What is an equivalent product to HiFi snake oil?

[napfkuchen]

Any snake oil implies not at all such improvements that are measurable.

You bought a trendy camping kit, yes, it is very beautiful and weighs a kilo less, but you have not become a more experienced hiker from this. But you feel like a steep hiker.
Did you buy a 4kg bike for the price of a car? But you didn't win the Tour de France. But how do you feel on this beautiful bike!

As virtua already said your comparison is lagging. I'll use my new triathlon road bike as an example, which replaced a 20 year old model. The new bike offers some features that were not available back then: oil pressure brakes, a multi-adjustable stem/handlebars, electronic shifting, a drinking bottle integrated into the frame.
At least the brakes are a safety factor too, the rest adds to comfort. With hifi snake oil however. It only takes money out of your pocket. At least for me, as I am not a "believer" and want my audio gear to perform without being flashy.

 

[virtua]

As a result, everyone is absolutely indifferent to those 0.00000011% THD, which, with some skill, can be caught as an improvement due to the cable

While you're correct, that it might be possible to capture a specific point where two essentially identically performing cables (the vast majority of them, unless something is seriously wrong) were measured at different times might look better than one another due to say modulation in even the most precise measuring equipment, I don't think I've ever seen any brands market in such a way but I may be wrong.

I don't condone snake oil, no.
And I try not to buy it.
But this "Great Snake Oil Battle" is just ridiculous.
Just because no one is forcing anyone to buy snake oil, these constant screams from the trenches on the other side say more about the screamers than anything else.
It turns out something like "look how smart we are!".
And this is always funny.

People take issue with it because it's inherently deceitful to sell snake oil products. Just because unprovable claims can stimulate certain people to truly believe and manifest a difference in their mind through placebo doesn't justify their existence.

And how are you so sure that the comment you just made here is also not being made to self serve your own ego no different from how you perceive others to have done so with theirs?

 

[egellings]

I like that! In contemporary use the word dogma seems to have a negative connotation. Some synonyms are "principle", "ethic", and "precept", which all sound a little nicer to me. Maybe it's the fact that the word starts with 'dog' that makes it seem so negative, and yet people really like dogs.

I view dogma as unquestioned belief.

 

[robwpdx]

Sure it has been said, skin care. Skin is complex, individual environmental exposure. The complexity of products are rarely scientifically evaluated in blind trials.

No snake oil in audio can compete against the evil of snail and other creature beauty extracts. It is a horror movie.

 

[Timcognito]

Anything that is supposed to deter raccoons. I have tried every kind of lighting, spay OTC and home made, spike strips,etc. Some things work for a week or two but soon they walk right by it or climb around it. I have friend that had one of those inflatable floppy men that wave arms and bend legs that you see at car dealerships and soon the raccoons got used to it. If you know something that works let me know because I tried a lot of snakeoil from Amazon

 

[Tim Link]

I view dogma as unquestioned belief.

Usually there's a negative emotional response to any questioning. If there were no emotional attachment to certain beliefs, then it wouldn't be a problem to question them. The emotional response typically stems from a taught fear that the belief being questioned is a critical thing to believe to avoid terrible consequences. People are afraid of questions. That's really strange if you think about it.

 

[egellings]

Usually there's a negative emotional response to any questioning. If there were no emotional attachment to certain beliefs, then it wouldn't be a problem to question them. The emotional response typically stems from a taught fear that the belief being questioned is a critical thing to believe to avoid terrible consequences. People are afraid of questions. That's really strange if you think about it.

The holder of an unquestionable belief gets emotional when the unquestionable belief gets challenged.

 

[theREALdotnet]

Previgen. It's supposed to improve memory, but there is no proof it works.

And there are no first-hand accounts of its efficacy by actual sufferers, because they keep forgetting to take it.

 

[egellings]

And there are no first-hand accounts of its efficacy by actual sufferers, because they keep forgetting to take it.

Or they take it and forget what it was for!

 

[Ron Texas]

What was it that I was going to post?

 

[Spkrdctr]

In audio, as in all else, man's best friend is his dogma.

Yes, but my Dogma is better than your Dogma!

 

[egellings]

Yes, but my Dogma is better than your Dogma!

O-o-oh! Dem's fightin' woids!

 

[Hatto]

Getting back to the original question, any product related to:
1. Zodiac/horoscopes/astrology(!)
2. Minerals/crystals (except for purely decorative purposes)
3. Essential oils (except those for pure olfactory pleasure) - literally, how closer can you get to snake oil?

 

[Tim Link]

O-o-oh! Dem's fightin' woids!

Let's put them dogmas in a pit and watch 'em fight.

 

[Tim Link]

Horoscopes? Tarot cards? Fortunetellers? The Farmer's Almanac? Nostradamus? Ouija boards? Movies about elves, dragons, hobbits, and unicorns? Hypnotism? Stonehenge?

The power of suggestion can be a mighty strange thing.

Stories about elves, dragons, leprechauns, Princess Zeldas, etc. are sold as fantasy, so I don't think they should qualify as snake oil. I do think a lot about why I'm so attracted to fantasy narratives. These kinds of stories add a richness to life for me, but why read a story about faeries and elves when there are all kinds of real people, and real insects, frogs, and other little and big critters in the world, some of which even glow in the dark? I like to read about the real thing too, but the imagining of magical beings seems to delight some emotional aspect of me despite the fact that my logical side finds it absurd.

 

[Hatto]

My generalized definition of "hi-fi snake oil": A product that offers no tangible benefits, being deceptively marketed and sold as a solution to a perceived or invented problem, usually through made-up claims of obscure pseudo-technical or supra-natural complexion.

 

[MudFlap]

Yes, but my Dogma is better than your Dogma!

My Karma backed-over my Dogma.


... a sad day, indeed.

 

[egellings]

My Karma backed-over my Dogma.


... a sad day, indeed.

Were you driving?

 

[MudFlap]

Were you driving?

maybe ?

 

[beagleman]

I think the best advice I could give to someone who is down on modern art, btw, is to go and see/experience some of it in person. Because, in much the same way that you cannot fully experience good audio without the room, you also cannot really fully appreciate a sculpture, or installation, or painting unless you can experience it on site, or in situ. Looking at photos someone else posted on the web is just no substitute for actually being there, and experiencing it for yourself.

I visited the Andy Warhol multi story art museum in Pittsburgh Pa, was quite underwhelmed by his "Art" but was fairly impressed with the building itself.

Home | The Andy Warhol Museum

Warhol for All

www.warhol.org

Teen daughter summed it up, after being quite tired of the place, by blurting out to one of the "workers" that are strategically placed around each floor "Why are we wasting our time looking at this stuff, its just stupid junk, and you are standing there, acting like it is something special, its not!"