Quest for AVR with 96dB+ SINAD with balanced XLR pre outs \w optional AMP stage

[geek101]

Prefer to pay less than 2k, need hdmi 2.1 with Dirac support. I don’t care for an AMP stage.

But it seems to me such AVR is like $6k or more ? Like marantz AV10 etc.

I can’t believe I can get a 100” TV for less .

Monoprice or emotiva are you listening?

May be I should just use TV to decode and use Minidsp HT flex ?. I wish it could do more channels like 15 .

 

[rynberg]

Your post is all over the place...you don't need XLR outs, and even if you did, the XLR outs on any AVR or low-priced AVP are not true balanced outs, they are derived from the single-ended channel out (RCA). Yep, a lot of channels costs a lot of money...usually people worried about 15 channels aren't worried about $2-4k for the processor.

 

[geek101]

Your post is all over the place...you don't need XLR outs, and even if you did, the XLR outs on any AVR or low-priced AVP are not true balanced outs, they are derived from the single-ended channel out (RCA). Yep, a lot of channels costs a lot of money...usually people worried about 15 channels aren't worried about $2-4k for the processor.

What is wrong with my expectation? I admit I am ignorant of economics of making such a device. But my expectations are in line, I want fully balanced XLR to eliminate noise in long cable runs, I am only asking for pre out and not amplified so 11.4 is 15 channels. Marantz cinema 40 is $3.5k, cut the amp out and being down the cost and made me throw in a nicer Dac. Not far fetched but I do see enconmics of rip off like Marantz AV10 vs Marantz Cinema 40

In few years I hope topping or smsl corners the AVR market.

 

[Chrispy]

I'd guess your expectations of the economics

 

[geek101]

I'd guess your expectations of the economics

And you know that how ?

 

[Hayabusa]

Your post is all over the place...you don't need XLR outs, and even if you did, the XLR outs on any AVR or low-priced AVP are not true balanced outs, they are derived from the single-ended channel out (RCA). Yep, a lot of channels costs a lot of money...usually people worried about 15 channels aren't worried about $2-4k for the processor.

if your goal for XLS is to have interference suppression in your connection to the amp then your 'not true balanced' statement makes no sense. They will do the job.

 

[Chrispy]

And you know that how ?

Based on your previous post, just paraphrased you a bit. While I'd like to see something like what you're wishing for, I'm not holding my breath. Somewhat it is in the greater number of tv owners as far as economies of scale go. OTOH you can get an avr that does essentially the same thing as a pre-pro for less due same economics.

 

[Ron Texas]

96 dB? What if it's 92 dB? The world will end. 15 channels, WTF. What are you planning to playback?

 

[geek101]

96 dB? What if it's 92 dB? The world will end. 15 channels, WTF. What are you planning to playback?

16bit resolution is 96db and 15 channels is atmos for home theater with multiple subs. Not far fetched

 

[geek101]

Integra DRX-8.4 at $3.2k is closer to $2k. They seem to have better DACs.

 

[Blumlein 88]

I share your frustration. AVRs with several channels of power amps sell for fractions of a preamp only. They do all the same processing too. Obviously you can pull out/leave out the power amps and for the money saved put in a board to do good quality xlr output with money left over. But I don't think that is what sets the cost.

I read an article about costs for Bluray players in the early days of bluray. One with some of the more sophisticated processing at the time. Made in China it was all about economies of scale. Chinese factories were huge, could be set up to make almost anything, but there was a cost to do so. So having a 1000 of the players made would have meant retail pricing of something like $25k each. Having 10,000 made would drop the price to maybe $2k each. Having 100,000 made might come in at $150. Those numbers may be off from my memory, but are broadly correct.

I think this is a good part of the issue with mainstream AVPs vs AVRs. The smaller market, means smaller runs at the factory and cost to get it made balloon dramatically from that alone even if materials cost and what is inside is less. One way to combat that would be to make the same unit available for several years so you could do a single large run of it. Yet that would mean tying up money for years to do so while it probably makes them more money to tout something new every year or two at the most so their resources get a quick turn around into another product. Plus the damnable Dolby company is highly likely to come out with the new Dolby xxx.xxx feature which is a must have, and then your product sales on something from 5 years ago is trashed. Dolby video formats and audio formats are a plague on the whole industry according to my opinion.

 

[peng]

Prefer to pay less than 2k, need hdmi 2.1 with Dirac support. I don’t care for an AMP stage.

But it seems to me such AVR is like $6k or more ? Like marantz AV10 etc.

I can’t believe I can get a 100” TV for less .

Monoprice or emotiva are you listening?

May be I should just use TV to decode and use Minidsp HT flex ?. I wish it could do more channels like 15 .

You don't care for an amp stage, but the sad reality is that for a $2,000 budget, the AVP that meets your criteria except for XLR outputs are something like the AVR-X4800H, or the Cinema 40, or 50 if you are in Europe. Just run the thing in preamp mode and pretend it is an AVP and you are good to go. As mentioned by others, there is no real need for XLR outputs for most HT users, though I would add that if you do have to have long runs of interconnects such as more than 2 meters, then there may be some benefits but it still depends on other factors. Otherwise, even if your power amps will take only XLR inputs, there are RCA to XLR cables specifically made for the purpose, and will offer almost the same commode noise reduction benefits.

By the way, just for common mode noise reduction, you don't need to have the so called "truly", or "fully" balanced schemes that typically mean differential balanced connections from input through output. The so called "balanced" output derived from the single ended output stage will do the same (again, for CMNR, but not in terms of even harmonics cancellation).

 

[Ron Texas]

16bit resolution is 96db and 15 channels is atmos for home theater with multiple subs. Not far fetched

Only one channel is needed for all the subs. The difference between 96 and 92 db is inaudible.