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Noise pickup with phono stage RCA cables

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Thorin

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Three new 8' ground rods and 30 ft of 10ga. Copper wire later (added to my neighbors fence), the buzzing is noticeably less. Still not gone. My Tripp Lite IS1000 seems to pass that transient right through, and make it worse. Apparently I was wrong, and it makes sense that it being AC noise, it would pass through the AC transformer.

What do I need to properly Filter that noise? Seems like the unit circuitry would have to build is own sine wave and not just pass through the one it's processing. Am I too high? What am I missing here?
 

dualazmak

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Philbo King

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Three new 8' ground rods and 30 ft of 10ga. Copper wire later (added to my neighbors fence), the buzzing is noticeably less. Still not gone. My Tripp Lite IS1000 seems to pass that transient right through, and make it worse. Apparently I was wrong, and it makes sense that it being AC noise, it would pass through the AC transformer.

What do I need to properly Filter that noise? Seems like the unit circuitry would have to build is own sine wave and not just pass through the one it's processing. Am I too high? What am I missing here?
Common mode choke(s) and maybe some 10 MHz ferrite beads might help.
 
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Thorin

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you need to try isolation transformer plus power conditioner/cleaner unit such as ACCUPHASE PS-1250
Exactly, but I need a solution that doesn't cost $10,000, or even $2000. Thanks for helping me identify the product family though. I now know In looking for a power "regenerator"!
 
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Thorin

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Common mode choke(s) and maybe some 10 MHz ferrite beads might help.
Thanks for the idea, but this is not high frequency interference. This is an impulsive transient being fed back into the power system of my neighborhood. I don't see how either of these will help.
 

raindance

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Some electric fences work by connecting the "live" to the fence and the "neutral" is connected via a fairly deep stake in the ground. These work best when the ground is fairly moist and aren't very efficient. I'd think these would contaminate the ground nearby quite a lot with noise. If a power regenerator is used, like a fairly simple APC UPS, you might be in luck. You could test it with and without mains present.

The other, better, electric fence concept has alternating live and neutral strands and doesn't rely on the ground.

You're still trying to prove if it's conducted noise or noise picked up through the air, right? Let's hope it isn't through the air as you don't need to live in a faraday cage.

You really still need measurements to characterize the noise. Something your neighbor is doing is not to code. You might call the power company to resolve this.
 
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I
If a power regenerator is used, like a fairly simple APC UPS, you might be in luck. You could test it with and without mains present.
The UPS won't help me because I can't run my stereo on battery power. I tried an APC UPS and it apparently doesn't regenerate power.
You're still trying to prove if it's conducted noise or noise picked up through the air, right?
I hadn't thought it was through the air, and I sure hope it's not too!
Something your neighbor is doing is not to code. You might call the power company to resolve this.
I tried ComEd, but haven't been able to navigate through their bureaucracy yet. All they will do is send out a technician, and I don't need them at my house, I need them next door. What I really want to do is have a conversation with a ComEd employee on the phone...
You really still need measurements to characterize the noise.
I plan to be over there again soon, at least to water down the ground rod locations. We've had a drought here in Illinois, and the rods are under cement pads, so I suspect it's pretty arid under there.
 

raindance

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May I ask why you can't run on battery power? UPS too small? You should be able to size it such that you'll get a few minutes to test.
 
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You should be able to size it such that you'll get a few minutes to test.
I see, I thought you meant I could run my audio system with that as a power regenerator. What would I be testing for with this approach?
 

Philbo King

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Thanks for the idea, but this is not high frequency interference. This is an impulsive transient being fed back into the power system of my neighborhood. I don't see how either of these will help.
An impulse exists only when high frequency elements add up at the correct phases and amplitudes. Filter out the highs and the impulse is no longer an impulse. That's why I went there...
 

antcollinet

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To check the fence charger or the stereo?
I have a theory...

By a strange coincidence, I watched this this morning...

A description of how a 16 kHz very low frequency radio morse code signal was embedded in the Tubular Bells album at an inaudible level. If you watch the video, you can see how big the antenna is for an ultra low frequency radio transmitter.

Clearly the electric fence is interfering at audio frequencies. What is the likelihood that the 200 mile fence is operating as a very low frequency transmitter at those frequencies.

If that is the case then any electrical loops in your system might be acting as a loop antenna to pick up those frequencies. You need to eliminate any electrical loops in your system, and if that is not possible, make them as small as possible and keep the conductors of the loop close together to minimise the loop area. A loop could be, for example, from mains to your turntable through the ground connection to your preamp, and then back to mains from the preamp power supply.

Disclaimer: not a radio engineer here and definitely not a VLF engineer. I could be talking absolute bollocks :cool:

 
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Thorin

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Everyone! I ran an extension wire over from my house to the fence charger and the problem went away. So we traced the lines in his barn and they went through a rheostat that controlled ceiling fans. The fans are long gone, so we took thar out of the circuit and... problem solved. Sometimes it's the littlest thing.

As always thanks for the great support!
 

MAB

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Everyone! I ran an extension wire over from my house to the fence charger and the problem went away. So we traced the lines in his barn and they went through a rheostat that controlled ceiling fans. The fans are long gone, so we took thar out of the circuit and... problem solved. Sometimes it's the littlest thing.

As always thanks for the great support!
Persistence really paid off.
Glad you didn't buy any gear, despite some very odd and expensive suggestions;).
 

antcollinet

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Everyone! I ran an extension wire over from my house to the fence charger and the problem went away. So we traced the lines in his barn and they went through a rheostat that controlled ceiling fans. The fans are long gone, so we took thar out of the circuit and... problem solved. Sometimes it's the littlest thing.

As always thanks for the great support!
I'm going to relentlessly cling to my completely uneducated and un-evidenced theory, and say that the Rheostat was operating as the VLF antenna.

:p
 
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Thorin

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Glad you didn't buy any gear, despite some very odd and expensive suggestions;).
You're right there. The answer is usually easy. Finding the right question, not so much.
 
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Thorin

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I'm going to relentlessly cling to my completely uneducated and un-evidenced theory, and say that the Rheostat was operating as the VLF antenna.

:p
You win for the most government conspiracy-type answer!! :)
 
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