Replacing NAD T778

[pogo]

Which Dirac Live version did you use with the T778 that you had such problems?

 

[mannycala]

Man I just saw this. I'm extremely picky with 2 channel audio + sub. I had the NAD T778 and I was having problems with it so I sold it. Turned out the problem wasn't the receiver but by then I already committed. I've owned all the receivers on your list. I went with the Arcam AVR21 and I use a large 2 channel external amp to drive my B&W 702 S2 speakers. I'm very disappointed with the sound quality of the receiver. Actually I'm disappointed in more than that, but I'll focus on sound quality. If you go from the NAD T778 for music to the others, you'll be disappointed. Take your NAD and copy the speaker distances and levels, input those into the receiver with Dirac turned OFF and that receiver will become alive. The Arcam screen sucks. You'll miss the NAD screen. Arcam has no on screen menu. You can use a laptop but it's not user friendly. Their version of BluOS sucks. But I'm mostly disappointed with the sound quality. There is a receiver that I can recommend to others that may be in the same boat. The new Sony ES receivers, the upper models (5000 or 7000) sound very good and it's a good overall experience. The NAD just has more detail in their sound. The Anthem DAC isn't as good as the NAD. Onkyo and Yamaha are in the mainstream brands and the NAD is in a different league. If you go mainstream you might want to consider the Marantz Cinema 50 or 40 but again, the NAD sounds better.

Many thanks for this feedback.
I know Yamaha and Onkyo are considered mainstream, but on the other side I think some good products are available from both companies. did you try the rz70? I’m currently looking at that. from specs point of view it gas all I need. and Chromecast support is the best way to manage qozub streaming (IMHO), i prefer more than BluOS. I know Nad has good sound quality, I tried also on stereo amplifier (M33), but ad said I would move to AB class amplifier, that in general I prefer.

 

[peng]

I can verify that the Arcam also has the same ESS9026 PRO DACs and compared to the NAD DAC, it is disappointing. The Arcam isn't a terrible sound. I'd put it above most brands but the Arcam AVR21 is 4700 and it's not worth that. It also has too many drawbacks. I sold my NAD T778 and after buying the Arcam after having the Yamaha, I'm going to buy the NAD T778 again. I know I'm going down in features. 8K to 4K. But the user experience, especially for music, is so much better on the NAD. I have a large two channel external Emotiva amp and I bumped up the gain of the fronts on the NAD. Bumping up the fronts made it possible for the music to have more detail without having to turn it up as much. Then of course when you turn it up you'll be in heaven. If you don't have good audio sound from your NAD then you need to do some fine tuning. The NAD is the only receiver that I can actually hear the breath of a singer as they inhale and exhale. I did leave out Rotel but they only have one model and you might not like it. The Rotel sounds great as well.

We have slightly different opinions obviously, as I believe (based on experience and knowledge of many lab test reports) that like quality amps, avrs at the level of the T778, Arcam, Marantz, Denon, Yamaha, Sony's all sound may be subtly different but not distinguishable in most use conditions except when DSPs are used, such as different sound modes, room correction/equalization etc. So for DSP use, that most people will do, it will be a tough choice because there isn't much, if any lab test results to go with. To me, I would just based my choice on marketing information (unwillingly) but will try hard to find supporting data, such as the type of DSP ICs used sound modes/formats available, and to some extent go with my own subjective measurements in demo rooms. Overall, I would say at the level of the T778, there is almost no point wasting time in second guessing its so called "sound quality", as speakers and room, aside from the recording quality of the contents, it much more important. If those are good, any of those you mentioned will sound great, and also, that's regardless of whether TI, AKM, or ESS DAC ICs are used, as long as they are at the near flagship level, such as ES9026Pro and 9018 that are about 2 to 3 notches down from ESS's flagships.

 

[JoachimStrobel]

Sure. As I understood the issue is related to not compatibility and cant be solved. So far the main problem is that Nad HDMI board do not discover the status change of the tv when move from hdmi to tv, and keep the hdmi audio input.

In the meantime you could power down the NAd, first with the front switch and after 10 sec with the switch at the back and start again. It will rescan the HDMI ports.

 

[mannycala]

In the meantime you could power down the NAd, first with the front switch and after 10 sec with the switch at the back and start again. It will rescan the HDMI ports.

Thanks for suggestion. unfortunaty Nad is already unmounted and sent to hi-fi shop for selling

 

[mannycala]

At the end I sold NAD and I got the RZ70.
installed two days ago. HDMI issue solved, first impression is that, without room correction, sound quality in stereo reproduction is improved. Running qobuz with Chromecast, before I used the bluos app.
I will test more in the next days.

 

[Vacceo]

With this thread up, I wonder why NAD is taking so long to update their M17 processor. After all, the OP could have thought about staying NAD if they had a current HDMI 2.1 board.

 

[ban25]

With this thread up, I wonder why NAD is taking so long to update their M17 processor. After all, the OP could have thought about staying NAD if they had a current HDMI 2.1 board.

I suspect their MDC framework either can't support it (insufficient backplane BW or power) or they are moving on from the AVR/AVP space, a la Rotel.

 

[Vacceo]

I suspect their MDC framework either can't support it (insufficient backplane BW or power) or they are moving on from the AVR/AVP space, a la Rotel.

The second will be a shame. I reckon Marant/Denon is currently in a very good spot, but that will only improve if they feel a bit pressure from Nad, Arcam, Anthem...

 

[ban25]

The second will be a shame. I reckon Marant/Denon is currently in a very good spot, but that will only improve if they feel a bit pressure from Nad, Arcam, Anthem...

I like NAD's stuff, but I don't think any of those brands have enough volume to even come close to D+M. The closest is probably Premium Audio Company (Onkyo) followed maybe by Yamaha?

 

[ATX]

At the end I sold NAD and I got the RZ70.
installed two days ago. HDMI issue solved, first impression is that, without room correction, sound quality in stereo reproduction is improved. Running qobuz with Chromecast, before I used the bluos app.
I will test more in the next days.

Hi Manny: How do you like the Lyngdorf FR-1 Speakers? Thank you
Although you’ve made your AVR decision, I recently made some changes, as well. I added an ARCAM AVR31 to one system and decided to keep my Yamaha 3070 after digging into the manual and learning that less is more. Both systems run Vandersteen Speakers and the on-wall Vandersteens(Yamaha) really opened up after I shut down all DSP(Straight Direct, now) and let Yamaha ESS SABRE 32 Ultra DAC do its thing.

 

[DrStranger]

Dears,
I am considering to chance my AVR NAD T778 with a new one.
I like over all the features of Nad, the bluos app is very nice and also Dirac calibration is good. In terms of sound , focusing on music reproduction in stereo (+sub) configuration is also good, I would say not fantastic but good for an AVR.
Main reason for change is that ARC is not working with my TV (Sony Bravia) and therefore I currently connect the avr to tv with optical cable but I really don’t like this configuration because most of the times I just dont open the AVR and keep tv audio. Considering the chance, I would get the opportunity also to improve in audio quality for music reproduction (stereo configuration + sub) and looking to AVRs that have good AB class amplifier. Currently my options are:

- Anthem MRX740: I am sure there will be an improvement for audio quality but I am worried that Arc issue will be same as Nad
- Arcam Avr11: same considerations of Anthem
- Onkyo TX-RZ70: specs seems top level, almost sure that Arc will work ad expected, not sure if sound quality is comparable with two models above ( mainly preamp quality)
- Yamaha A6A + Ab class power amplifier for 2 front channels: best compatibility with tv and arc, probabily worse in terms of room correction and preamp quality.

Any suggestion about highlighted models or alternatives?
Many thanks,
Marco

You cant go wrong with Yamaha A6A, promise. https://www.audioholics.com/av-receiver-reviews/yamaha-rx-a6a

 

[mannycala]

Hi Manny: How do you like the Lyngdorf FR-1 Speakers? Thank you
Although you’ve made your AVR decision, I recently made some changes, as well. I added an ARCAM AVR31 to one system and decided to keep my Yamaha 3070 after digging into the manual and learning that less is more. Both systems run Vandersteen Speakers and the on-wall Vandersteens(Yamaha) really opened up after I shut down all DSP(Straight Direct, now) and let Yamaha ESS SABRE 32 Ultra DAC do its thing.

I’m fine with the lyngdorf. Good detail and soundstage. Also decent bass level considering that are on wall speakers. I use with “light” dirac room correction. Frankly speaking I am not full satisfied by Lyngdorf sub BW-2, I was expecting better performance.

 

[mannycala]

You cant go wrong with Yamaha A6A, promise. https://www.audioholics.com/av-receiver-reviews/yamaha-rx-a6a

Thank you, Already done my choice and vert happy with that, but A6A was 2nd option.

 

[ATX]

I’m fine with the lyngdorf. Good detail and soundstage. Also decent bass level considering that are on wall speakers. I use with “light” dirac room correction. Frankly speaking I am not full satisfied by Lyngdorf sub BW-2, I was expecting better performance.

TY for the reply Manny.
I am all too familiar with the irritation of creating a good sound stage with on-wall and floor speakers. Choosing the same brand SW was a logical choice to pair with on-wall speakers and a choice which can be rectified if the SW doesn't measure up to your expectations. Have you considered adding a second subwoofer or changing your current SW? I really like the seamless time & phase integration of my Vandersteen SWs and Mains but I had to add a 2nd SW to get the Bass level appropriate for the room. If I were to utilize another SW Brand, it would be Rythmik SWs made in ATX. https://www.rythmikaudio.com/

 

[mannycala]

I thought about 2nd sw but at the moment I’m not planning to add or change the current one. Current is also an aesthetic choice as match with the front. I have all the system in the main room

 

[ATX]

I thought about 2nd sw but at the moment I’m not planning to add or change the current one. Current is also an aesthetic choice as match with the front. I have all the system in the main room

Understood, I have a ‘wife friendly’ set up in one of my rooms and it certainly complicates everything from audio quality to placement. If you purchased all of your speakers from 1 dealer, they may loan you another SW to demo. Good luck…