Master Thread: Are measurements Everything or Nothing?

[Veri]

I want to give my review on 8 devices: smsl su-x, smsl sh-x, topping a70 pro, smsl su-10, smsl do400, aune s17pro, sound blaster ae-9, sound blaster ae-5. Overall, in the order of purchase, briefly: sound blaster ae-5 works the same as sound blaster ae-9. I didn't understand it back then, but later I learned that I should have bought an amplifier, but by that time I had decided to buy something else. Rating 3/10. Then I bought smsl do400. I bought it at a discount for $386.09. This one is top-notch, I really liked it, the soundstage is large and detailed everywhere, except for the height, meaning it's hard to say at what height exactly the sound is, but the sound is detailed around the sides, and I'm satisfied. I only listen to pop and electronic music depending on my mood, classical music. I'd rate it 6/10, for its price, you can't find a better device, and I'll still sell it in a few days. I want to say that the sound is perfectly balanced only with the native amplifier, as I connected it to aune s17pro. I bought it for $492.64 on Black Friday discount, the sound was better, but my headphones had 16 ohms resistance, and the amplifier was for 32, it was my mistake, there were distortions at high volume, in general, this amplifier lacks volume, and I can't say much about it because I returned it right away. I bought both s17pro and su-10 at the same time, I immediately understood that su-10 is better than my do400 at 8/10, it's warm by 40% and precise by 20%, so the sound as if warms the ears, and it's nice in music, but not always good in games. I wanted to keep it for myself, but then the new smsl su-x came out, and I immediately understood that while I could return it, I bought su-10 for $658.46 on Black Friday discount. Topping a70 pro, I bought it for $412.30 and connected it to smsl do400, the sound was the same, nonsense, I thought, I increased the volume and was very surprised that it muted the sound at 10 dB and above, and I was afraid that the headphones would suffer from abrupt turning on and off at high volume, I thought, the DAC is crap, now the new smsl su-x will come, and it will be fine, no, it's the same, the firmware was the newest from the factory, and I didn't change anything in the settings, as it arrived, I even reset the settings to factory ones, it didn't help, it still muted, in short, I didn't like it both in design and in sound, because my built-in amplifier for $200 sounded the same, I wrote to the seller, asked, he said, there's power protection, why the hell give such power, idiotic device, rating 5/10, maybe you need to use it only with topping, I switched all the settings, but you can't disable the protection, my headphones are Hifiman XS. smsl sh-x, the sound is the most transparent, it will sound as you set it up, namely, there are 3 types of amplification: low, the sound sounded simple, and I lacked bass, MID — this is my favorite sound, very strong bass, strong and fast, high I haven't tried, it arrived only 2 days ago, I bought it for $602.30, I want to say that when connected to do400 it sounded better, but at high volume there were distortions in the mode without filter, if you switch the filter, there's almost no noise, in general, the amplifier interfered with the balanced sound of do400, my rating for smsl sh-x is 10/10, the best I've listened to, for its flexible adjustment, design, it's louder than all the amplifiers I've listened to here, and I like everything about it, and in my new DAC smsl su-x — it's my perfect sound for both music and games, I'd define the sound as 25% warm, 25% precise — it's the perfect balance for all kinds of music and games, the soundstage is the widest of all, the detail is perfect in terms of balance, precision, and warmth, it's pleasant to listen to. It perfectly matches the sound of SMSL SH-X, definitely much better than Topping. Topping just suffocates the sound of SMS SU-X. The filter settings are audible and not at the level of seeming, but definitely with a sound tint, I like to listen without filter and sound tint, standard, I'll post my review in other topics of these devices' data. If you have any questions, I'll be happy to answer in more detail.

Excuse me sir but have you heard about this thing,

it's called paragraphs. Structuring the essay....

 

[pundel]

I didn’t have any problems with smsl sh-x I used paragraphs. Structuring the essay I wanted to tell my experience in full for people who are looking for their own sound, since I came to the forum half a year ago, I was looking for the kind of information that I wrote and you all wrote about some kind of nonsense, I come to the forum only to find out that experienced by other buyers

 

[Music1969]

Great so you dont have any problem with your HifiMan headphones with the SMSL SH-X, is it right? And seems that you had our same problem with the Topping A70 Pro, correct?

Before continued blaming of Topping A70Pro, lets see first how your test with high pass filter, to filter DC in the music?

Something DAC should be doing, but software can also do

 

[marcom22]

Before continued blaming of Topping A70Pro, lets see first how your test with high pass filter, to filter DC in the music?

Something DAC should be doing, but software can also do

Music1969 I really appreciated your help and suggestions please dont misunderstand me ..... but remember we are applying a "fix" where Topping missing. The unit has deficit and we are understanding exactly where is the problem ..... hardware problem. Thanks for all.

 

[Music1969]

Music1969 I really appreciated your help and suggestions please dont misunderstand me ..... but remember we are applying a "fix" where Topping missing. The unit has deficit and we are understanding exactly where is the problem ..... hardware problem. Thanks for all.

If this is a DC content issue, i dont think you can blame Topping

As has been mentioned many times, DACs are good at dealing with its... what DAC model are you using ?

I am using RME ADI-2 and A70Pro and no issue with those tracks....

 

[pundel]

I don’t want to figure it out, I want to buy it and listen to music

 

[john11]

If you say you like an amplifier we have no problem with that. If you say that by making a DIY modification you can certainly and obviously improve the sound quality then you allow me to be wary, as with any subjective consideration that is passed off as absolute truth.
There are plenty omod i suggestf sites out there where at least questionable statements are made based only on one's beliefs, but not here. We want evidence.

The proof is very simple as i suggested earlier. Simply perform the mod i recommended, listen, and report back your findings. If you are honest then it will very easily prove i am right. Listening is good and should be included in an end overall judgement.
At the end of the day in all honesty i am not selling any products, i am not affiliated with any manufacturer, there is no clickbait in my posts. What i am trying to do is help people, and my advice is very easy to follow up on and corroborate, if you have the courage to enter the real world and perform a little work of your own, or are you forever going to be an armchair critic who relies on unproven bias opinion

 

[Beave]

The proof is very simple as i suggested earlier. Simply perform the mod i recommended, listen, and report back your findings. If you are honest then it will very easily prove i am right. Listening is good and should be included in an end overall judgement.
At the end of the day in all honesty i am not selling any products, i am not affiliated with any manufacturer, there is no clickbait in my posts. What i am trying to do is help people, and my advice is very easy to follow up on and corroborate, if you have the courage to enter the real world and perform a little work of your own, or are you forever going to be an armchair critic who relies on unproven bias opinion

Exactly HOW you do that listening makes all the difference in the world. Controls matter.

 

[StigErik]

I used to believe in capacitor “upgrades” of various kinds as well. That is - until I did a proper double blind ABX test…..

 

[Doodski]

I used to believe in capacitor “upgrades” of various kinds as well. That is - until I did a proper double blind ABX test…..

I used to believe in not using capacitors lol... I really did. Direct coupled etc is the ultimate I thought.

 

[Axo1989]

I'm just quoting this for posterity.

Well, that was fun while it lasted.

 

[Beave]

Well, that was fun while it lasted.

His post does an excellent job of showing all of us that he is either trolling or is a lunatic. Either way, we now know he is not to be taken seriously.

 

[Talisman]

The proof is very simple as i suggested earlier. Simply perform the mod i recommended, listen, and report back your findings. If you are honest then it will very easily prove i am right. Listening is good and should be included in an end overall judgement.
At the end of the day in all honesty i am not selling any products, i am not affiliated with any manufacturer, there is no clickbait in my posts. What i am trying to do is help people, and my advice is very easy to follow up on and corroborate, if you have the courage to enter the real world and perform a little work of your own, or are you forever going to be an armchair critic who relies on unproven bias opinion

you really don't understand what we mean, never mind

 

[voodooless]

or are you forever going to be an armchair critic who relies on unproven bias opinion

Projection

If this forum should have taught anyone anything, it is that “just listening” isn’t enough by a long shot. It’s unreliable as a comparison tool and therefore should not be used as such. This has been proven by countless peer reviewed academic papers. There is no way around this.

The proof is very simple

By that measure ghost exist, homeopathy works, astrology is true, etc… this is not how science works, but clearly you are not interested in science.

 

[antcollinet]

Why are you so totally and utterly obsessed with calculations, what's wrong with playing some music and enjoying it

How do you think the amplifier was designed in the first place? Do you think engineers just throw components together at random (as you seem to do) until something sounds good?

I promise you - they'd never get even close to 100 SINAD - or anything that sounds good to a large population - that way.

 

[antcollinet]

some utter nonsense utterly unrelated to audio. (Since mine is the only post quoting said nonsense still existing Ive decided to remove it out of respect to the mods). I have a copy though.

Holy shit we've caught a live one.

And we are confused why he thinks adding a single random capacitor to an audible (close to) perfect amp is going to make a difference?

 

[vicenzo_del_paris]

Holy shit we've caught a live one.

And we are confused why he thinks adding a single random capacitor to an audible (close to) perfect amp is going to make a difference?

The only reasonable, proven and tangible fact from his statement is:

Don't trust boris johnson

Sorry, I couldn't resist doing it

 

[Doodski]

This is extreme madness. Just about every piece of hardware on the planet contains capacitors, yet we do not see houses burning down, we do not see flammable electrolyte being chucked everywhere

Hi @john11. I have ~55K units of electronic circuitry repairs under my belt over a period of ~15 years as a electronic technician working at the bench plus another ~15K MODs performed on new product that came from the Japanese factories either needing more parts or missing parts. I have seen lotsa gear and I have experience that I can reliably depend on. As per capacitors burning houses down I have not seen that and probably would not see that because the house would be destroyed. I have seen many many many capacitors that are split open, burst open, came shooting off the PCB from the immense pressure that caused them to be ejected and fly off, seen them become fluffy bits spread all around inside the box that the electronics where in, seen them wet everything in the peripheral with the acidic stuff that is inside the electrolytic capacitors, seen them explode on the workbench when peeps attempted to shock and awe me with exploding caps at 8:30 am when I arrived at work for the day and tasted and swallowed the salty capacitor acid goo that was on my fingers. They do blow and cause lotsa issues and sometimes they flame out too and can be dangerous that way or explode and take out eyeballs. I'm going to take a wild guess-timate and say I have replaced several thousands of capacitors in assorted home audio gear, portable audio systems, car audio amps and car EQs and car audio active crossovers etc. Please do not mount smoothing electrolytic capacitors outside the device cabinet soldered onto the power leads going into the device. It is madness and it's really unsafe and just a matter of time before a upset event happens whether that be a major or minor event. I would never do that and I encourage you to not do that too.

The premise of adding additional smoothing or increased electron storage to the power supply as you are apparently doing is a real thing and does happen and the effect may be seen when viewing the power supply rails on a good oscilloscope. I have done this exact same MOD to power supplies way back in the day when I was a newbie and I stuffed the capacitors into the cabinet so they where safely isolated inside from peeps and myself too. When viewing the power supply rails the oscilloscope magnification that was required to view the additional smoothing of the power supply rails waveform was on the level of being absurdly high because the improvement was miniscule. The increased available voltage on the power supply rails due to the additional storage of electrons in the increased capacitance was on the order of ~a couple hundred milliVolts or so @ best when under load. That's 2 hundreds of thousandsths of a volt more voltage. When that increased voltage is used in the audio amplifier circuitry output to the speakers the difference in dB of output is on the order of ~10ths at best of percentage of a dB if that and that is impossible to hear. Absolutely not possible for the human ear to realize a difference that small under any conditions possible. So to be very frank with you I am telling you that you are doing great on the MODing front and getting experience although not actually doing much of anything effective. I suggest doing more MODs although I suggest MODing your approach and MODing something more effective.

 

[antcollinet]

The only reasonable, proven and tangible fact from his statement is:


Sorry, I couldn't resist doing it

I concur. I'd add "and not just him" but fear that would stray too far over the line into politics.

 

[amirm]

Folks, stay on audio topic. Posts deleted.