Steve Wozniak weighs in on right to repair

[SIY]

Duopoly ...

Yes, this is the inevitable result of blocking competition. Of course, we can't repair a service anyway, as opposed to a purchased product, so this is a chalk and cheese comparison.

 

[Wes]

a cheesier comparison might be John Deere tractors, but they are not consumer items

 

[Ron Texas]

A recent article in Gizmodo suggests that smart gadgets will all be leased, and soon. This would circumvent any right to repair issues. As it is now, the manufacturer decides how many software updates you get anyway.

 

[jsrtheta]

it will get struck down if that happens.

Not sure how it could get struck down.

 

[jsrtheta]

I support the right to repair, but I would rather see it handled through legislation than executive order.

Practically nothing gets handled through legislation anymore. I will refrain from saying why I think that's so.

 

[Blumlein 88]

A recent article in Gizmodo suggests that smart gadgets will all be leased, and soon. This would circumvent any right to repair issues. As it is now, the manufacturer decides how many software updates you get anyway.

Google Fi already offers a phone like that. I came pretty close to taking the deal. You get it cheaper as a subscription (not a lease in this case, but hardware subscription). After two years you keep paying the same subscription fee and they upgrade your gear with the equivalent to your device at that time. If they'd offered it on a slightly better phone I would have done it.

 

[Rottmannash]

it will get struck down if that happens.

How can an executive order be struck down?

 

[SIY]

How can an executive order be struck down?

Courts do that routinely.

 

[restorer-john]

as an example how many high speed internet options are available to you??

Here we have FTTN and then it runs on the old copper to the house. Various resellers you can sign up with. Our house is 1600m (1.6km) from the nearest node. We had a test and it was no better than the fixed wireless where we bounce the signal off a base station 16km away on the border ranges.

So I stuck with the wireless. The company is decent, the service works well and I'm not dependant on wires in the ground or hanging from poles. Plus we are (or were til they got bought out) supporting a small company with real people to answer the phone who put their infrastructure in places the "big" guys deemed uneconomic.

 

[MakeMineVinyl]

Google Fi already offers a phone like that. I came pretty close to taking the deal. You get it cheaper as a subscription (not a lease in this case, but hardware subscription). After two years you keep paying the same subscription fee and they upgrade your gear with the equivalent to your device at that time. If they'd offered it on a slightly better phone I would have done it.

Didn't (or doesn't) Apple do something like this? Not an Apple fan myself.

 

[restorer-john]

I think if companies deliberately attempt to circumvent right to repair edicts, by some leasing tactic, the FTC will hit them from a different angle. The entire shift to repairable/sustainable gear will be a fight, but it's not going away.

https://www.ftc.gov/news-events/pre...examines-anti-competitive-repair-restrictions

The FTC's report is attached:

 

[matt3421]

How can an executive order be struck down?

the courts. something like this will definitely need to go through congress

 

[Robin L]

We can test various apple pies to see which has the best SINAD.

Let's see if there's a Sheri's near Amir, they have a great apple pie:

 

[Blumlein 88]

I think if companies deliberately attempt to circumvent right to repair edicts, by some leasing tactic, the FTC will hit them from a different angle. The entire shift to repairable/sustainable gear will be a fight, but it's not going away.

I don't know. If like Fi you subscribe to regularly updated hardware with warranty at all times you don't care about repairs. That's Fi's problem or at least it will seem that way for consumers. That's a trade many people will take.

 

[restorer-john]

That's a trade many people will take.

Probably for a while, for some people. That is, until it becomes something to be ashamed of, and publicly ridiculed to be wasteful. I've never seen such a world-wide embracing of recycling, upcycling, op-shopping, giant thrift stores, repair cafes etc. The scale is enormous.

All the teenagers I know (my son's friends) have jobs but don't want newish model 2nd hand cars. They want older ones they can fix up, buy parts for and tinker with. They wouldn't be seen dead in a brand new car- it's not cool.

 

[SIY]

All the teenagers I know (my son's friends) have jobs but don't want newish model 2nd hand cars. They want older ones they can fix up, buy parts for and tinker with. They wouldn't be seen dead in a brand new car- it's not cool.

It's nice to have a choice.

 

[Wes]

the courts. something like this will definitely need to go through congress

this seems confused

a federal court can strike down an agency rule-making if it fails to comply with a statute passed by Congress (like the Admin. Procedures Act) or the Constitution

similarly, a federal court can strike down a statute passed by Congress if it fails to comply with the Constitution

I've never heard of an exc. order of this nature being struck down

this EO tells several agencies to begin the rule-making process in this area

an EO can be modified or withdrawn by this president or a subsequent one

 

[restorer-john]

I noticed this sneaky little line in a John Deere comment:

2%? Right. You can bet the diagnostic software will need to check for updates which will now be pushed through at an increased pace, whether the updates are necessary or not. They'll be no ability to diagnose, fix, reset and operate, unless the required software and diag tool are authorised as "up to date". I think it will be a real expensive mess for farmers for a while.

 

[Helicopter]

I think they will have a problem leasing and selling subscriptions with certain significant groups of consumers. No way I am getting any smart gear I don't own. I don't care if it costs more to own it. That is wishful thinking by the sellers. I rent vacation cars and rooms, maybe a banquet hall. I am not going to rent electronics or sign any delayed payment contract for electronics.

Electronics companies can easily make stuff hard to repair if they want by using chips, adhesives, etc.

The military is especially well equipped to demand repairability, spares, etc. I am a bit surprised that is a controversial problem after my years in aerospace/defense.

Deere, go to the breadbasket and see what the farmers who make America a net exporter of corn and soy are doing. Sit in a Deere combine for a day. I had a great Kubota tractor, but you're not going to harvest 3000 arces in a season with one... more like 30 acres if you are relatively serious.

It sucks that stuff has gotten harder to repair. Hopefully consumers and governments demand better in some market segments.

 

[Tks]

Was there ever any doubt that the great unwashed is guided by pleasure and pain only? Only in the equality infected brain could this harsh sounding truth be denied.
Being in the decadence part of the civilizational cycle just makes it more obvious.

Not intelligent enough to come to such a conclusion. Not whether pain/pleasure is the guiding factor, but whether people find pleasure worthy of pursuit when knowing perhaps they're causing lots of pain at the end of the equation. I'm agnostic due to ignorance, and don't presume my superficial observations are enough to draw an appreciable conclusion.