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XBOX ONE controller as a USB DAC... WHAAAAATTTT?
- Thread starter SEKLEM
- Start date
restorer-john
Grand Contributor
Does it vibrate in time with the music? Amir better get one and fire up the AP. Could be a giant-killer D/A converter- not.
Belgarathian
Member
Hahahahaha that's genius.
SimpleTheater
Addicted to Fun and Learning
I find the PS4 controllers headphone amp more refined and capable in the low to midrange end, whereby the XBoxOne struggles to handle fast transients. After hooking both up to a JDLabs Atom, The DAC on the XBox One controller loses again to the PS4 in overall visceral sonics. I don’t think Amirm should waste his time with the XBox One controller, but would love to see the PS4 standard controller head to head with the Scuf Gaming units that have a more refined DAC and slightly higher amplified output.
jeffbook
Active Member
Well, IMHO The Xbox One has superior PRAT and that settles this argument as far as I can see.
Typevii
Member
Xbox has a deeper black background for sure.
Bamboszek
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I've just measured my Sony DualShock 4 v2 controller and actually it's pretty decent! It's on par with cheaper Topping/SMSL devices and easly beating "audiophile" Audio-GD or Woo Audio products 
DS4 headset output to Audient iD4 line in. No external load, just iD4 input. There is clipping at 0dBFS so testing was done at -1dBFS. Controller was connected to PC by USB cable. Bluetooth audio is supported just by official Sony wireless adapter, games run fine with generic bluetooth dongle and DS4Windows or Steam software. Controller is limited to 16 bit / 32kHz sampling rate. Frequency response is flat with -3dB point at 14kHz - sorry, no hires audio there Idk, maybe higher sampling rates are available with Sony dongle.
DS4 headset output to Audient iD4 line in. No external load, just iD4 input. There is clipping at 0dBFS so testing was done at -1dBFS. Controller was connected to PC by USB cable. Bluetooth audio is supported just by official Sony wireless adapter, games run fine with generic bluetooth dongle and DS4Windows or Steam software. Controller is limited to 16 bit / 32kHz sampling rate. Frequency response is flat with -3dB point at 14kHz - sorry, no hires audio there
Idk, maybe higher sampling rates are available with Sony dongle.
- Thread Starter
- #10
I've just measured my Sony DualShock 4 v2 controller and actually it's pretty decent! It's on par with cheaper Topping/SMSL devices and easly beating "audiophile" Audio-GD or Woo Audio products
DS4 headset output to Audient iD4 line in. No external load, just iD4 input. There is clipping at 0dBFS so testing was done at -1dBFS. Controller was connected to PC by USB cable. Bluetooth audio is supported just by official Sony wireless adapter, games run fine with generic bluetooth dongle and DS4Windows or Steam software. Controller is limited to 16 bit / 32kHz sampling rate. Frequency response is flat with -3dB point at 14kHz - sorry, no hires audio there
But does it measure better than Sony's UDA-1?
Bamboszek
Active Member
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According to Amir's rewiew DS4 beats UDA-1 with power amp running. Otherwise, in pure DAC mode UDA-1 is a few decibels better. 32kHz max sampling rate is a serious limitation tho. Keep in mind that my measurments aren't exactly proper. I did just simple FFT, no output power measurments and etc. Someday maybe I will make a bit more meaningful test with APx525 and output load.
- Thread Starter
- #12
That’s still pretty silly, even with the sampling rate bottleneck. The UDA-1 performance is abysmal for the MSRP.
There are measurements, and then there is interpretation of measurements.
We need to think about how audible the differences are i.e. give weighting’s to the measurements.
The difference of 4-7 dB of harmonic distortion difference and noise in the line outs at that level e.g.
-72 to -75 dB THD+N (UDA-1 @ max volume) compared to
-79dB THD+N (DS4 @ volume -1dBFS)
will be very challenging if not impossible to discern.
But when connecting a headphone to the DS4, (ie. a load) we have are no directly comparable results for 33 or 300m ohms.
Nevertheless, a high frequency roll-off of 14 kHz of the DS4 will result in audible reduced treble extension or “air”
So the advantage goes to the UDA-1 in that respect.
On the other hand, the UDA-1 has an output impedance of over 300ohms! which will cause large fluctuations in the frequency response (many several dB) for virtually all headphones with dynamic drivers. The actual fluctuation depends on the impedance of the connected headphone. For high impedance eg. 300 headphones there will be a couple of dB boost in the mid-bass. This may be quite enjoyable this some people. Only headphones which have a flat impedance curve eg. Planar magnetic, will be spared of the FR fluctuation.
So the UDA-1 and DS4 is a example where DACs/ headphone amps will sound notable difference. The type that can cause great curiosity to the tweakazoid audiophile.
In my opinion the DS4 dac/headphone is for gaming- sound effects and background music. In designing for low latency I suspect the decision to reduce the sampling rate, and hence high frequency response, was to reduce the bandwidth for signal transmission.
And so it is, perfectly suitably for that task, not primary music listening.
We need to think about how audible the differences are i.e. give weighting’s to the measurements.
The difference of 4-7 dB of harmonic distortion difference and noise in the line outs at that level e.g.
-72 to -75 dB THD+N (UDA-1 @ max volume) compared to
-79dB THD+N (DS4 @ volume -1dBFS)
will be very challenging if not impossible to discern.
But when connecting a headphone to the DS4, (ie. a load) we have are no directly comparable results for 33 or 300m ohms.
Nevertheless, a high frequency roll-off of 14 kHz of the DS4 will result in audible reduced treble extension or “air”
So the advantage goes to the UDA-1 in that respect.
On the other hand, the UDA-1 has an output impedance of over 300ohms! which will cause large fluctuations in the frequency response (many several dB) for virtually all headphones with dynamic drivers. The actual fluctuation depends on the impedance of the connected headphone. For high impedance eg. 300 headphones there will be a couple of dB boost in the mid-bass. This may be quite enjoyable this some people. Only headphones which have a flat impedance curve eg. Planar magnetic, will be spared of the FR fluctuation.
So the UDA-1 and DS4 is a example where DACs/ headphone amps will sound notable difference. The type that can cause great curiosity to the tweakazoid audiophile.
In my opinion the DS4 dac/headphone is for gaming- sound effects and background music. In designing for low latency I suspect the decision to reduce the sampling rate, and hence high frequency response, was to reduce the bandwidth for signal transmission.
And so it is, perfectly suitably for that task, not primary music listening.
Last edited:
L5730
Addicted to Fun and Learning
I've just purchased a Turtle Beach React-R XBox compatible controller.
I wondered if the DAC/HP-amp would work on Windows 10, and it does!
Limited to 16 bit 48 kHz (DVD quality).
The on-controller EQ booster thing works, it's just a upper mid/high boost by the sound of it. Forced clarity for gaming hearing footsteps etc.
Hold a button and tap up/down on the multidirection pad and it changes the volume.
Windows has an option for bass boost, selectable in dB and frequency. I'd prefer to use EqAPO anyway, but I guess nice to be able to play with that.
A loudness riding compressor is also available in Windows sound, as well as a set of things labelled equalisers, but I think might be more like reverb.
I should measure the flat performance, just for amusement.
I wondered if the DAC/HP-amp would work on Windows 10, and it does!
Limited to 16 bit 48 kHz (DVD quality).
The on-controller EQ booster thing works, it's just a upper mid/high boost by the sound of it. Forced clarity for gaming hearing footsteps etc.
Hold a button and tap up/down on the multidirection pad and it changes the volume.
Windows has an option for bass boost, selectable in dB and frequency. I'd prefer to use EqAPO anyway, but I guess nice to be able to play with that.
A loudness riding compressor is also available in Windows sound, as well as a set of things labelled equalisers, but I think might be more like reverb.
I should measure the flat performance, just for amusement.
L5730
Addicted to Fun and Learning
Outputting a -6 dBFS dithered 1 kHz sine wave (16bit 48 kHz) from the controller using REWs own signal generator.
RME Babyface Pro FS (set to 48 kHz internal clock) unbalanced inputs 3/4 used set to -10 dBv and +5dB gain for ~ -6dBFS input.
Doesn't look good at all.
As for the EQ changer button, I just sent pink noise out of Reaper to the controller and back into RME BFPro Fs.
Captured and overlayed. Green is pink noise, blue is with the EQ button. Hmmm 'clarity'.
Though I should note that this button was only intended to help accentuate certain things in games, not to improve musical qualities.
No idea what chip is being used in this controller for audio duties. Basic 16/48 DAC/HP-amp chips are almost free of charge, would not surprise me to find it being yet another dirt cheap part. This controller has to contain 4 analog inputs (2 sticks, 2 triggers) plus over 10 buttons, a D-pad and a pair of female personal entertainment devices!
RME Babyface Pro FS (set to 48 kHz internal clock) unbalanced inputs 3/4 used set to -10 dBv and +5dB gain for ~ -6dBFS input.
Doesn't look good at all.
As for the EQ changer button, I just sent pink noise out of Reaper to the controller and back into RME BFPro Fs.
Captured and overlayed. Green is pink noise, blue is with the EQ button. Hmmm 'clarity'.
Though I should note that this button was only intended to help accentuate certain things in games, not to improve musical qualities.
No idea what chip is being used in this controller for audio duties. Basic 16/48 DAC/HP-amp chips are almost free of charge, would not surprise me to find it being yet another dirt cheap part. This controller has to contain 4 analog inputs (2 sticks, 2 triggers) plus over 10 buttons, a D-pad and a pair of female personal entertainment devices!
spookyrecharge
New Member
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I wonder what audio quality we can get from Dualsense (ps5 controller) 3.5mm jack?
Realtek ALC5524 audio codec on par with Nuvoton NAU8225 - a 3.0W Class-D Audio Stereo amplifier used in this controller.
P.S. Haven't found any datasheet for ALC5524
Realtek ALC5524 audio codec on par with Nuvoton NAU8225 - a 3.0W Class-D Audio Stereo amplifier used in this controller.
P.S. Haven't found any datasheet for ALC5524
its not as terrible as you would think
i personally found it slightly sibliant and a bit crashy but overall if you're hard up for a HP amp then this can work
what i didnt like is that its 16/48 only and it only auto resamples on a whim
so i couldnt get foobar to go but YT music is fine
i'm pretty sure any modern motherboard 3.5 mm out is just as good if not better
for the Pew pews its fine
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