is going on as fraud? You don't think those companies have lawyers and business people? You have more wisdom than LG that supports MQA in their phones? Or Mark Levinson in this format?
I am supposed to complain that Mark Levinson is choosing to bundle MQA with their expensive hardware at no cost to their customers?
I play tidal streams and occasionally it runs into an MQA clip and it decodes it. Doesn't cost me a cent. You seem to think I need to join your jihad or I am supporting a lie?
No, just because we are all audio objectivsits doesn't mean we all have to act like lemmings and chant the same thing. I have different background and perspective than you. If that bothers you, then you are not demonstrating common sense.
So please don't apply these passive aggressive tactics with me. I know how to argue online.
And I know how to evaluate MQA far more broadly than you can. Don't let that upset you so much that you cross the line of civility. What good do think comes out of that for you???- Thread Starter
- #123
The technical reasons people are against MQA have been presented by people like Archimago, Mansr, Mitchco and others, you just choose to ignore them and resort to apologetics. An emotional response to being lied to is not my reason for being anti-MQA. Talk about rude? It’s rude to deliberately misrepresent an opponents position.
https://rationalwiki.org/wiki/Intellectual_honesty
I have addressed their comments across multiple threads here. If you think otherwise, I assume you either have not read, or understood the responses. And it is not like you are contributing technically anyway but using sensational likes like "we have been lied to." "It is a fraud!" Yeh, that is how we discuss technical topics. Not....
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- #125
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- #127
No you haven't. When you got stuck and ran out of apologetics, the thread was closed. Why not open it up again, so the relevant posts can be quoted?
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- #128
Here come your loyal blind followers to your defense. The length of time of membership is irrelevant.
I actually like a lot of things about the site and not here just to be combative. That said, I think everyone should always be open to some constructive criticism, it can be helpful. Unfortunately, Amir seems to vehemently oppose any such thought.
I actually like a lot of things about the site and not here just to be combative. That said, I think everyone should always be open to some constructive criticism, it can be helpful. Unfortunately, Amir seems to vehemently oppose any such thought.
This is not the high-school debating program to be quoting the Wiki. I gave you the perfect analogy. I managed a 1000 person division at Microsoft. I was corporate vice president and officer at the multi-billion dollar company. You suggested I should go and work for a little start-up. That is exactly like asking Jeff Bezos to give up his CEO and founder status of Amazon and help Wal-Mart. I am retired and thankfully don't need to go work for someone at this stage in my life. If you don't know these things about me, the slow down, hit the link in my signature, spend some time here before getting so opinionated and aggressive.
Opposed? I am opposed to your aggressive, and rude remarks. But I am able to put them aside and still address your points.
For your part, you have yet to contribute anything positive or constructive to the forum. You might want to do that before taking such positions. No one knows one ounce more about MQA because of your posts. Think about that before writing another emotional and frustrated post....
- Thread Starter
- #131
Science and objectivity? I see a ton of hypocrisy, inconsistency and contradiction on this site.
This is not science:
Merely assert position X as truth/fact:
“I am here to protect the truth.”
“I am not defending them. I am defending audio science/truth.”
“Yes, making sure truth and fairness gets a chance.”
My wish though is that everyone instead takes a breath and listens to the full set of arguments. And run with facts in the future.
Vows to defend it dogmatically:
“Ultimately as I said, I will defend the truth at whatever the cost. I don't know another way.”
"If folks want me to chant the popular message, facts be damned, well, then I will take whatever hit there is and keep going."
Engage in apologetics.
When shown to be wrong, or something to be a lie, ignore and carry on from step 1.
You seem to forget that science includes humility, consistency and intellectual honesty.
- Thread Starter
- #132
How many logical fallacies can you string together in one post? Your logic and critical thinking skills need some serious work.Oh, heaven help us with folks this sensitive, and this emotional. They were lied to? Backlash on a free forum devoted to audio science and objectivity? What else would they want? Free dinners every night at the pier?
Have you ever bought a Blu-ray disc? Did you feel it was a fraud because the format is fully closed and costs at least $20 for patent royalties? That the format is so closed that they won't even let you make a copy didn't make you mad? That if you broke its copy protection you could be liable big time didn't bother you? Were you part of some revolt there that I missed?
You know the royalties for MPEG-2 decoder in each DVD player and set-top box was $2.50? For each bloody player? And for years and years? Billions of dollars paid for just one technology and you are going to tell me your feelings are hurt that someone has to play MQA royalties?
What's that? No one needs high-res? Well, maybe they don't need UHD video either? That is boatload more patent royalties on top of Blu-ray format. Were you in streets marching against that format too?
There has been next to no precedent for free anything in audio/video. When did that sense of entitlement come from all of a sudden?
Folks invent things, companies evaluated and decide to support it or not. You are sitting here with no industry experience second guessing what is going on as fraud? You don't think those companies have lawyers and business people? You have more wisdom than LG that supports MQA in their phones? Or Mark Levinson in this format?
I am supposed to complain that Mark Levinson is choosing to bundle MQA with their expensive hardware at no cost to their customers?
I play tidal streams and occasionally it runs into an MQA clip and it decodes it. Doesn't cost me a cent. You seem to think I need to join your jihad or I am supporting a lie?
No, just because we are all audio objectivsits doesn't mean we all have to act like lemmings and chant the same thing. I have different background and perspective than you. If that bothers you, then you are not demonstrating common sense.
So please don't apply these passive aggressive tactics with me. I know how to argue online.
Why should you put the rude and aggressive remarks aside?
The ASR community doesn't want some the things we have seen this week, I know this from the quantity of positive PM's and email feedback I have received recently.
ASR is very lightly moderated because of the general culture of the members doesn't require it. This is fantastic. So let's not tolerate those that wish to degenerate the forum into the negative level of discourse seen elsewhere.
That's not censorship, that's protecting our valuable community.
- Thread Starter
- #134
This is one of your favorite go to apologetics: "You guys just don't understand." This tactic is commonly used in religious circles. "Religion X is true, you just don't understand."
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- #136
Maybe you should read the wiki links, because you keep committing the same high-school level fallacies. I never suggested you should go work for a little start-up. This is your little strawman.
Remember what I said about humility and intellectual honesty.
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- #137
Honestly, I am not trying to be purposely abrasive. I'm a fan of the site, I'm just offering some constructive criticism. I know that Amir can be hot-headed, defensive and argumentative, but don't try to label me as some troll, or something I'm not in an attempt to censor or silence. Amir isn't exactly Mr. Calm at the moment, either.
I cannot agree with your description of Amir. He is calm, tolerant, polite and generously responds to members no matter what their understanding or discussion skills are.
For some reason you don't like his take on the topic and seem take it personally. Take that as something that you should deal with first. You aren't coming across too well.
- Thread Starter
- #139
As long as you agree with him and don’t question too hard.
“For some reason”? I’d like to voice that reason, but as you can see, he doesn’t take kindly to constructive criticism. BTW, Amir is quite capable, I don’t think he needs your help.
It was meant for you, not Amir. A waste of time, it seems.
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