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Upgrading Stereo Genelecs to Surround dilemma, Unbalanced signal at long length or new Subwoofer?? Or other solution??

Thorskin

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I plan to expand my new Genelec 8030 stereo system by getting some 8010s for the center and surrounds but I think I may have a problem.

The rear 8010s will need around 20-25m of cable to reach the AVR because it has to go around the room. (No other option)

My AVR preouts are RCA so I will need to use XLR to RCA cables which will no longer be balanced.

Is 20-25m to far for an unbalanced signal?

What are my options here?

I am considering replacing my BK XLS300 subwoofer with a Genelec 7050 (£700) because it has XLR inputs.

If I place the 7050 near the AVR then the 20-25m surround signal can remain balanced until the subwoofer, then from the subwoofer to the AVR I can do the remaining 1-2m with an unbalanced XLR to RCA.

Are there any other alternative solutions?

How about something to intercept the balanced signal at 20-25m and then change it to a Unbalanced RCA? Like a Little Bear MC2/MC3 or a Nobsound NS05P??
Will that work?
 

Sancus

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I realize it may be the only thing that will fit, but the 8010 is severely underpowered for a HT speaker. Keep your expectations low. It can't even play 86dB comfortably with a sub. And the center bears the largest load of any speaker.
 

Blumlein 88

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I've used a setup similar to your description with 15 meter (50 feet) cables going RCA to XLR. I used the Monoprice Premier adapter cables. Everything worked nicely. I did at one point use a very cheap XLR with an adapter on the end for RCA. It picked up too much noise. That XLR had no shielding where the Monoprice had a layer of braided shield and a layer of foil shielding. I've tried other XLR's just to see and if they have some shielding they are okay with RCA feeding them.
 

markb

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Most likely you’ll be fine with good quality, properly shielded cable. I’ve had good luck with it in multiple setups so far.

Just try it. If really needed, you can always resort to converting to a balanced connection near the source, later - at the price of a converter box.
 
OP
Thorskin

Thorskin

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I realize it may be the only thing that will fit, but the 8010 is severely underpowered for a HT speaker. Keep your expectations low. It can't even play 86dB comfortably with a sub. And the center bears the largest load of any speaker.
That's a shame, the 8010s are most likely the only ones that will fit and allow my TV to be pulled out (it's on an wall mounted arm).
Is it mostly due to volume that it is not suitable?
Our room is quite small and we don't listen very loud. We would be sitting about 1.5-2m away from the center speaker.
 
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Thorskin

Thorskin

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Just try it. If really needed, you can always resort to converting to a balanced connection near the source, later - at the price of a converter box.
That's a good idea, my worry was id be stuck with a cable that is useless.
I thought Unbalanced can not be converted back to balanced.
 
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Thorskin

Thorskin

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I've used a setup similar to your description with 15 meter (50 feet) cables going RCA to XLR. I used the Monoprice Premier adapter cables. Everything worked nicely. I did at one point use a very cheap XLR with an adapter on the end for RCA. It picked up too much noise. That XLR had no shielding where the Monoprice had a layer of braided shield and a layer of foil shielding. I've tried other XLR's just to see and if they have some shielding they are okay with RCA feeding them.
Oh nice, I wonder if it's worth learning how to solder a cable to insure I get a cable with quality components. I'm finding it hard to buy a premade cable like that at the length I need.
 

Frgirard

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I plan to expand my new Genelec 8030 stereo system by getting some 8010s for the center and surrounds but I think I may have a problem.

The rear 8010s will need around 20-25m of cable to reach the AVR because it has to go around the room. (No other option)

My AVR preouts are RCA so I will need to use XLR to RCA cables which will no longer be balanced.

Is 20-25m to far for an unbalanced signal?

What are my options here?

I am considering replacing my BK XLS300 subwoofer with a Genelec 7050 (£700) because it has XLR inputs.

If I place the 7050 near the AVR then the 20-25m surround signal can remain balanced until the subwoofer, then from the subwoofer to the AVR I can do the remaining 1-2m with an unbalanced XLR to RCA.

Are there any other alternative solutions?

How about something to intercept the balanced signal at 20-25m and then change it to a Unbalanced RCA? Like a Little Bear MC2/MC3 or a Nobsound NS05P??
Will that work?

This product could help you for 55 euro in thomman website
https://www.klarkteknik.com/product.html?modelCode=P0CN6
 

Koeitje

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For the subwoofer I wouldn't bother with XLR, I run a 15m shielded single-ended cable (bluejeans Belkin coax blabla, don't know the exact one since I have had it for 10 years now) and never had issues with that.
 

Blumlein 88

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Oh nice, I wonder if it's worth learning how to solder a cable to insure I get a cable with quality components. I'm finding it hard to buy a premade cable like that at the length I need.
You can get a short XLR to RCA cable. Then put together XLR to XLR cables to get the length you need leading from the XLR end of the first cable.

I'd probably break into at least two pieces. Maybe a 10 meter and 15 meter set you connect together. Doing this you could use the Monoprice cable quite inexpensively. You could go up market a bit getting some Worlds Best Cable on Amazon. You get quality Neutrik or Amphenol connectors, Canare or Mogami cabling. All at a not terribly high price. Also might look at Audioblast XLR cables.

Or Redco will custom make your cable or sell you the components.
https://www.redco.com/Custom-Cable.html
 
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Thorskin

Thorskin

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You can get a short XLR to RCA cable. Then put together XLR to XLR cables to get the length you need leading from the XLR end of the first cable.

I'd probably break into at least two pieces. Maybe a 10 meter and 15 meter set you connect together. Doing this you could use the Monoprice cable quite inexpensively. You could go up market a bit getting some Worlds Best Cable on Amazon. You get quality Neutrik or Amphenol connectors, Canare or Mogami cabling. All at a not terribly high price. Also might look at Audioblast XLR cables.

Or Redco will custom make your cable or sell you the components.
https://www.redco.com/Custom-Cable.html
Oh I see, so the majority of the length will be balanced until it reaches the short XLR to RCA length.
Am I understanding correctly?
Or would it just work as a long length of unbalanced cable but it's short enough to be fine anyway?
 

markb

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The latter, more or less. The extra “cold” conductor (compared to a normal RCA cable) is grounded at the RCA connector end of the RCA-XLR cable, which is still better than a fully unbalanced RCA-RCA connection.

But the long XLR-XLR cable is also capable of running fully balanced in the future should you upgrade your equipment or put in an unbalanced-balanced converter. Most likely you won’t need to.
 
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