Very Nice Cheap Kit Speakers: HiVi/Swans DIY 2.2A & 3.1

[RickS]

Don't worry, I will post soon the frequency response graphs with the stock crossover, the frd and zma files of the speaker and a new crossover design

Welcome to ASR!

Look forward to seeing your measurements.

 

[D!sco]

I've decided to go through the data Scott Sehlin posted on the 3.1's years ago. I want to create an EQ alternative to his crossover changes that creates a flat on-axis response and is not room dependent. To do this, I merged his nearfield data with a box simulation accurate enough for our purposes.

I would argue that the crossover is well enough designed, it's just wrong. The resistances are silly and the tuning is extremely bright. We all know this, we've all seen it, it's been discussed to death. Here's my simulation, done similarly to Scott's, but in VCAD.

It's bright.

And if I throw in the estimated driver separation, our phase looks pretty great, I must say.

There are all sorts of variations, highlighted in green (but not run through the optimizer) that Scott made to the original crossover with incremental improvement.







However, I'm sure the stock crossover can support equalization for tone. Starting with the stock crossover, I have a 6-band PEQ that can flatten the tone, and a 5-band PEQ that will tilt it for an extremely high preference score without a sub, for a total of 11 bands. It would make sense to ignore the 128hz EQ and simply correct for your room below 500hz, especially since the data here is simulated. I have previously shared my REW data and in-room response. This bookshelf can play 40hz in-room very well and very loudly. I am constantly impressed by this woofer.





A very worthwhile investment for the speaker quality. My old REW distortion measurements were at -60dB even as high as 110dB SPL in-room. I haven't seen a better deal in audio. JBL LSR-308's sound better at low volumes, but can't touch the SPL levels these reach. Dynamics are fabulous. Mine pull double duty as home theater mains and my main listening stereo. I keep thinking of bass boxes as stands and I'm nearly settled on the SB29NRX75-6 in series. With a bit of boost they hit 20hz no problem.

 

[Gabbocasa]

Welcome to ASR!

Look forward to seeing your measurements.

finally the measurements are completed.
tools list:
-motu m4
-aiyima a07
-smsl a300
-isemcon EMX-7150
measurement are taken in room with room eq, woofer and port nearfield measurement.

stock crossover:

definitive crossover:
10ohm resistors on the woofer are 20w, the 10 ohm resistor on the tweeter is 5w;
on the woofer use a 0.8mH inductor (jantzen ferrite core 0,8mH - 1,0mm, 0,182ohm rdc) less resistance is better.

Lastly a crossover based on the original one but it has not been tested or measured.

Regarding the THD you can give 18v to the tweeter without any particular distortion, and more than 22v on the woofer.

These are the changes made to the cabinet:
6mm chamfering on the baffle
2mm CTK bitomous dampening material
CTK CaiMat 8 500x400mm

 

[Poultrygeist]

Four years have past since I built the Swan HiVi 2.2's and I'm still as impressed as ever. I doubt any kit speaker comes close for their price. The box they came in was so heavy it took hand trucks to get them into my garage. I've built several kit speakers but none used 3/4" MDF and came with quality components. I currently power them with a Fosi ZA3 using a Wiim mini streaming into an Audio GD DAC/Pre.

 

[Poultrygeist]

 

[Tinker]

#1 Happy as well with my Swan 3.1. These kits may be the best value in all of audio. Amazingly good sound.

 

[GGroch]

HiVi-Swan's U.S. Importer has just listed on Amazon an interesting 6.5" passive two way FINISHED speaker the D3.1 MKII that appears to be an update of the no longer sold DIY 2.2. Or perhaps, an update of the Swans D2.1SE finished speaker on which the DIY 2.2 seems to have been based. Woofer and Tweeter appear quite similar, to the 2.2, the weight is close to the same, the D3.1 MKII is an inch or so taller and deeper. At $550 a pair it is twice the price of the DIY 2.2, but the D2.1SE sold for $1000 in 2008, so perhap

s a bargain. Pretty I think. perhaps it is a deal.

 

[Poultrygeist]

HiVi-Swan's U.S. Importer has just listed on Amazon an interesting 6.5" passive two way FINISHED speaker the D3.1 MKII that appears to be an update of the no longer sold DIY 2.2. Or perhaps, an update of the Swans D2.1SE finished speaker on which the DIY 2.2 seems to have been based. Woofer and Tweeter appear quite similar, to the 2.2, the weight is close to the same, the D3.1 MKII is an inch or so taller and deeper. At $550 a pair it is twice the price of the DIY 2.2, but the D2.1SE sold for $1000 in 2008, so perhapView attachment 458245s a bargain. Pretty I think. perhaps it is a deal.

One of the most enjoyable aspects of kit speakers is the pride one gains in building it yourself. I grew up in a different generation when building model airplanes was a big deal. With the current need for instant gratification fewer seem interested in the patience required for DIY.

 

[GGroch]

One of the most enjoyable aspects of kit speakers is the pride one gains in building it yourself....

I totally agree. But DIY speakers are in any case an oddity.

On one hand, from the manufacturer's perspective my guess is the cost of configuring, manufacturing, shipping full flat pack kit speakers is nearly equal to that of assembling and shipping finished speakers. This is particularly true when you consider the higher likelihood of mistakes, failures, returns on the buyers part. The particularly low cost of the two HiVi kits makes them remarkable in this respect.

From the buyer's perspective; pride, the ability to tweak X-overs and create bespoke finishes makes it tremendously rewarding. When I started this thread in 2019 I was not quite so aware of how much expectation bias impacts hearing. Just like the rituals required to play LP records necessarily sharpens focus and appreciation, the process of building DIY speakers almost guarantees that they will sound even better to the proud owner than they objectively measure.

Still the D3.1 MKII referenced above is an interesting speaker. I can find no reference to this model anywhere besides the just posted Amazon listing, and competitive 6.5" 2-ways of this build quality (ie, cast woofers, 23 lb ea weight) seem to start around $700-900 a pair.