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Spinorama Data is Not Available for Dynaudio LYD 48. LYD 5 Has a High Preference Score But Was Not Recommended by Amir. Are the 48'S Good Monitors?

Albert190

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Hello:

I'm new to the forum and am not a professional audio or recording engineer, just someone who values accurate, detailed, transparent speakers, with great transient response and clarity, especially active ones, which I have, the Quad L12 Actives which have served me very well, but which I am considering upgrading from.

I know the Dynaudio LYD 48's have not been reviewed by any site with access to the Klippel, and although the LYD 5's were reviewed by Amir and received a very high preference score, ultimately they were not recommended by Amir.

That being said, I am still considering buying the LYD 48's, as personal speakers to be used in my living room for listening to music.

I know that listening to speakers on YouTube does not give one an accurate representation of what a speaker might sound like in person, but I have listened to the LYD 48's on several YouTube Videos with good microphones used in the recording and capable engineers making the recordings and admittedly, knowing the limitations of such recordings, have been very impressed with the sound of these speakers.

They are very transparent, clear, and detailed, and to my ears, simply sound like the speakers I might want to own, being fully cognizant that listening to speakers on YouTube is not at all the best way to audition a speaker and may be one of the worst.

To the people who have listened to the LYD 48's in person, what was your impression of them?

I have looked at the graphs provided by Dynaudio for the LYD 48's versus the LYD 5's, and the two sets of graphs to this relative novice, appear similar, with the LYD 48's being superior due to their size and 3 way design, which gives me some level of confidence that it they were undergo Klipple testing, they would do as well, if not better, than the LYD 5's tested by Amir.

I also realize that there has been some controversy that when the LYD 5's were tested by Amir using Klippel, many members of this forum thought that the correct DSP bass setting has not been used, resulting in worse bass performance and low frequency extension than would have otherwise been possible, and thus lowering the preference ratings and Amir's recommendations of these speakers.

Another question I have is how would the lack of waveguides in the Dynaudio LYD series of speakers affect the use of these speakers for home, living room use, for listening to music? Would the effect on directivity be possibly a positive or a negative?

Again, I am not an audio engineer, just someone who appreciates the superiority of active speaks and their benefits in particular with respect to active over passive crossovers, and who would like to purchase a pro monitor type speaker for audiophile use.

I have listened to the Neumann KH120 II and thought those speakers were even better than my Quad 12L actives, but ultimately I am searching for larger speakers, preferably a three way design.

Can anyone offer any advice, suggestions, or the benefit of their experience with the LYD 48's to help me make an informed decision, which I would greatly appreciate.

Are there any other pro monitor speakers in the same price range I should consider.

Will the LYD 48's provide adequate volume (I do not listen to music at ear splitting levels but would like enough 'reserve' so that peaks in SPL are handled accurately gracefully without compression). Note that my living room is about 11 feet by 20, feet, and my listening position would be about 8 to 9 feet from the speakers.

Do the LYD 48's compress at high volumes?

Are the LYD 48's excellent pro monitors which for whatever reasons just haven't been reviewed very much?

Please note that I have a beast of a subwoofer, an older Mirage with two 12 inch drivers, with 1,000 watts of power, and which must weigh 100 pounds that I will use with any speakers I buy.

Thank you very much.
 

kemmler3D

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listening to speakers on YouTube is not at all the best way to audition a speaker and may be one of the worst.
I will agree with that part. ;)

I haven't heard the Dynaudio, but since you are using a sub, you should probably focus on performance >80hz and clean directivity. The dynaudio looks okay in that regard but Genelec and Neumann will be somewhat better. (NB: You would do well to get another sub and/or do room EQ with the "ASR standard" of UMIK + REW. It's the simply best $100 you can spend on sound quality for anyone who has speakers better than a JBL Extreme. ;))

You are right to question the lack of waveguide. Listening further away (8-9 feet counts) from the speaker will tend to make that more of a problem.

Given your budget and preferences, IMO you should also consider Genelec. You could get the 8040 new or possibly some 8050s used for around the same money.

I would also not place too much weight on Amir's recommendation. His biggest contribution is sharing and interpreting the measurements. He renders an opinion for those that want it. But it's best to consider each measurement and judge how much it influences YOUR opinion.

Lastly, if you can possibly hear any of these speakers in person, that's best of all. Listening to speakers on Youtube is no better than trying to pick out paint colors on Youtube. You can get a rough idea, AT BEST.

Also, welcome to ASR! :)
 
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fpitas

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I know that listening to speakers on YouTube does not give one an accurate representation of what a speaker might sound like in person, but I have listened to the LYD 48's on several YouTube Videos with good microphones used in the recording and capable engineers making the recordings and admittedly, knowing the limitations of such recordings, have been very impressed with the sound of these speakers.
Around here we think that listening on YouTube is worth as much as you paid.
 

SuicideSquid

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I've used the LYD 7s and was generally impressed with them. I think the main issue with the LYD series is the crossovers are quite high which can lead to some directivity (though this may be less of an issue with the 48 and its 3-way design), and you can generally get better performance for the money from Genelec or Neumann. But judged in a vacuum they're still fairly neutral, and personally, I think they're a much nicer-looking speaker than most other monitors, so if you're going to be putting them in your living room, that counts for something.
 

Somafunk

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I have the Dynaudio Lyd 48’s with matching Dynaudio 18s sub which integrates perfectly due to DSP options on sub, been using them for 4 years and can heartily recommend them, mostly for electronic music and they get used every waking hour of the day (confined to house due to spms) for music, movies etc, can go very loud to uncomfortable levels in my 3.3m x 4.3 room, add in the effects of the thunderous sub and they empty your bowels quicker than a California Reaper phall curry.

51724319233_a597d2d68e_c.jpg


I think CountZero on this forum also has experience of the Lyd 48’s
 

dfuller

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Well wouldn't you know it, Dynaudio has a publicly available datasheet for them!

TLDR:
  • On-axis is flat enough.
  • Horizontal off axis is pretty messy, though the window is +/-90deg vs the 180deg that Amir does.

I matched the scaling to the KH310 and superimposed it:

lyd48kh310.png

It's definitely nowhere near as uniform but it isn't terrible either.
 
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voodooless

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Horizontal off axis is pretty messy
Any axis is messy actually. I would not go for these.

I have listened to the Neumann KH120 II and thought those speakers were even better than my Quad 12L actives, but ultimately I am searching for larger speakers, preferably a three way design.
Why not KH150?

You already have subs, so might be just fine:
29637-en-maximum_spl_at_1_m.svg

If you cross at 80 or 100Hz, you’ll still get over 100 dB.

The Dynaudio only has 80W on the woofer. I doubt it will go much louder.
 

dfuller

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FYI my criticism of Lyd 5 in listening tests was mostly in the bass region which wouldn't apply to the model you are looking at.
Probably closer to the Core 47, if I had to make a wild guess.
 

lowkeyoperations

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Any axis is messy actually. I would not go for these.


Why not KH150?

You already have subs, so might be just fine:
29637-en-maximum_spl_at_1_m.svg

If you cross at 80 or 100Hz, you’ll still get over 100 dB.

The Dynaudio only has 80W on the woofer. I doubt it will go much louder.
I don’t know what country everyone is in, but in Australia the KH150s are essentially double the price of the Dynaudios.
 

RobL

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Here I can get the Lyd48 for CAD$1480 and the KH150 (non AES) for CAD$1865.
 

dfuller

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I don’t know what country everyone is in, but in Australia the KH150s are essentially double the price of the Dynaudios.
here in the US there's about a $1000 difference ($2400 vs $3500 for a pair).
 

lowkeyoperations

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I wonder why the Neumanns are so expensive in Australia now?

Back when I bought my KH120s they were around $1800 for the pair.

The Kh120 mkii are rrp $3,400
The Kh150 are $5,400
LYD48s are $3,580

Depends a bit on the retailer, but here the KH120 mkii are basically the same price as the LYD48s. The 150s are significantly more.
 

Old Listener

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Hello:

I'm new to the forum and am not a professional audio or recording engineer, just someone who values accurate, detailed, transparent speakers, with great transient response and clarity, especially active ones, which I have, the Quad L12 Actives which have served me very well, but which I am considering upgrading from.

I know the Dynaudio LYD 48's have not been reviewed by any site with access to the Klippel, and although the LYD 5's were reviewed by Amir and received a very high preference score, ultimately they were not recommended by Amir.

That being said, I am still considering buying the LYD 48's, as personal speakers to be used in my living room for listening to music.

I know that listening to speakers on YouTube does not give one an accurate representation of what a speaker might sound like in person, but I have listened to the LYD 48's on several YouTube Videos with good microphones used in the recording and capable engineers making the recordings and admittedly, knowing the limitations of such recordings, have been very impressed with the sound of these speakers.

They are very transparent, clear, and detailed, and to my ears, simply sound like the speakers I might want to own, being fully cognizant that listening to speakers on YouTube is not at all the best way to audition a speaker and may be one of the worst.

To the people who have listened to the LYD 48's in person, what was your impression of them?

I have looked at the graphs provided by Dynaudio for the LYD 48's versus the LYD 5's, and the two sets of graphs to this relative novice, appear similar, with the LYD 48's being superior due to their size and 3 way design, which gives me some level of confidence that it they were undergo Klipple testing, they would do as well, if not better, than the LYD 5's tested by Amir.

I also realize that there has been some controversy that when the LYD 5's were tested by Amir using Klippel, many members of this forum thought that the correct DSP bass setting has not been used, resulting in worse bass performance and low frequency extension than would have otherwise been possible, and thus lowering the preference ratings and Amir's recommendations of these speakers.

Another question I have is how would the lack of waveguides in the Dynaudio LYD series of speakers affect the use of these speakers for home, living room use, for listening to music? Would the effect on directivity be possibly a positive or a negative?

Again, I am not an audio engineer, just someone who appreciates the superiority of active speaks and their benefits in particular with respect to active over passive crossovers, and who would like to purchase a pro monitor type speaker for audiophile use.

I have listened to the Neumann KH120 II and thought those speakers were even better than my Quad 12L actives, but ultimately I am searching for larger speakers, preferably a three way design.

Can anyone offer any advice, suggestions, or the benefit of their experience with the LYD 48's to help me make an informed decision, which I would greatly appreciate.

Are there any other pro monitor speakers in the same price range I should consider.

Will the LYD 48's provide adequate volume (I do not listen to music at ear splitting levels but would like enough 'reserve' so that peaks in SPL are handled accurately gracefully without compression). Note that my living room is about 11 feet by 20, feet, and my listening position would be about 8 to 9 feet from the speakers.

Do the LYD 48's compress at high volumes?

Are the LYD 48's excellent pro monitors which for whatever reasons just haven't been reviewed very much?

Please note that I have a beast of a subwoofer, an older Mirage with two 12 inch drivers, with 1,000 watts of power, and which must weigh 100 pounds that I will use with any speakers I buy.

Thank you very much.
I've used LYD48s in my main system for about 5 years. They are along the long wall in a 15' by 21' room which has mostly filled bookshelves on 3 walls. The LYDs are about 18" from the wall behind them. I sit about 9 feet from the speakers with a bookshelf 2 feet behind my chair.

My previous speakers were Waveform Mach 17s. They were active speakers with an external crossover built by Bryston to Waveform's specification. The speakers and the crossover cost $7000 and I spent a few thousand dollars more on 6 channels of power amplification. I consider the LYD48s to be a quite adequate satisfactory replacement for the much more expensive Waveforms.

I listen to mostly classical music with some early jazz/swing, broadway show soundtracks and great American songbook music. I normally listen at a 75 dB level but sometimes crank it up to low/mid 80 dB. I have not been conscious of compression on the peaks (which I think are never over 95 dB and mostly under 90dB.)

When I got the LYd48s, I used a close to the wall setting on the back of the speakers. The I used a microphone and REW software to examine the in-room response of the speakers. I eyeballed the resulting graphs and added 3 PEQ filters in the JRiver s/w that I use for playback. I would go though a similar process with any new speakers.

The measurements that Amir and others publish on ASR are a great source of factual information for me. I am always happy to use such information when it is available as part of the basis of my decisions. However, my decisions are always mine rather than anyone else's.

When I bought the LYD48s, very little such information was available on them. I found the LYD48 datasheet that Dynaudio provided. In my room, reflections from the wall close behind my listening chair will be louder and more significant than those from the much more distant side walls. The horizontal contour response graphs didn't show an irregularities in the 0 to 30 degree range.

I was aware of the Neumann KH310s at the time I decided on the LYD48s. I simply didn't want to spend almost twice as much on the Neumann speakers. I don't regret my choice.

So what's my advice to you?

If you will be listening at 75-low 80s levels, the LYD48s should work fine. If you want to listen with peaks at 95-100+ dB (above sub-woofer frequencies), look fro some with low distortion in the 96 dB measurements.

If you will be placing the speakers along the long wall, the LYD48s should work well.

If you will be placing the LYD48s well out in the room with the short wall behind them, you might consider speakers with narrower dispersion such as the Neumann KH150. Side wall reflections might be very significant in such an arrangement.

My room has a 9 foot ceiling and a Persian rug with an underlying pad on the floor. The irregularity in the LYD48 vertical response graph is not a big deal for me. If your room has a lower ceiling or a bare floor, you might look for speakers which use a waveguide to narrow vertical dispersion.


Good luck in your decision making.
 
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Albert190

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Thank you everyone who replied. All of your replies were very helpful.

When I look at the Klippel measurements by ASR for the Dynaudio LYD 5, to me, they don't not look so impressive, yet with an ideal subwoofer, the preference ratings with an idealized subwoofer are among the highest of any active speaker ever tested by this website.

Am I reading the Klippel measurements incorrectly, or is there something I have missed in interpreting this data?

My original reason for raising the question of how good are the Dynaudio LYD 48's is related to how high a preference rating with idealized subwoofers the LYD 5's received on ASR.

If the Dynaudio LYD 48's, which are Dynaudio's top of the line model for this series, were to be tested by ASR, would they most likely receive an even higher preference score than the LYD 5's, particularly when one compares the data sheets provided by Dynaudio regarding these two sets of speakers?

Datasheet provided by Dynaudio for LYD 5s:

https://14515867.fs1.hubspotusercontent-na1.net/hubfs/14515867/Datasheet/spec_for_lyd5_2017_pdf.pdf

Datasheet provided by Dynaudio for LYD 48s:

https://14515867.fs1.hubspotusercontent-na1.net/hubfs/14515867/Datasheet/spec_for_lyd48_2017pdf.pdf

How are the LYD 5's rated so highly without even having a wave guide which I thought was critically important to good directivity?

Thank you once again.
 

dfuller

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How are the LYD 5's rated so highly without even having a wave guide which I thought was critically important to good directivity?
Yes and no. The LYD 5 has generally okay off-axis behavior when it becomes directional above about 800hz. Note how it more or less narrows consistently as it increases in frequency?

Much more likely the LYD 48's behavior is closer to the Core 47, which is substantially rougher. There is the woofer:mid "one toothed comb filter" inherent to all 3 way speakers of this layout on top of poor mid:tweeter integration.

Compare the two:
1699565564052.png


1699565530398.png


Compare the Core 47 to the KH310, and you'll see what I mean. It still has that "one toothed comb" effect, but it is much reduced, and the mid:tweeter cross is far better behaved. I can see where the crossover is on the Core 47 because the radiation patterns don't match - I can't easily on the KH310.
1699565847669.png
 
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Albert190

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I just wanted to let everyone know what my decision was.

I decided to purchase the Genelec 8040B's. Even though they don't have built-in DSP, I have DSP through my AVR and intend to equalize these speakers, as well as use them with a subwoofer.

Thanks again to everyone who responded to my thread.

I think these speakers are a very good value for the money, particularly since I got them at a very good price -- open box and virtually brand new.
 

voodooless

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Congrats on the Genelecs. They are really excellent!
 

srrxr71

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I have the Dynaudio Lyd 48’s with matching Dynaudio 18s sub which integrates perfectly due to DSP options on sub, been using them for 4 years and can heartily recommend them, mostly for electronic music and they get used every waking hour of the day (confined to house due to spms) for music, movies etc, can go very loud to uncomfortable levels in my 3.3m x 4.3 room, add in the effects of the thunderous sub and they empty your bowels quicker than a California Reaper phall curry.

51724319233_a597d2d68e_c.jpg


I think CountZero on this forum also has experience of the Lyd 48’s
I liked the phall reference but I think you mean Carolina reaper.
 
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