Recommendation of a AK4499EX-Based DAC?

[JasonC331]

Have you considered ordering a Geshelli Labs Dayzee? It has the Dac combo you want but offers way more options than anything from the other guys, Cool ass Woodworking, built in the USA with great support. Here are the options list

• Dual Mono AK4499EX (with Dual AK4191)
• 8 Mono Socketed Mono Opamps (OPA1655 on Stock Version)
• Optional 8 Mono Sparkos 2590’s (Separate Sockets on Board)
• 2 TOSLINK Inputs (192khz/24bit)
• 2 Coax Inputs (192khz/24bit)
• Geshelli Amanero USB Module (384khz/32bit – DSD512 Native)
• 2 Sets of Balanced (XLR) Outputs
• 4 Sets of Unbalanced (RCA) Outputs
• Toslink Output
• Coax Output
• Selectable Inputs on Front of Case
• Custom Wood Case with Aluminum Front and Rear Plates

 

[Music1969]

I think we have been a bit unfair to the OP. He is not asking for recommendations for DAC chips, he has short listed a number of DACs and asking for recommendations for which one to get.

Yes nobody is helping him at all.

This is why ASR gets a bad reputation elsewhere.

Gustard A26 is nice, with ethernet streaming input.

 

[Roland68]

I am considering getting a DAC that uses the AK4191EQ/AK4499EX chip set. There are several DACs using this AKM chip combo that are nearly in the same price range: Topping E70V, SMSL M400, SMSL DO400EX, SMSL SU-9 Ultra.

Any recommendation on which one to get?

The first question would be, in what price range are you looking for a device?
I personally like the developments and solutions from Gustard and Topping better than others. I see a certain consistency and comprehensible solutions to these devices. For example, at SMSL and other companies I often have the feeling that something different is being tried out with every DAC, including in terms of power supply and output stages.
In my opinion, my old Gustard A18 doesn't sound any worse than my SMSL D400EX with 2x AK4499EX. A Gustard A26, which I heard briefly in comparison, was a touch clearer for me, but really only a touch and absolutely not suitable for a blind test.
I hope that Gustard brings out another cheap model with an AK4499EX.

But most importantly, they care about the features and functionality. The device must first and foremost be usable for you.
If money were no object, I would currently have to choose between the Gustard A26 and the Topping DX9. Otherwise topping E70V or the SMSL D400 Pro. You can get the latter for around € 500 at hifi-express, when offers are available again soon. Alternatively, the Sabaj A20d 2023 is not a bad choice and should not be underestimated, very clean construction.

 

[lyramax]

The chip doesn't matter because so much more depends on implementation, features and price.

So, irrespective of chipset, which DACs have better implementations?

 

[Mnyb]

So, irrespective of chipset, which DACs have better implementations?

If you assume sound quality as solved .
What do you want it do do for you ? how many inputs , what kind of inputs , volume control , remote ? other features .
Look and feel ?
Try to get a handle of different brands quality reputation and how they handle warranty and service .

I think other than me can weight in on that one .

My own old ToppingD70 works fine after several years , but its a sample of one .

 

[Ron Texas]

So, irrespective of chipset, which DACs have better implementations?

Many DAC's have been reviewed here. Anything with a SINAD of over 100Db should be good enough for anyone. Output voltage needs to be high enough to drive your amplifier. Typically the output is 2V for RCA and 4V for balanced. Some of the newer Class D amplifiers require more than 2V input to reach full power so a balanced DAC is desirable unless a preamp is added. My favorites are the MiniDSP 2x2HD and Flex because these make integrating a subwoofer easy. If you are connecting a TV your DAC needs a Toslink input and a volume control. A remote is very helpful. Do you want to use headphones in the same room as your speakers? There is a misconception around here that the DAC is of great importance to sound quality. It's likely to be the least important component in the chain. Some of the active studio monitors have digital inputs which means you don't need digital to analog conversion. In that case you want something which converts your digital input, usually USB, to a different digital format which the active speaker understands.

Just what are your needs?

 

[lyramax]

...
Just what are your needs?

The DAC would be used to bridge my digital sources, primarily a Raspberry-Pi4 and a CD transport, and my preamp (for a floor speaker rig) and two headphone amps (one for electrostatic headphones, one for other regular headphones). Ideally I'd like to have 3 sets of output but can work around with having only 2 (by having my preamp front-ending one headphone amp) and 3 sets of coax/optical input (the extra sets of input are for trying out other source components) plus USB input.

 

[Middle Earth]

+1 on the Gustard from what I have seen
I can also recommend the Orchard Audio Pecan Pi 4499EX with the 4191 which I have
You can get it as a streamer/DAC or just a DAC

 

[raif71]

I am considering getting a DAC that uses the AK4191EQ/AK4499EX chip set. There are several DACs using this AKM chip combo that are nearly in the same price range: Topping E70V, SMSL M400, SMSL DO400EX, SMSL SU-9 Ultra.

Any recommendation on which one to get?

I have the smsl m400 but that particular model has the akm4499eq (not ex). This model was before the fire. Anyway people say they sound the same. I like the sound of the akm4499eq if I do say so myself so I would recommend m400 but not sure if smsl is still selling it. I pair this dac with smsl sp400. Incredible pairing and sound.

 

[lyramax]

Have you considered ordering a Geshelli Labs Dayzee? It has the Dac combo you want but offers way more options than anything from the other guys, Cool ass Woodworking, built in the USA with great support. Here are the options list
...

Thanks, the Dayzee does look compelling to consider.

Do you have any (preliminary?) availability and pricing info for this DAC?

 

[Middle Earth]

It is around $1,500
You have to contact them to order it I believe

Thanks, the Dayzee does look compelling to consider.

Do you have any (preliminary?) availability and pricing info for this DAC?

 

[Roland68]

The DAC would be used to bridge my digital sources, primarily a Raspberry-Pi4 and a CD transport, and my preamp (for a floor speaker rig) and two headphone amps (one for electrostatic headphones, one for other regular headphones). Ideally I'd like to have 3 sets of output but can work around with having only 2 (by having my preamp front-ending one headphone amp) and 3 sets of coax/optical input (the extra sets of input are for trying out other source components) plus USB input.

I had completely forgotten that Gustard had already released a cheap device with an AK4499EX DAC chip called the AUDALYTIC AH90.
In addition to the USB input, it has 2 x Coax RCA and 1 x optical as a digital input and a LAN connection. The outputs could be expanded using a passive switch.
http://www.gustard.cn/?post_type=products&page_id=17467
Audiophonics

 

[JasonC331]

Thanks, the Dayzee does look compelling to consider.

Do you have any (preliminary?) availability and pricing info for this DAC?

Dayzee – Geshelli Labs LLC.

geshelli.com

 

[gjm]

The Dayzee looks interesting and the manufacturers are 'real people' that you can talk to, meet, and deal with.
The Audalytic AH90 is also intriguing. Huge spec and facilities at a quite sensible price.

As for all those who will insist that buying a new DAC is pointless - are these people never going to buy another DAC? Maybe the OP is buying their first DAC? While technically (SNR, etc) there may be no difference between the DACs - in which case buy whatever is available - the use experience does count for a lot.

Offering technical advice is great. And thank you. Now, try being a person. Or do you all drive the same model and colour of Prius? After all, it gets from A to B the same as any other car - why buy anything different?

Lighten up. Be friendly. ♥

 

[Kane1972]

Use the DAC that you already have.
The AK4499EX will sound exactly the same.

If you want to improve sound quality, look into new headphones, speakers, room treatment, or EQ.

Is there a reason manufacturers keep making new chips if they all sound the same? Why not just stick with what they have and let the companies who make DAC's etc keep buying those chips to build their gear with? I understand if they add new features to the chips.

 

[staticV3]

Is there a reason manufacturers keep making new chips if they all sound the same?

Consumers want new stuff.

It's been years since the average user could actually notice a performance difference between iPhone SoCs and cameras.

Yet Apple still pump billions into R&D to come up with improved components for each generation. And they make so much money off it.

Imagine how lame they would look if they just declared their current tech as "good enough" (which it is!), while their competitors keep iterating.

If you're in the business of making money, such an approach is completely unsustainable.

 

[gjm]

If you're in the business of making money, such an approach is completely unsustainable.

That's the crux of it. It used to be that businesses made stuff. Or provided services. No longer - the underlying drive is now the money that is made, and a profit which *must* increase every time a financial report comes out. Actual 'stuff' is now the side-effect of making money, and not the way money is made.

(There will be exceptions of course. )

 

[gjm]

Is there a reason manufacturers keep making new chips if they all sound the same? Why not just stick with what they have and let the companies who make DAC's etc keep buying those chips to build their gear with? I understand if they add new features to the chips.

A lot of it is new features. And a lot of the chips created and used in audio have other uses in other industries. (Maybe not the latest Velvet Sound XYZ, but...)

The price differences in DACs supplied often relate to the manufacturer putting effort into using the extra features that are available. A brand new chip, hot out of the fab, implemented by Topping, SMSL (etc) and packaged in a sensibly-priced box, may use less than 10% of the features available on the chip used. Later solutions may cost more (cue: "Why spend more? They all sound the same! comments" ) but will often be better manufactured, use different additional components (possibly better quality, tighter tolerance), and implement more features of the chips.

It's products for markets within the DAC market.

At the absolute basest level - the difference in DAC chip conversion performance may be inaudible, but the difference in implementation or facility may be considerable.

 

[sthaus]

I'm not totally agreed with whom said they are all the same sound. In fact, not all AKM4499 DACs made equally. Sound will slightly different due to their architecture engineer. However, imagine that the ingredients are the same; but in different chef cook. Beef meats are the same, but taste will be different in Master Chef vs Street Chef. If you have a nice view restaurant with great chef cook, accompanied with a hot lady (your speaker), then you can really enjoy your steak at max but not at street food with just part of the joy only. (Acoustic treatment, mood)

Check it out Gustard A26 (well-known quality product built among Chinese DAC, YouTube review, audiophile review .. blah blah, personally I highly recommended it for AK4499 chipset dac). Otherwise, SMSL D400Pro is not bad or Loxjie D50 (reliability issue with luck, they sound good to me but broke down after 2yrs). Topping E70Velvet is also great within the price range but some mentioned about it is lack of soul but clinical..!?

Cheers

 

[sonitus mirus]

I believe that all modern DAC chips can be audibly transparent from one another in properly designed audio equipment. Personally, I feel that they should be audibly transparent; however, they can be made to sound different and stray from transparency either intentionally by design or unintentionally from poor design or with specific configuration settings.