I am a new audiophile. My starter setup was a Sennheiser HD650 and a Modi/Magni stack. I recently upgraded my stack due to my Magni taking a power surge and dying. I got the Modius and Drop+THX AAA 789. Was going to go with a Magnius but they were on a 2 month wait time. My question is where do I go from here? I did order XLR cables to connect the DAC and amp which are supposed to be here Monday and a balanced 4 pin XLR cable for my HD650 that should be here in about a week so I can try out balanced audio. My thought was the next thing to upgrade would be the headset, but I have no idea where to go from here. Keep in mind I'm in no hurry to do this as I just got a new stack and am trying full balanced setup for the first time. I'm sure this will keep me busy for awhile, but my curiosity makes me wonder what will be next. I feel like it's a lot easier to watch reviews and analyze DACs and amps than it is headsets. I know a lot of it comes down to preference. I was thinking maybe since I have an open back headset now that I should do a closed back next? Price isn't really an issue, but I don't want to spend $5000 on my next headset either. Anyway I'll shut up now. Just wondering what eveyone thinks would be the natural progression from the HD650 based on my current experience and hardware.
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Sennheiser HD650 Upgrade
- Thread starter dstep259
- Start date
Helicopter
Major Contributor
So your budget is $5k... then get Focal Utopia.
What is your source? Do you have the ability to add parametric equalization? If you don't have PEQ, adding that to the chain should be the next step. With a digital source, it is theoretically better to add the PEQ in software or digital hardware.
While Utopia is my favorite, I also like Focal Clear a lot, and like HD800s as well. Dan Clark has some great offerings, but I haven't tried them yet. My Bose QC35ii get a lot of use too, much more than my passive closed backs. sometimes I mix it up with 2020 Audeze LCD-X; I can't recommend that one as a main headphone though.
EQing the gear is the next step. That's the biggest improvement you can make without spending more bucks.
Peeps all over are using Equalizer APO with a GUI. There are 3 GUIs available and they are listed right underneath the Equalizer APO listing at the very top.
- Thread Starter
- #5
I am just running my DAC USB to my PC right now. That's the only source I'm using. Yeah I've heard of the HD800s before. Those are probably right at the top of what I would want to spend. I know I have a lot to learn before I start throwing too much money into the hobby. I don't know what PEQ is, so I'll have to look into it. I still haven't messed with or researched anything regarding audio software. My main use is for gaming/work, but I am starting to get more into hi res music now. Doing a 2 month trial on Tidal for $2 currently, but I know the major audiophiles probably laugh at a service like that. I did start doing a little reading about using Equalizer APO combined with Room EQ Wizard, but I didn't mess with it yet as Room EQ Wizard requires Java 8 which I'd rather not install if I don't have to.
It's a parametric equalizer. The software I linked you to has the PEQ.
Helicopter
Major Contributor
PEACE GUI for Equalizer APO you don't have to pay for. That is what I use.
Keep in mind that all headphones benefit substantially from EQ/PEQ. So no matter the headphones you go with use the PEQ.
HD650 is a warmish phone. So if you are looking to upgrade from there and don't mint the weight I would suggest looking into the Audeze line, somewhere you can buy and return if you don't like them.
- Thread Starter
- #12
OK. I'll look into those. I don't really know much about any headphones other than brand names. The HD650 is the only 'nice' pair of headphones I've used before, so I guess I don't really know if I would prefer those to something that has more treble focus. I'd want them to sound good for gaming for sure, but I feel like any high end headphone can do that. As far as hi res music goes I'll just have to experiment more.
IronPyrite
Member
When I shopped around a similar price range, I ended up going with the Focal Elear. The stock ear-pads made the sound too bass heavy, so I got a pair of the lamb skin earpads used by the Focal Utopia...end result was very good - a relatively flat frequency response, zero listening fatigue, and a punchy sound that's hard to explain (works well with Rock music). The Focal Elex from Drop is essentially a similar combination and end result.
You're not going to like hear this, since you recently upgraded and all... I recently upgraded from the Drop+THX AAA 789 to the Topping A90, and the A90 is SO much better, with less distortion. Not "I think I can hear a small difference" better, the difference was huge and significantly audible.
You're not going to like hear this, since you recently upgraded and all... I recently upgraded from the Drop+THX AAA 789 to the Topping A90, and the A90 is SO much better, with less distortion. Not "I think I can hear a small difference" better, the difference was huge and significantly audible.
- Thread Starter
- #14
Thanks for the info. I actually did look at the D90 when I was doing my research, but it seemed like it was a little pricey for my current experience level. I know I'll upgrade to something like that one day. I have a sibling that I'll probably end up donating a lot of my cheaper hardware to as I upgrade as well, so at least my cheaper stuff will still have a good home if I stop using it.
- Thread Starter
- #15
I think the D90 was also sold out at the time my I was looking, and I wanted something right away since my only amp (my Magni) was broken. That's why I didn't get a Magnius to go with the Modius. It was a 2 month wait time on it. I'd be fine waiting if I already had something that worked. Funny enough my Magni is actually back in action now so I ended up with two working amps anyway. At least I have balanced as an option to play with now though.
Tks
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Your setup is end-game my dude. If there is nothing wrong with the sound you hear, no reason to do anything.
If you're real keen on dropping money. Give the HD800 a try (or basically anything that is comfortable I suppose). You won't be getting much better sound in all honesty after this point. If you're looking for eye candy, just buy a Meze Empyrean and be done with this whole ordeal.
If you're real keen on dropping money. Give the HD800 a try (or basically anything that is comfortable I suppose). You won't be getting much better sound in all honesty after this point. If you're looking for eye candy, just buy a Meze Empyrean and be done with this whole ordeal.
- Thread Starter
- #17
I've never heard of Meze. They do look nice. If I continue down the road of more hardware I think it would be more just for the fun of it than it would be to search for what I consider the perfect sound. I do think it would be nice to get another pair of closed back headphones at some point, but like I said before I'm in no rush. A new headset is probably something I'd look into next year some time. I was just curious what people think.
Hipper
Addicted to Fun and Learning
I'm not sure going balanced (both with the headphone cable or the interconnects) will make any difference in truth. I have both balanced because I bought into the idea but when you read about what these actually attempt to do it seems they are irrelevant for our purposes.
EQ used sensibly is definitely a good thing for headphones. There are plenty of suggestions for using EQ with the HD650 (or other headphones). Try them. As you are using a PC, a software EQ makes sense. I ripped my CDs for PC headphone use and use JRiver Media Library to manage the files, but this also comes with PEQ and a GEQ (Graphic equaliser). For headphones there's no real need to use REW although some people do use it to put in their published headphone response and generate some filters to EQ it.
Crossfeed is another processing you might find worth trying:
https://www.leckertonaudio.com/blog/2010/09/what-is-headphone-crossfeed
Some amps have this; so does some software. I tried it but these days I listen without it and don't miss it. It's just an idea to make headphones sound more like speakers. In fact I try to get my speakers sound more like headphones! There's no correct dogma on this subject - it's whatever you prefer.
Looking at more processing, there is the Smyth Realiser:
https://smyth-research.com/
or 'Out of Your Head' software:
https://fongaudio.com/out-of-your-head-software/
I upgraded from an HD650 to the HD800 and found it a big improvement for two reasons. Firstly it is much more comfortable on my ears/head. This is because it has larger ear pieces that cover rather then flatten the ear, and it does not grip my head so tightly (I found the HD650s to be a bit 'head crushing' over time). Secondly it sounds so much more open, detailed; I find the bass all there and balanced, not too loud (a lot depends on the music production of course) and the treble often exactly as I want it. However others say it's too bright, the bass is anemic. You can only try it yourself.
Both these Sennheisers are known as dynamic headphones. You can also buy electrostatic headphones, Stax being the most well known make but there are others. Electrostats have their own sound which some but not all prefer. Then there are Ribbon headphones, made by Raal.
EQ used sensibly is definitely a good thing for headphones. There are plenty of suggestions for using EQ with the HD650 (or other headphones). Try them. As you are using a PC, a software EQ makes sense. I ripped my CDs for PC headphone use and use JRiver Media Library to manage the files, but this also comes with PEQ and a GEQ (Graphic equaliser). For headphones there's no real need to use REW although some people do use it to put in their published headphone response and generate some filters to EQ it.
Crossfeed is another processing you might find worth trying:
https://www.leckertonaudio.com/blog/2010/09/what-is-headphone-crossfeed
Some amps have this; so does some software. I tried it but these days I listen without it and don't miss it. It's just an idea to make headphones sound more like speakers. In fact I try to get my speakers sound more like headphones! There's no correct dogma on this subject - it's whatever you prefer.
Looking at more processing, there is the Smyth Realiser:
https://smyth-research.com/
or 'Out of Your Head' software:
https://fongaudio.com/out-of-your-head-software/
I upgraded from an HD650 to the HD800 and found it a big improvement for two reasons. Firstly it is much more comfortable on my ears/head. This is because it has larger ear pieces that cover rather then flatten the ear, and it does not grip my head so tightly (I found the HD650s to be a bit 'head crushing' over time). Secondly it sounds so much more open, detailed; I find the bass all there and balanced, not too loud (a lot depends on the music production of course) and the treble often exactly as I want it. However others say it's too bright, the bass is anemic. You can only try it yourself.
Both these Sennheisers are known as dynamic headphones. You can also buy electrostatic headphones, Stax being the most well known make but there are others. Electrostats have their own sound which some but not all prefer. Then there are Ribbon headphones, made by Raal.
IronPyrite
Member
A90 and D90 are different devices. The D90 (as you mentioned is sold through) is a DAC, whereas the A90 is an amplifier. D90 was replaced by the D90SE, because of the AKM factory fire.
rochambeaux
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Is application based PEQ only usable when playing "local" files, i.e. will it work on streaming sources like Apple Music, Spotify, etc?
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