Is there a method to make headphones sound *flat to your own ears*?

[Volutrik]

The ears used by the GRAS system are very different than mine and I actually find the harman target kinda harsh and maybe that's because of this difference. But no matter how much EQ I apply, it kinda creates other problems in other frequency ranges and it just becomes an endless spiral it seems.
I tried using sine sweeps before to correct the harman target, specially above 6kHz, but it always ends up sounding kinda off, like it's overly processed (maybe I'm doing something wrong).
I also get really confused because both harman and sonarworks claim they will flatten out headphones, but they sound really different from each other.
The only way one could achieve a true flat sound would be to have the respective ears' related transfer function measured, but no one has access to an anechoic chamber to do this.
How could one achieve a flat sound with a DYI solution? This whole flat thing is a rabbit hole and I'm going insane lol

 

[NTK]

You may try Dr David Griesinger's method. More information is available at his website.

http://dgsonicfocus.com/

 

[Volutrik]

You may try Dr David Griesinger's method. More information is available at his website.

http://dgsonicfocus.com/

Thanks! I'm watchig this and it just made me think about a method that wouldn't require calibrated speakers to achieve similar results, but this time for ear transfer related function:
What if I EQ my headphones to make them completely flat (and when I say flat I mean the true flat, dark, boring sound), then, after this, do an equal loudness test and invert the result of that equal loudness test to basically have my own Ear's Transfer Related Function (ERTF), making me able to EQ my headphones to that?

EDIT: Actualy, I guess there would be a problem with this method. In order to flatten out the headphones, a measurement of it's frequency response would be required, measurement of which would've already been done using a GRAS system, which has it's own HRTF. If I flatten out the headphones by ear though, there will no longer be the possibility to do this "inverting method" because I would've already included my own ERTF in the process.
I guess it isn't really useful lol Do you have any takes on why this would or not work?

 

[Dunring]

I'd start with a Sennheiser hd600 and then use APO equalizer with Peace which has that hearing test to compensate to your personal hearing with a curve. Ive used the test and it should get you really flat. Even a wax buildup can throw things off and drive you nuts.

 

[Volutrik]

I'd start with a Sennheiser hd600 and then use APO equalizer with Peace which has that hearing test to compensate to your personal hearing with a curve. Ive used the test and it should get you really flat. Even a wax buildup can throw things off and drive you nuts.

Thanks. I did it and it sounds good, but I have a question. It sounds way different than harman, harman sounds muffled if compared to the EQ APO method, while harman states that the target is considering the ear gain and the sound of speakers. Is that right? Does the same happen to you? It kinda sounds like it has too much ear gain when compared to harman, but after a while I get used to it, when the same happens if I listen to harman after a while. I've added more bass too, about 7dB, but that's just preference.

Edit: I compared the EQ APO settings on my over ear headphones to the sound of my IEMs and they sound pretty alike, unlike the over ears with harman compared to the IEMs, so I guess that's right

 

[Loomynarty]

Thanks. I did it and it sounds good, but I have a question. It sounds way different than harman, harman sounds muffled if compared to the EQ APO method, while harman states that the target is considering the ear gain and the sound of speakers. Is that right? Does the same happen to you? It kinda sounds like it has too much ear gain when compared to harman, but after a while I get used to it, when the same happens if I listen to harman after a while. I've added more bass too, about 7dB, but that's just preference.

Edit: I compared the EQ APO settings on my over ear headphones to the sound of my IEMs and they sound pretty alike, unlike the over ears with harman compared to the IEMs, so I guess that's right

I've sort of gone down the same rabbit hole but I went with a different approach after buying some flat measuring studio monitors. I built an in-ear mic, measured my speakers left and right channels then measured my R70x L+R channels, subtracted the difference from both frequency responses then made an eq for my R70x based on that. The result had too much ear gain but once I reduced that region it sounded pretty much the same as my speakers. The interesting part is that when I compared my home baked target to diffuse-field it was almost identical between 2 kHz - 8 kHz.

So if anything I'd suggest starting with DF as your target but try tilting it somewhere in the range of -0.5 to -1.0 dB/octave.

 

[Spyart]

I've sort of gone down the same rabbit hole but I went with a different approach after buying some flat measuring studio monitors. I built an in-ear mic, measured my speakers left and right channels then measured my R70x L+R channels, subtracted the difference from both frequency responses then made an eq for my R70x based on that. The result had too much ear gain but once I reduced that region it sounded pretty much the same as my speakers. The interesting part is that when I compared my home baked target to diffuse-field it was almost identical between 200 Hz - 8 kHz.

So if anything I'd suggest starting with DF as your target but try tilting it somewhere in the range of -0.5 to -1.0 dB/octave.

Nice! So R70x is muffled with no eq To you right? Did you try some crossfeed then? Also do you mind share your eq? Thanks in advance

 

[Greg Strickland]

Respectfully to all here (and Dr David Griesinger) I wonder how you will define, measure and "correct" the subtle aspects of the physical and private experience of hearing. That is, we can determine what is measurably and technically correct, according to the metrics that define correct. But only the listener can say what is correct to their perception.

In the recorded music world, reference monitoring and hearing perception of decision makers is the dominate factor. Who knows what that might have been. All you know is what you want to hear.

Perception of sound changes with age and by incidents that happen. Our perception of sound is changed by the listening environment. Headphones essentially remove room acoustics from the equation, but other aspects remain.

I rode in someone's car; they turned up the sound and the high end was jacked up. They told me how great it was. My conclusion is time and events had reduced that persons high frequency hearing threshold. There's no way they actually liked the audio itself, they liked the way it sounded once it got processed by their brain.

Is this thread about something completely different from what I addressed above? If so, my apologies, disregard this post.

​

 

[Loomynarty]

Nice! So R70x is muffled with no eq To you right? Did you try some crossfeed then? Also do you mind share your eq? Thanks in advance

I actually find the stock R70x tuning pretty ok besides being too warm. It's harman target EQs for over ear headphones that I have a problem with. Harman EQ always sounds muffled and/or like voices are coming through a walkie-talkie.

My results with crossfeed are mixed, it works well with some headphones, not all.

If you were to use my EQ for the R70x it most likely wouldn't sound right to you but to each their own.

Also, for reference this is how my EQ looks compared to diffuse field: