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All that tells me is that the EMU is "optimistically" spec'd compared to what one set of independent measurements shows.
And the measurements you've linked are for the Focusrite 2i4, not the 2i2.
I only talked about measured performance, 13dB of dynamic range and 30dB of crosstalk differences are not small. You may look at this thread as well. Also, 2i2 and 2i4 have same official specs.All that tells me is that the EMU is "optimistically" spec'd compared to what one set of independent measurements shows.
And the measurements you've linked are for the Focusrite 2i4, not the 2i2.
I only talked about measured performance, 13dB of dynamic range and 30dB of crosstalk differences are not small. You may look at this thread as well. Also, 2i2 and 2i4 have same official specs.
Also, 2i2 and 2i4 have same official specs.
https://focusrite.com/usb-audio-interface/scarlett/scarlett-2i2#specsI don't have enough invested in this to get into an argument over it
Where are you getting those figures for dynamic range and crosstalk? Measurements or manufacturer specs?
Looking at the measurements I posted, we see very similar levels of THD+N (just under 0.001% in both cases) and IMD.
I'm not looking at spec sheets, just measurements.
https://focusrite.com/usb-audio-interface/scarlett/scarlett-2i2#specs
https://focusrite.com/usb-audio-interface/scarlett/scarlett-2i4#specs
http://borisgermanov.blogspot.com/2014/03/focusrite-scarlett-2i4-rmaa-test-report.html
The RMAA measured dynamic range is pretty close to the official specs right? It's not argue, just fact, and 1212m's measured loopback THD is about 2 times better than the 2i4 (0.0007-0.0009 in 1212m vs 0.0017 in 2i4's best case).
This? How do you translate these measurements to RMAA? Not apple to apple comparison.That's the 2i4 again, not the 2i2.
This? How do you translate these measurements to RMAA? Not apple to apple comparison.
https://johnr.hifizine.com/2012/09/focusrite-scarlett-2i2-measurements/
To reiterate, 2i2 and 2i4 have same official specs on Focusrite's official homepage, if they actually have different performances then Focusrite is not a honest company, do you want to accuse them of it? Actually the RMAA measurements are pretty similar to their published specs.
Well, unless you expect Focusrite deliberately make their dynamic range 13dB worse on specs. Actually I found some 2i2 measurements, but just too scared to show you. The 2i4 results are already the best RMAA results I could find.There's nothing dishonest about spec'ing a product worse than the independent measurements demonstrate.
Anyway, I'm out of this one
Looks like those Focusrite interfaces have variable gains, tweaking the gain parameters affect the measurements, and Focusrite is also pretty honest to expect something like <0.003% in practical gain adjustments for normal usage. 1212m has fixed gain.Fair enough @bennetng, I have to concede that you're right about the noise and crosstalk specs
I'm still not sure where you get the massive difference in figures for THD from though? Maybe buried in one of the previous posts which I can't find? My interpretation of the results are that the THD figures (and indeed spectrum) are fairly similar for both units (both between around 0.0005 and 0.0008%)?
Looks like those Focusrite interfaces have variable gains, tweaking the gain parameters affect the measurements, and Focusrite is also pretty honest to expect something like <0.003% in practical gain adjustments for normal usage. 1212m has fixed gain.
E-MU 0202 USB used Cirrus Logic CS4392, which was also used in high-end audio interfaces like the Digidesign 003 and 003 Rack in addition to other E-MU products like the original 1820 and the Tracker Pre. E-MU seemed to be ahead of the curve in terms of value proposition, but it is strange to see that new audio interfaces in the $200 range have similar or inferior performance 12 years later.bennetng said:Here are the measurements of the even cheaper EMU 0202 USB interface with variable gain, supposedly tweaked to show the best measurements. Also note that the results are not loopback, but evaluated by a better interface (1616m).
https://www.ixbt.com/proaudio/emu/0202/emu-0202usb-2444-lineout.shtml
https://www.ixbt.com/proaudio/emu/0202/line-in-24-44.shtml
1212m has two fixed gain:Ok yeh, that explains it. Given that the gain adjustment is an additional feature of the 2i2, I think it's only fair to look at the 2i2's nonlinear distortion with its gain optimally set, which indeed puts it very much in the same league as the 1212M. After all, if you want to adjust gain with 1212M, you'll need to do it in software and this will also have detrimental effects on the unit's noise, distortion, etc.
The better converters are on Focusrite's Clarett series, and much more expensive.E-MU 0202 USB used Cirrus Logic CS4392, which was also used in high-end audio interfaces like the Digidesign 003 and 003 Rack in addition to other E-MU products like the original 1820 and the Tracker Pre. E-MU seemed to be ahead of the curve in terms of value proposition, but it is strange to see that new audio interfaces in the $200 range have similar or inferior performance 12 years later.
Focusrite seem to be using flavors of the Cirrus Logic CS4272 for much of their Scarlett line.
1212m has two fixed gain:
- Professional: +4dBu nominal, 20dBu max (balanced)
- Consumer: -10dBV nominal, 6dBV max (unbalanced)
Well, it is a soundcard instead of an external box, so pretty normal to see the absense of pots, but it has something a lot of <$200 interfaces don't have: coaxial/optical SPDIF I/O with ADAT and multiclient capable. For soundcards still available in this segment think about the Lynx E22 and RME HDSPe AIO and they are much more expensive.
The 0202USB with variable gain was only $100 and the measurements have good correlations with the official specs, which means better than the 2i2.
http://www.creative.com/emu/products/product.aspx?category=610&pid=15186
0202USB includes mic preamp and variable gain, at $100, and measured better than the 2i2, also has better official specs than the 2i2.Well we could get into comparing all the features of the two units, and I could say that included in the price of the 2i2 - which is already 30% less than EMU - is a case, mic preamp, blah blah blah.
I don't think this changes my point that a fair comparison needs to involve the 2i2 with its gain set optimally for the reasons I mentioned above.
Btw I agree with you that the EMU is an exceptional unit.
0202USB includes mic preamp and variable gain, at $100, and measured better than the 2i2, also has better official specs than the 2i2.
Funny you should mention that, as the main stereo output DAC on the Clarett 8Pre/8PreX is.... Cirrus Logic CS4398.The better converters are on Focusrite's Clarett series, and much more expensive.
Tracker Pre and 0202 USB are different products. I talked about 0202USB.Good If I ever need a dirt-cheap unit that has this feature set I'll get it.
EDIT: nonlinear distortion seems to fall slightly short of the 2i2 however... Not that any of the stuff we're discussing here is in the range of possible audibility TBH.