Opinions on Yamaha A6A with power amp

[cgardnerma]

Hi folks. I have a Yamaha A6A on order which will likely replace the Denon 3800H I have been auditioning in my 5.1.4 setup. I also have an Emotiva UPA-7 which is 12 years old, and has been flawless, that will continue to see duty and take some load off of the AVR.

My question is simple. I usually run the 5 channel bed layer with the Emotiva and let the amp handle the Atmos speakers. With the Yamaha and it's pretty stout and clean 2-channel performance, I was actually considering running the L/R speakers with the Yamaha and the rest with the Emotiva. I know I am probably splitting inaudible hairs here, but I figured I would put the question to my fellow audio nerds. What do you think?

 

[peng]

Hi folks. I have a Yamaha A6A on order which will likely replace the Denon 3800H I have been auditioning in my 5.1.4 setup. I also have an Emotiva UPA-7 which is 12 years old, and has been flawless, that will continue to see duty and take some load off of the AVR.

My question is simple. I usually run the 5 channel bed layer with the Emotiva and let the amp handle the Atmos speakers. With the Yamaha and it's pretty stout and clean 2-channel performance, I was actually considering running the L/R speakers with the Yamaha and the rest with the Emotiva. I know I am probably splitting inaudible hairs here, but I figured I would put the question to my fellow audio nerds. What do you think?

The Denon would do slightly better in 5 channel driven output, in 2 channel output the A6A may offer 1 to 1.5 dB more, so yes you are probably splitting inaudible hairs as you put it. Since you already have the UPA-7, may as well continue doing what you are doing.

 

[voodooless]

Question out of interest: why would you want to replace X3800H with an A6A?

 

[davidc]

Hi folks. I have a Yamaha A6A on order which will likely replace the Denon 3800H I have been auditioning in my 5.1.4 setup. I also have an Emotiva UPA-7 which is 12 years old, and has been flawless, that will continue to see duty and take some load off of the AVR.

My question is simple. I usually run the 5 channel bed layer with the Emotiva and let the amp handle the Atmos speakers. With the Yamaha and it's pretty stout and clean 2-channel performance, I was actually considering running the L/R speakers with the Yamaha and the rest with the Emotiva. I know I am probably splitting inaudible hairs here, but I figured I would put the question to my fellow audio nerds. What do you think?

You're Denon is going to be able to upgrade to DIRAC, why would you ever want something different?

 

[cgardnerma]

My question wasn't Denon vs Yamaha, but whether I should run 2 channel from the Yamaha and Emotiva for the rest, or LCR & Surround from the Emotiva and use the Yamaha just for the 4 Atmos speakers.

You're Denon is going to be able to upgrade to DIRAC, why would you ever want something different?

I only use room correction for volume and delay and EQ for the sub only. I use my own measurement mic and REW. The Yamaha seems much more flexible in this use case with their LOW EQ mode and all the parametric EQs. I will find out if this is the case, but the manual graphic EQ in Audyssey is terrible for this.

 

[davidc]

My question wasn't Denon vs Yamaha, but whether I should run 2 channel from the Yamaha and Emotiva for the rest, or LCR & Surround from the Emotiva and use the Yamaha just for the 4 Atmos speakers.

I only use room correction for volume and delay and EQ for the sub only. I use my own measurement mic and REW. The Yamaha seems much more flexible in this use case with their LOW EQ mode and all the parametric EQs. I will find out if this is the case, but the manual graphic EQ in Audyssey is terrible for this.

Gotcha. Two things to think about though... One is that Odyssey now has some sort of add-on programming that you can buy. That is much much more flexible. Look into it. And the deer act is supposed to be better in many respects than Odyssey as well. In fact, you can run them together. Worth checking into before you make a purchase for sure

 

[peng]

My question wasn't Denon vs Yamaha, but whether I should run 2 channel from the Yamaha and Emotiva for the rest, or LCR & Surround from the Emotiva and use the Yamaha just for the 4 Atmos speakers.

Good thing you clarify this, I thought you asked the question because you thought the A6A has more stout and cleaner amps than the Denon.

In that case, the answer is as simple as your question, the Emo amp is better suited for the LCR. The avr, either one, is more suited for the other channels. That's based objective measurements.

 

[voodooless]

In fact, you can run them together.

last time I heard about it, it said you can’t run them together… we’ll have to wait and see.

Yes the Yahama is in some ways more flexible in EQ use, but that may just be on the surface. It has a limited number of configurable PEQ’s per channel (per channel only via a workaround), which may seem to give flexibility. With Audyssey and Dirac you have however much more control over the final result, because they can use more corrections due to FIR filtering. It’s just a bit different concept to get used to.

And no, you didn’t ask, but at ASR, you sometimes get free unwanted advice Take it or leave it.

 

[techsamurai]

Hi folks. I have a Yamaha A6A on order which will likely replace the Denon 3800H I have been auditioning in my 5.1.4 setup. I also have an Emotiva UPA-7 which is 12 years old, and has been flawless, that will continue to see duty and take some load off of the AVR.

My question is simple. I usually run the 5 channel bed layer with the Emotiva and let the amp handle the Atmos speakers. With the Yamaha and it's pretty stout and clean 2-channel performance, I was actually considering running the L/R speakers with the Yamaha and the rest with the Emotiva. I know I am probably splitting inaudible hairs here, but I figured I would put the question to my fellow audio nerds. What do you think?

$700 for the emotiva with a 850 VA toroidal and 90,000 capacitance? Em were the days!

What is your LCR?

 

[cgardnerma]

Question out of interest: why would you want to replace X3800H with an A6A?

Hehe. I only have a few posts in this forum and don't want to get into a Denon v. Yamaha sword fight. Everyone will think I am a troll. LOL. Happy to share on DM if you like.

I like the Denon, by the way, and at list price, I think it is the best choice for many. It works as expected. But with the A6A in the same range for a refurb now (I missed its brief MSRP price dip), it's a better match for my use case. Plus as someone with a ton of pro audio gear, I have had years of good experience with the Yamaha brand in general. My only receiver failure in 30 years was my last receiver which was a Marantz. It lasted 4 years. Only one data point, of course, but left me with a bad taste in m mouth.

 

[techsamurai]

Hehe. I only have a few posts in this forum and don't want to get into a Denon v. Yamaha sword fight. Everyone will think I am a troll. LOL. Happy to share on DM if you like.

I like the Denon, by the way, and at list price, I think it is the best choice for many. It works as expected. But with the A6A in the same range for a refurb now (I missed its brief MSRP price dip), it's a better match for my use case. Plus as someone with a ton of pro audio gear, I have had years of good experience with the Yamaha brand in general. My only receiver failure in 30 years was my last receiver which was a Marantz. It lasted 4 years. Only one data point, of course, but left me with a bad taste in m mouth.

What Marantz? Was that after they switched to the 3 year warranties?

 

[DrStranger]

Hehe. I only have a few posts in this forum and don't want to get into a Denon v. Yamaha sword fight. Everyone will think I am a troll. LOL. Happy to share on DM if you like.

I like the Denon, by the way, and at list price, I think it is the best choice for many. It works as expected. But with the A6A in the same range for a refurb now (I missed its brief MSRP price dip), it's a better match for my use case. Plus as someone with a ton of pro audio gear, I have had years of good experience with the Yamaha brand in general. My only receiver failure in 30 years was my last receiver which was a Marantz. It lasted 4 years. Only one data point, of course, but left me with a bad taste in m mouth.

You really made a great choice, I have looked at the A4 and A6 for some time, but now also the new Sony`s as well. Congrats to great purchase.

 

[cgardnerma]

$700 for the emotiva with a 850 VA toroidal and 90,000 capacitance? Em were the days!

What is your LCR?

It's a killer amp for the $$. Just crazy. Kills my back to move it though! 12 years old and has not had an easy life.

For LCR and surrounds, I have five Ascend Media CMT-340. They're not fancy, but sound great, handle good power and are very durable! Same vintage as Emotiva.

 

[cgardnerma]

What Marantz? Was that after they switched to the 3 year warranties?

5009

 

[techsamurai]

5009

Yeah, they were down to the 3 year warranties by then. When Marantz switched their warranties from 5 to 3 years, I was afraid it was because their products or parts they were using were less reliable. It just may have been. Which is what scares me with their flagship products which use the same parts except for some upgrades here and there..

 

[adam0bmx0]

My question wasn't Denon vs Yamaha, but whether I should run 2 channel from the Yamaha and Emotiva for the rest, or LCR & Surround from the Emotiva and use the Yamaha just for the 4 Atmos speakers.

I only use room correction for volume and delay and EQ for the sub only. I use my own measurement mic and REW. The Yamaha seems much more flexible in this use case with their LOW EQ mode and all the parametric EQs. I will find out if this is the case, but the manual graphic EQ in Audyssey is terrible for this.

Ok, so I have an A6A and have had it for some time now.

The PEQ you can apply is limited for subs.

You can only apply up to 4 filters and you have to pick pre-set Hz and Q factors.

So if REW determines you have big spike/boost at say 55Hz, in the A6A the Hz you can select may not be exactly 55Hz, it goes up in like 4Hz options from 25Hz or something like that.

Q factor is also a preset value , so again, you might not have the option the the exact same one REW suggests.

So, 4 filters may not be an issue if you run a sub with amps that can apply additional ones, take SVS for example, you can apply up to 3 filter using the amp.

So in theory combined with the A6A you’re up to 7 filters.

You can restrict REW to 4 filters, so it will then try its best to achieve what you want it too.

This is what I played around with to create a house curve and apply it manually, as I didn’t have a miniDSP for this setup (I do in my other room using 4 subs)

I also run my A6A with.m a ROTEL 1555 (a 5 channel amp @ 125w RMS per channel)

I didn’t notice too much improvement adding this into my setup (5.2.4) maybe highlighting just how good the internal amps on the A6A are.

Anyways, hope the above makes sense, and questions feel free to ask.

 

[cgardnerma]

Good thing you clarify this, I thought you asked the question because you thought the A6A has more stout and cleaner amps than the Denon.

In that case, the answer is as simple as your question, the Emo amp is better suited for the LCR. The avr, either one, is more suited for the other channels. That's based objective measurements.

In 2-channel use, the Yamaha has slightly more power and lower distortion than the Emotiva if I am reading the specs right. That was what drove my question about using the internal Yamaha amps for two channel instead of the Emotiva.

That said, for two-channel (my use case), the Yamaha actually DOES have more rated power and slightly lower distortion than the Denon. It also has 50% more capacitance, a seemingly much bigger transformer (15lb weight difference!), a better DAC and XLR ins and outs for two-channel.

A6A vs. 3800H
150w (0.06% THD) vs. 105w (0.08% THD) 2ch 8 ohm 20-20kHz
2x 18,000μF vs 2x 12,000μF capacitors
ESS 9026 Pro DAC (LCR) vs. PCM5102A DA
41.2lbs vs 27.6lbs

Again, for my use case, a better choice, I think.

Ok, so I have an A6A and have had it for some time now.

The PEQ you can apply is limited for subs.

You can only apply up to 4 filters and you have to pick pre-set Hz and Q factors.

So if REW determines you have big spike/boost at say 55Hz, in the A6A the Hz you can select may not be exactly 55Hz, it goes up in like 4Hz options from 25Hz or something like that.

Q factor is also a preset value , so again, you might not have the option the the exact same one REW suggests.

So, 4 filters may not be an issue if you run a sub with amps that can apply additional ones, take SVS for example, you can apply up to 3 filter using the amp.

So in theory combined with the A6A you’re up to 7 filters.

You can restrict REW to 4 filters, so it will then try its best to achieve what you want it too.

This is what I played around with to create a house curve and apply it manually, as I didn’t have a miniDSP for this setup (I do in my other room using 4 subs)

I also run my A6A with.m a ROTEL 1555 (a 5 channel amp @ 125w RMS per channel)

I didn’t notice too much improvement adding this into my setup (5.2.4) maybe highlighting just how good the internal amps on the A6A are.

Anyways, hope the above makes sense, and questions feel free to ask.

Wow, so helpful. Thank you! I read the manual and it does seem to indicate you can change the center frequency, Q and gain when you are in manual mode. I thought I read you have to copy the freq values from the YPAO Low Frequency test into a manual setting and then you can edit. Or maybe I am misunderstanding. You actually have the device in front of you! Or maybe they let you do it the other channels, but not the sub??

 

[adam0bmx0]

Yes, you’re correct, you run YPAO to configure all your speakers, copy over to manual, and then you can tweak sub settings.

But like I said, the options to edit the bands for the subs are a bit limited. See attached pics of the values you can select. Again these may not be exactly the same as what REW suggests you need to pick.

The Hz options are pretty closely spaced, closer than my initial memory of 4Hz increments.

Q factor are not as closely spaced, but still useful.

 

[techsamurai]

Hi folks. I have a Yamaha A6A on order which will likely replace the Denon 3800H I have been auditioning in my 5.1.4 setup. I also have an Emotiva UPA-7 which is 12 years old, and has been flawless, that will continue to see duty and take some load off of the AVR.

My question is simple. I usually run the 5 channel bed layer with the Emotiva and let the amp handle the Atmos speakers. With the Yamaha and it's pretty stout and clean 2-channel performance, I was actually considering running the L/R speakers with the Yamaha and the rest with the Emotiva. I know I am probably splitting inaudible hairs here, but I figured I would put the question to my fellow audio nerds. What do you think?

you have more channels than speakers - 9 speakers vs 16 amplified channels. I would separate LCR on the Emotiva or the Yamaha and see which one you like better.

You'll clearly bi-amp your LR cause there's no point in not doing so unless you have bookshelves or just 1 binding post. I suspect you'll choose the Emotiva because of the toroidal but I'm curious to see which one you prefer.

 

[cgardnerma]

Yes, you’re correct, you run YPAO to configure all your speakers, copy over to manual, and then you can tweak sub settings.

But like I said, the options to edit the bands for the subs are a bit limited. See attached pics of the values you can select. Again these may not be exactly the same as what REW suggests you need to pick.

The Hz options are pretty closely spaced, closer than my initial memory of 4Hz increments.

Q factor are not as closely spaced, but still useful.

Ahh. Got it. Very interesting. Not quite mini DSP, but better than a graphic EQ, and maybe close enough!