New Schiit SYN - Analog Surround Sound Processor

[mhardy6647]

A solution to what exactly? This is a cut down featureless AVR preamp from the 2000's.
It doesn't solve anything. It's not a solution to surround formats because every. single. AVR. regardless of price and since the 2000's can do what this can and much more.

Its only feature is being small.

... and it has a trendy (or, perhaps, once-trendy?) name on it, with a willing "audience" who will snap up pretty much whatever is offered to them in the way of... ahhh... Schiit.

 

[Deleted member 48726]

No-but you do you

What other features does it have then?

 

[lostinpr]

Return of the Hafler "ambience retrieval" box?



I mean, matrix "quad" was a thing ca. 1972.

If I remember well, once Dolby Surround began to be a thing in the 90s, Dynaco released its QD-1 series 2 L matrix surround sound decoder, and Chase Technologies released its own version but really a copy of the Dynaco. I got the Dynaco in those years but can't remember how it sounded because I had really sh---y speakers and no center speaker nor sub. When I could buy an AVR and some good speakers I threw the QD-1 away.
The SYN threw me back to those years and just out of curiosity bought the Chase Tech over the Dynaco in eBay because it has line outputs for the center and surround channels and I figured that a couple of small Chinese amps would do the job.
After trying this matrix surround sound thing I sold my AVR, which was the entry level Sony so not a great deal.
What do I like about it? How it delivers the center channel, the dialogue seems to come out of the screen and not from a very specific point under the tv. The music in the movie sounds so much better, maybe because now it is spread between the three speakers. And my music sources sound much more natural than through an AVR.
What I lack is remote control over the center and surround speakers, I guess the SYN would fix that but there is one thing where the SYN falls short compared to my cheap stereo receiver and that is inputs: the SYN only has one analog input and I have a cd player, a turntable and a Bluetooth receiver.
If the S people come up with a version with more analog inputs I will consider getting it.

 

[mhardy6647]

I mean... there're always switch boxes to add analog (line level) inputs.

This one has audio and video (coax NTSC) inputs and output, but one may simply ignore the video channel -- or use it for something else.

 

[lostinpr]

I mean... there're always switch boxes to add analog (line level) inputs.

This one has audio and video (coax NTSC) inputs and output, but one may simply ignore the video channel -- or use it for something else.

yes, there are! but with no remote

 

[mhardy6647]

yes, there are! but with no remote

They do exist with remotes as well -- I have one upstairs I believe it was sold under the Philips brand (I found it on the swap pile at the Harvard, MA town dump some years back).

 

[lostinpr]

ok!

 

[lostinpr]

What other features does it have then?

it appeals to gamers for its dac and mic-headphone connectors plus the possibility that a gamer could expand to surround sound. it appeals to me because I like surround for video but not the miriad adjustments needed because the auto calibration never gets it right. its simplicity appeases my ocd .

 

[Deleted member 48726]

it appeals to gamers for its dac and mic-headphone connectors plus the possibility that a gamer could expand to surround sound. it appeals to me because I like surround for video but not the miriad adjustments needed because the auto calibration never gets it right. its simplicity appeases my ocd .

An AVR has headphone out.
A gamer concerned about sound clues would use EQ and true surround decoding if available in game.
You don't have OCD. I know because if you did, you would rather value true decoding and pre defined sound distribution than two arbitrary knobs that does fake surround.

 

[TuliaNonTroppo]

First post on this forum.

I hoped I was the target market for the Syn.
I really enjoy DPLII. I have an old Denon AVR-3808ci and use it to listen to my multichannel/quad music files fed by Roon and also REALLY enjoy upmixed stereo. I think it brings a fun component to my hobby. But when I read more and realized the Syn may be simply a DPLII equivalent tool but yet not a replacement device and would just be yet another component to add to my rack, I was honestly sad. I own quite a bit of Schiit gear and enjoy most of it. But I don’t want to buy an equivalent device and move sideways.

My AVR is getting to be almost 20 years old. The HDMI still works, the DPLII still works, there hasn’t been any chains I need breaking from and there are no constant updates that affect me. New gear still works with old gear. There is no obsolescence outside of technology just getting decades old. I don’t see a problem that Schiit is telling me is there much less buy into the hyperbole that the system is broken and this simplistic device will liberate me from the proprietary iron fist of fly farts above me (or whatever). It reminds me of those old infomercials where the actors are obviously fumbling with technology when there isn’t really anything to fumble with. Remember those?

Again, I want to be the target market for this product. I like supporting Schiit and also want something BETTER than DPLII if I am going to spend more money. I watch forums to get comparison reviews on the Syn compared to DPLII, but most of it is theoretical (like most of the posts in this thread). Then I learn about the Involve Surround Master v3. This might be a device that upmixes stereo signals better than DPLII. I haven’t read anything about the Syn that indicates it will create a sound field that I might find superior to my existing technology. It might, but it is $400 or a restocking fee if the roll of the dice ends unsatisfactory. So now I wait for reviews for the Syn vs DPLII and/or vs the SM v3. I think there is something better than DPLII, but I just don’t know what that is yet.

I don’t need any of them, really, because my decades old AVR still works and works well and it must remain ANYWAY because nothing else will give me upmixed stereo signals AND process my dedicated 5.1 and 4.0 mixes via HDMI. To disregard those mixes as unimportant pretty much makes me want to scratch off the product being advertised.

I’m just kinda bummed, but obviously I am still reading the threads hoping for reviews.

 

[EJ3]

An AVR has headphone out.
A gamer concerned about sound clues would use EQ and true surround decoding if available in game.
You don't have OCD. I know because you would rather value true decoding and pre defined sound distribution than two arbitrary knobs that does fake surround.

In my life, I have mostly only listened to headphones (wireless but high quality, not cheapo) when working outside, around the house, with noisy equipment. I do not game & usually listen to the stereo through speakers. I do not own a TV (nor have had a TV or cable since 2007). In 1990 I had the then very top of the line Denon AVR. And had a slightly odd 6.2 surround setup.
But in the 70's I had a surround setup. Since I now live in a TINY 2 bedroom home (& despise many, many speakers taking up space [& also despise headphones/IEMs for in home listening]), this SYN appeals to me. In the end, a simple 4.2 (perhaps the .2 will be mono, but each custom sub [FR 20 Hz- 80 Hz gets it's own 500 watt RMS amp]). My only issue is that I would like stereo .2.
There is a very good chance that next year this will be in my system (I have already blown through my stereo budget for this year).

 

[ThatGuyYouKnow]

With regard to Dolby Pro Logic II, I was amazed 20 years ago by how great it worked with supporting GameCube games. The positional accuracy blew my mind.

 

[lostinpr]

An AVR has headphone out.
A gamer concerned about sound clues would use EQ and true surround decoding if available in game.
You don't have OCD. I know because if you did, you would rather value true decoding and pre defined sound distribution than two arbitrary knobs that does fake surround.

the SYN has a headphone amp, not the same as a receiver headphone out according to Schiit.
about "fake" surround, well, digital gimmickry is also faking it but, hey, my shrink has the last word about my ocd hee hee!

 

[lostinpr]

I find this really dumb. This "surround processor" is known as a mid-side processor in the studio/production world. You can do this pretty easily in DSP if you have a DAC with enough outputs.

https://www.voxengo.com/product/msed/ this freebie plus some basic filters is all you need to recreate this device, should you so choose.

Anyway, the fact that DIY solutions exist isn't really the point.

This device really abuses the idea of actual surround sound, and IMO is too liberal in terms of messing with the original mix. I don't want what schiit thinks the song should sound like, I want what the band/producer/mixing engineer thought the song should sound like. Hard pass from me.

they do nothing to the song, they are a stereo two-channel company that added analog surround to a dac-headphoneamp-preamp analog combination that I think is first in their lineup (I could be wrong on the last).

 

[lostinpr]

That's fine. But you then have 3-5 amps on your desktop to handle the 5 surround channels? I'm not aware of any compact 5-channel amps?

you can do with three Rekkers, they are small; if I buy it I will use three chifi little amps

 

[lostinpr]

I dunno, this isn't even real surround, it's just stereo split into multiple channels according to the whim of Schiit...

it is analog surround, but who gets to decide what is "real" surround in a world of digital gimmickry everywhere?

 

[lostinpr]

For that "vintage DAC" cachet.

I have been trying to detect differences between DACs since 1999, I should give up already hee hee!

 

[lostinpr]

Headphones are two channel devices. The "surround" processing is done to manipulate the signal into a 2 channel output. DSP is much more suitable/capable for this purpose.

[Edit] I'd think a DSP with a matrix mixer (plus a multi-channel DAC or audio interface) can easily do what this device does and much more.

at the same price of this four-way package?

 

[Hayabusa]

I have run years with a surround speaker connected over the +L and +R speaker terminals.. works better than expected

 

[lostinpr]

Crossfeed is just a tiny part. DSP can do much more than that. See below link for some ideas of what Dr. David Griesinger did with his Logic 7 upmixer, and the issues he was trying to address. And that was 15-30 years old. The "technology" used in this Schiit product is about as primitive as it gets.

http://www.davidgriesinger.com/surround_from_stereo2.ppt

I don't think they claim it is new technology.