Wilson Audio TuneTot Review (high-end bookshelf speaker)

[sarumbear]

Good bass line makes me happy. That's how I got the idea of tuning by ear.

In other words, you want a speaker that matches the tonality of the sound you like. You do not want a Hi-Fi speaker, one that has high fidelity to the signal, neither transparent, nor behaves well in a domestic listening room. Have I got that correctly?

 

[wwenze]

In other words, you want a speaker that matches the tonality of the sound you like. You do not want a Hi-Fi speaker, one that has high fidelity to the signal, neither transparent, nor behaves well in a domestic listening room. Have I got that correctly?

Er.... no, I make sure the notes all have the same volume here.

 

[DWI]

I am afraid your understanding of spatial sound playback is very wrong. You are trying to re-invent the wheel and it is square

Hardly surprising, I read about it on the internet and then found it in my streaming app. The good thing about this system I had installed is that you are never off-axis, which is more than can be said about most people this time of year.

 

[KxDx]

Why you people keep comparing audio with cars ? Cars and automobile have all together different preference and requirements. Some need power, some mileage, some style , some space, some comfort , some off roading, some loading capacity, some looks but in audio how many want only looks ? Audio is all about sound quality. Only a very very few need style statement with audio gear and those too won't admit it easily.

That's not completely true. I bought my DAC because of how it looks as well as features. I would never buy a Topping or SMSL because of their appearance, even if they are technically some of the best in the world.

I love my main speakers but I wish they weren't black. At least they're matte black instead of gloss black... I might not have bought them if they were gloss. I couldn't have afforded them new, so when a used pair materialized that I could afford, I took what I could get. But I'll always know that the woodgrain version would have been even prettier.

If I could even trade for this veneer, I'd do so without thinking twice:

 

[DWI]

Didn't Amir comment that the bass driver Wilson uses has a longer throw with less distortion? That and the very solid box MUST help.

Got to say I can't live with tiny boxes where the bass falls off a cliff below 90Hz or so. and merely bumping up the 120Hz region as the LS3/5A does (one speaker that deserves knocking down a peg or three in my experience) just makes bass on the music I listen to a lot sound one-note and 'thumpy!' The ancient KEF mid driver, now re-manufactured by Falcon Acoustics, can't do bass at all really and it runs out of travel all too quickly.

I noticed that. I used Harbeth and they drop off rapidly. With the smallish Sabrina I still get a good solid sound standing 50 feet from the speakers. Strange, true and pretty irrelevant.

 

[restorer-john]

Yes, here it is confirmed https://www.fidelity-online.de/wilson-audio-specialties-die-wamm-story/

A very "high end" mashup of several different loudspeakers...

KEF B139s, Minimus 7s and Sawafuji Dynapleats as mids? What a mess.

 

[MrHifiTunes]

You said you want to learn but you insist that you know it already.

I dont know, I try to figure out how and why. Don't know where you get that idea...

If there will be a big dip to the sound at frequencies depending on how far you are away from a wall that means every speaker which is not flush to the wall will always have a dip in its response. We know that, that is not the case.

I don't get what you try to say. Yes every speaker will have a dip that is not flush mounted on wall. My idea of this design is that they deliberately place it at 85 cm from the wall knowing where the dip will be and adapt in the design.

The wavelength of 115Hz is 298cm which is 2.6 times the 115cm you are giving. It is not even a half wavelength. Maybe you can explain us why a fractional wavelength is at work?

http://www.mh-audio.nl/acoustics/CancellationFreq.html cancelation at 1/4 wavelength. Then the cancellation will happen at certain places in space.

 

[KxDx]

We did have a pair of Focal Utopia Colour EVO at home on trial, which cost the same as the Tunetot, but probably have a lower bass performance. I found those speakers too in-your-face and quite tiring after a couple of hours. Fortunately the wife made the decision on those, hating the sight of them.

The design of the entire Utopia line makes the speakers appear that they're looking back at you.

 

[sarumbear]

http://www.mh-audio.nl/acoustics/CancellationFreq.html For cancelation you need 1/4 wavelength.

No wonder they say a little information is dangerous. The page you linked is talking about how to avoid cancellation from boundaries and how flush mounting is the best solution. That is correct but what the page misses that with some many frequencies we have at our disposal with music, those dips will be so many that we will end up with just a sloping low frequency response. That is called the boundary effect or boundary step response and it happens when the 2Pi load becomes 4Pi due to the speakers own baffle size or distance from the wall.

However, even if it has been correct your arithmetic is wrong as the 1/4 wavelength of 115Hz is 75cm, not 85cm.

 

[aj625]

That's not completely true. I bought my DAC because of how it looks as well as features. I would never buy a Topping or SMSL because of their appearance, even if they are technically some of the best in the world.

I love my main speakers but I wish they weren't black. At least they're matte black instead of gloss black... I might not have bought them if they were gloss. I couldn't have afforded them new, so when a used pair materialized that I could afford, I took what I could get. But I'll always know that the woodgrain version would have been even prettier.

If I could even trade for this veneer, I'd do so without thinking twice:
View attachment 174213

If you won't buy topping for it's looks then it means either you would buy an "expensive" good looking product of similar technical performance or an "inferior" technically but good looking product at same price of topping. In either case you are at wrong place because this website focusses on technical measured performance also keeping the price in mind. But still it's your choice where you want to spend your money.

 

[KxDx]

I would imagine, Radio Shack, sold QUITE a few of it other speaker lines also.

I can barely count, how many friends, neighbors etc owned some type of radio shack speaker. Although none probably sold even close to the Minimus 7 model.

Begging the question, beyond Radio Shack, what company sold the most speakers.?

Possibly Advent, Acoustic Research, Bose, Polk, JBL?

I worked at the Shack as my first full time job out of high school, from summer 1989 to early 1991. Every year right before Xmas the Minimus 7's went on sale half price. We'd build a tall pyramid of their boxes about 25 feet in from the main doors. Sold like hotcakes, as the saying goes. I personally preferred the looks of the 77's with woodgrain finish, but never bought any. Ironically, after rent and utilities, I didn't make enough from working there to afford much of what we sold.

I used to joke that Minimus 7's would make a perfect murder weapon in a modern day rendition of "Lamb to the Slaughter." Bash in the head, clean the speaker, mount it back on the wall and put some tunes on.

 

[KxDx]

If you won't buy topping for it's looks then it means either you would buy an "expensive" good looking product of similar technical performance or an "inferior" technically but good looking product at same price of topping. In either case you are at wrong place because this website focusses on technical measured performance also keeping the price in mind. But still it's your choice where you want to spend your money.

I'm not at the wrong place. Amir has reviewed what, over 300 DAC's? It's not a crime to buy "good enough, with no audible inferiority" and then focus on features and appearance. there is plenty to choose from.

 

[DSJR]

I noticed that. I used Harbeth and they drop off rapidly. With the smallish Sabrina I still get a good solid sound standing 50 feet from the speakers. Strange, true and pretty irrelevant.

If I stood fifty feet from my speakers I'd be two neighbour's doors away

 

[MrHifiTunes]

No wonder they say a little information is dangerous. The page you linked is talking about how to avoid cancellation from boundaries and how flush mounting is the best solution. That is correct but what the page misses that with some many frequencies we have at our disposal with music, those dips will be so many that we will end up with just a sloping low frequency response. That is called the boundary effect or boundary step response and it happens when the 2Pi load becomes 4Pi due to the speakers own baffle size or distance from the wall.

However, even if it has been correct your arithmetic is wrong as the 1/4 wavelength of 115Hz is 75cm, not 85cm.

Yes They show many dips and peaks further up too in the graph, but they are not as deep/high as the one at 100Hz. They don't say flush mounting is the best solution but just point out as 1 of the solutions. 'Further from the wall is an other one.
I dont think they are talking about baffle step, just wall reflections and wave cancellations .

I didnt calculate it myself, just followed the text.

Still many seems to focus on the bass response of this speaker. What interest me more is the mid's and the wobbly on and off axis response which seems to do something right even it doenst look good on the graphs and probably why people seem to like this speaker

 

[Rick63]

Never mind. I'm still learning.
I have been struggling with BS abbreviation for a while, trying to understand the text in this and other threads. Recently came to a conclusion that it means Boutique Sound, but I'm not sure yet.
This time I decided to ask the source directly ))

I'm with you. While I do know some abbreviations/acronyms when I see them, often times I have to do a Google search to see what they mean and even then can't find out at times. I find it funny when someone makes a long post with hundreds of words and throws a few in it. I mean, if they have the time to make such a long post couldn't they take the time to type a few more words out instead of an abbreviation? LOL.

 

[aj625]

I'm not at the wrong place. Amir has reviewed what, over 300 DAC's? It's not a crime to buy "good enough, with no audible inferiority" and then focus on features and appearance. there is plenty to choose from.

Who says it's a crime. That's why I said it's your choice. But how would you find "no audible inferiority " ? Auditioning dacs of your choice in one place in similar set up is the thing which is nearly impossible and whosoever says he has bought a particular "boutique dac" by directly comparing it with a cheap but state of the art measuring dac "side by side" is either lying or he has bought that boutique dac based only on glowing subjective reviews.

 

[beagleman]

A comparison with the M106 400 Hz and up. There are some general similarities in the pattern, but with a larger 3-4 kHz dip for the tune tot.


View attachment 174191

Compared to my own speaker:

View attachment 174193

Thanks for the great comparison!

Although I have found as some other speaker engineers also, that dip "often" creates a milder, more listenable sound at higher volumes, especially with certain female voice, instruments etc.
Usually a slightly larger inductor on the woofer, or a slightly higher roll off of the tweeter accomplish this.

And almost for sure, it is intentional.
I agree, it is not "Flat" per se, but often "Enjoyable" is seen as better by some.

 

[sarumbear]

Yes They show many dips and peaks further up too in the graph, but they are not as deep/high as the one at 100Hz. They don't say flush mounting is the best solution but just point out as 1 of the solutions. 'Further from the wall is an other one.
I dont think they are talking about baffle step, just wall reflections and wave cancellations .

I didnt calculate it myself, just followed the text.

You had earlier said "it is easy to engineer that". That means you have understood how the calculations are done. You are now saying that you have not even verified if your source is correct or not. When we submit a source as a reference it is prudent to test if it is true or if it is widely recognised as such. Otherwise, we will be confusing the forum, not to mention ourselves.

 

[beagleman]

The design isnt textbook. you have a reference to which you compare this design. Maybe we should think out of the box?
Why do people who actually listen to them like them? where does that come from? Are they wrong? Amir prefer it above the revel M106 after EQ'ing. A speaker which measure great. Why? That intrigues me and I'm willing to think out of the box to find an answer. juist saying it doenst measure well so it should sound bad is a bit narrow minded. I'm open to try to understand and learn why... and try to find some answers....

agree completely. Measurements show us how a speaker should perform, but actual listening can often tell us what sounds "better" or more enjoyable.

I am about 75% objective, but there are times, that something just "Clicks" and I enjoy the sound. Accurate or not, I find subjectively liking something often trumps textbook "Ideal" measurements.

That "May" be related to preference, room acoustics, recordings, and a few other things.

 

[Zensō]

I’m not adding anything here but feel compelled to vent. These are a perfect example of overpriced audiophile garbage. There is a long list of speakers at 1/10 the price that outperform these.

Sometimes this audiophile nonsense is just tiring…