• WANTED: Happy members who like to discuss audio and other topics related to our interest. Desire to learn and share knowledge of science required. There are many reviews of audio hardware and expert members to help answer your questions. Click here to have your audio equipment measured for free!

Topping Pre90 Review (preamplifier)

I have not opened mine up (yet), but this begs the question: how hard might it be to relocate the IR receiver?

My simple solution so far is to turn the Topping stack about 25 degrees counterclockwise as viewed from above in my audio rack. :cool:

Topping should and can address this very, very easily, it’s just a minor PCB layout correction.

It has nothing to do with the volume knob, which is far enough from the display in order to be able to shade the remote control receiver.

The only reason why the remote works much better, almost flawless, when aimed at an angle from the left hand side of the Pre90 unit has to do with the fact that only from that position the remote can “see” the IR receiver which is otherwise blocked by the metal around the display on its right.

That happens because the IR receiver is placed on the right hand side of the display (see picture above) and, due to a layout error on the PCB (Printed Circuit Board), where this IR receiver is soldered to, there is a misalignment between the little window on the display screen intended for the receiver and the receiver itself, the latter being placed too far to the right, sitting partially behind the metal of the case which can block any incoming IR signal depending on the remote position, as I’ve explained before.
 
Last edited:
And we can hope that they will!

As I have one that is what has been delivered thus far, maybe a little time with my soldering station and perhaps a dab of silicone...
 
And we can hope that they will!

As I have one that is what has been delivered thus far, maybe a little time with my soldering station and perhaps a dab of silicone...

The IR extender/repeater has cost me $1… so, not much can justify having the trouble, not even from an aesthetics point of view!
 
I don’t know if this has been addressed already but I can now confirm that the IR remote issue on the Pre90 is indeed a design flaw which places the IR receiver sensor misaligned with its display window (see 1-3 from Pic1), to the point it gets partially blocked by the metal part of the case, next to the display, on the right hand side of the unit (when one is facing it). So, an external IR extender/repeater was needed from which I could place its emitter part directly aimed at the still visible part of the Pre90 IR sensor, over the display (see Pic 2 below).

Pic1 - Topping Pre90 front panel:
View attachment 378751

Pic 2 - IR repeater’s sensor above the volume knob and emitter directly over the display (note that the IR repeater’s emitter had to be tilted to cover as much of the Pre90 sensor’s exposed part as possible):

View attachment 378752
1720069401602.png


The thingy on the display looks lie a tadpole
 
I had to do something similar (only I have the extender mounted the other way with scotch tape - I'm surprised this works for you) with both of my Pre90s and both of my DM7s in order to get IR working consistently.

It’s supposed to work the way I have it installed and the fact is, it really works!

Moreover, I have experienced no IR remote issues whatsoever with the D70 Pro Sabre DAC as its display is not recessed on the metal case, if so ever slightly, like it happens on the Pre90. On the contrary, the D70 has a protruding display!

And, I’m not aware of this issue with the D90 III Sabre either, which has similar display configuration to the Pre90, most probably because the remote receiver is mounted farther apart from the metal contour of the display and is not misaligned with its display window as well:

1720092804890.png
 
Last edited:
It has nothing to do with the volume knob, which is far enough from the display in order to be able to shade the remote control receiver.

The only reason why the remote works much better, almost flawless, when aimed at an angle from the left hand side of the Pre90 unit has to do with the fact that only from that position the remote can “see” the IR receiver which is otherwise blocked by the metal around the display on its right.

That happens because the IR receiver is placed on the right hand side of the display (see picture above) and, due to a layout error on the PCB (Printed Circuit Board), where this IR receiver is soldered to, there is a misalignment between the little window on the display screen intended for the receiver and the receiver itself, the latter being placed too far to the right, sitting partially behind the metal of the case which can block any incoming IR signal depending on the remote position, as I’ve explained before.
I’m usually wrong! Thanks for confirming that. I wonder if Topping would repair this defect under warranty?
 
I don’t know if this has been addressed already but I can now confirm that the IR remote issue on the Pre90 is indeed a design flaw which places the IR receiver sensor misaligned with its display window (see 1-3 from Pic1), to the point it gets partially blocked by the metal part of the case, next to the display, on the right hand side of the unit (when one is facing it). So, an external IR extender/repeater was needed from which I could place its emitter part directly aimed at the still visible part of the Pre90 IR sensor, over the display (see Pic 2 below).

Pic1 - Topping Pre90 front panel:
View attachment 378751

Pic 2 - IR repeater’s sensor above the volume knob and emitter directly over the display (note that the IR repeater’s emitter had to be tilted to cover as much of the Pre90 sensor’s exposed part as possible):

View attachment 378752

Thanks for the pics and explanations!

Is there a reliable way to do that with 3 x Pre90 as a 5-channel preamp and have a single remote control that works flawlessly?
 
I have done it with 3 x Pre90s using an IR extender with multiple outputs. Works well enough but I would not say flawlessly.
 
I have done it with 3 x Pre90s using an IR extender with multiple outputs. Works well enough but I would not say flawlessly.

Does it just depend on the quality of the IR extender to have it work flawlessly? Maybe it is hard to find an IR extender with 3 or more outputs that works properly.

Also, did you have 1 remote control for the 3 x Pre90s and could the volume be adjusted simultaneously with 1 single button?
 
Does it just depend on the quality of the IR extender to have it work flawlessly?
??? I described what I did and went no further. I no longer have 2 Pre90s.
Maybe it is hard to find an IR extender with 3 or more outputs that works properly.
Maybe.
did you have 1 remote control for the 3 x Pre90s
Yes.
.....could the volume be adjusted simultaneously with 1 single button?
Sure. That's the point, isn't it?
 
This is a review and detailed measurements of the Topping Pre90 balanced and unbalanced preamplifier. It was kindly sent to me by the company. The base preamplifier with ability to switch between RCA and XLR inputs costs US $599. There is an extension that gives you four (4) more inputs (three balanced and one unbalanced) for another $250.

Splitting the functionality into two boxes is rather unique:

View attachment 98412

Unfortunately there is no immediately switch to select an input. You have to cycle through them using the "SEL" button on the left.

Remote control is provided for volume which in turn mandated relay based stepped attenuator which is quite a "high-end" feature. For any kind of home system use remote is mandatory in my book so it is great to see it implemented here. There are other cool features like setting a pre-input gain or maximum safe playback level.

The back panel shows the unusual configuration with the umbilical cord connecting the two:

View attachment 98413

As you see mains power supply is built-into it as it should in this price category.

Overall fit and finish is very good.

For my testing I exclusively focused on XLR input and output.

Topping Pre90 Measurements
As usual I setup preamplifiers for "unity gain" meaning what voltage I put in, is what comes out. On Pre90 that meant setting the volume to -6 dB instead of zero. That gives us this eye popping output:

View attachment 98414

Distortion is whopping -25 dB lower than best case threshold of hearing. Combined noise+distortion as represented by SINAD is 5 dB better than said threshold. And this includes the noise from my analyzer. Likely the actual performance is fair bit better.

Suspecting some of the good noise figure comes at the expense of lower than normal input impedance, I jacked up the default 40 ohm output impedance of my Audio Precision analyzer to 200 ohm. The result was that the output from the Pre90 dropped down to 3.6 volts (instead of 4). One click on the volume control compensated for that nicely and give me the same good performance just as well:

View attachment 98416

So there is really no penalty to the lower input impedance.

I wanted to test the effect of the external box so I selected one of its inputs and ran the dashboard again (with 40 ohm impedance);

View attachment 98424

As you see the external input works just as excellently as the internal input.

EDIT: here is the RCA performance:
View attachment 98630

Signal to noise ratio (combined with my analyzer input) is 21 bits and rises to almost 22 bits with full volume:
View attachment 98429

Note that Topping advertises much higher numbers. They do that by using a noise amplifier, measuring the results with AP, and then dividing the output by the gain of the noise amplifier. By doing so the remove the effect of Audio Precision analyzer's self noise and get much higher SNR. That is customary in chip industry. For us to keep things consistent we will continue to test as we have as any performance above what I am showing is academic anyway.

Note that the Pre90 can go up to +10 dB gain. Doing so though has a penalty in overall noise. To show the effect of output level/gain, here is a sweep:

View attachment 98435

As you see you can get to 8 volts while maintaining the full performance of the preamp. There is more gain left if you want to drive an amplifier like Benchmark AHB2 in low gain or Purifi without its input buffer.

Frequency response is almost flat to 80 kHz:
View attachment 98436

There is a bit more droop in my measurements vs Topping. Not sure why but it is immaterial.

Crosstalk was more than good enough for what we need but shy of the best that can be done:

View attachment 98438

Intermodulation distortion test is as good as the best I have tested, the Benchmark HPA4:
View attachment 98439

Same is the case for SINAD vs frequency:

View attachment 98440

Conclusions
Seems like the revolution we have had in high performance headphone amplifiers has bled into preamplifiers. I love it because I have a Reel Reel tape deck that I like to use occasionally in my system along with my usual DAC. Sadly hardly any premplifier could keep up with said DAC so I was degrading the performance of it to have the ability to play another analog source. With the Pre90, that compromise is no more. It is an instrument grade, more transparent than transparent, preamplifier. Other than Benchmark HPA4, I don't think it has an equal no matter how much money you spend. In that regard, it is quite a value as well although obviously not "cheap" as compared to desktop products.

It is my pleasure to strongly recommend the Topping Pre90. If you needed to have another source beside your DAC to play in your system, you now have a wonderful way to accomplish that with zero impact on performance.

------------
As always, questions, comments, recommendations, etc. are welcome.

Any donations are much appreciated using: https://www.audiosciencereview.com/forum/index.php?threads/how-to-support-audio-science-review.8150/
I cannot find the remote. I want to set the pre to in : RCA - out : RCA. I press the volume control. But it seems impossible. The info sheet doesn't say anything specific. !
 
I cannot find the remote. I want to set the pre to in : RCA - out : RCA. I press the volume control. But it seems impossible. The info sheet doesn't say anything specific. !
Seems pretty specific:
Screenshot_20240811-101020_Drive.png
Screenshot_20240811-101219_Drive.png

Pressing the multifunction button cycles through the inputs
Pressing the volume knob cycles through the outputs.
 
Have been using this Preamp for sometime now and have been happy with it fed from the VMVD1SE DAC. The itch to upgrade does come knocking every now and then and so here is the question: Is there anything the Market that people have tried that's decisively better than the Pre90 for straight up XLR based Preamp functions? Technology does usually come further in the time since their Preamp was released...hence the question.

The Pre90 is feeding a NAD M23 Amp to a pair of KEF R11 Metas and a pair of KF92 subs and I always keep wondering if the Preamp being the cheapest, could be a weak link, not that it sounds like one. Thanks

PS. I got a Phillips universal remote and I've programmed it as my VMV DAC's and the Pre90 Remote. Pretty much solves the problem around this remote agony...
 
In Topping product life cycles, this is positively prehistoric. Maybe after the launch of their new DACs, power amps etc a new version will be released, so maybe hang on a while? I can't see a new Pre90 sounding any different though but maybe it would have some useful features, better display etc.

By the way, how are you connecting your subs? I have a single KEF KC62 connected to the Pre90 RCA outputs. Maybe sub outs, would be a good upgrade, if Topping are taking notice.
 
Back
Top Bottom