Is the Performance of a DAC Linked toCost?

[Sokel]

In terms of SQ no.
BUT that is if you get one of them,if you get 5 there's really no point,is it?

Same applies if you get one of them every year or two,cost comes the same as the ones lasted a decade if not more.
Good way to see cost is through time,that's the only solid variable.

 

[Purité Audio]

You yourself perfectly understand the inconsistency of this comparison.

Another thing is that "high price" does not always mean "adequate formal parameters for this price."
This is also a banality.
But in the case of consumer audio equipment, even justifications for this banality are not required.
Because consumer audio equipment is designed solely for enjoyment.
Therefore, everything is possible.
If someone is pleased with the very fact of owning an audio system for several millions, no one can and should not do anything with this, despite the formal parameters of this audio system.
The owner likes to own it.
It is not a fact that the owner even seriously listens to music.
It's all just for fun.
I know many people who keep beautiful reel-to-reel recorders in their equipment collection solely because a beautiful reel-to-reel recorder is nice to look at.
People enjoy surprisingly different things. Audio is one of the most harmless things like that

Absolutely buy what you enjoy, but would customers buy those products in the same numbers if they knew they were only purchasing because of aesthetics and not improved sound quality.
I don’t see any ad copy that says, ‘here’s our new $50k dac doesn’t it look smart, sounds exactly the same as a $500 Topping,RME ,SMSL’,
Keith

 

[Sokel]

sounds exactly the same as a $500 Topping,RME ,SMSL’,
Keith

Is there a 500$ RME???
WHERE,link please!

 

[DavidEdwinAston]

You yourself perfectly understand the inconsistency of this comparison.

Another thing is that "high price" does not always mean "adequate formal parameters for this price."
This is also a banality.
But in the case of consumer audio equipment, even justifications for this banality are not required.
Because consumer audio equipment is designed solely for enjoyment.
Therefore, everything is possible.
If someone is pleased with the very fact of owning an audio system for several millions, no one can and should not do anything with this, despite the formal parameters of this audio system.
The owner likes to own it.
It is not a fact that the owner even seriously listens to music.
It's all just for fun.
I know many people who keep beautiful reel-to-reel recorders in their equipment collection solely because a beautiful reel-to-reel recorder is nice to look at.
People enjoy surprisingly different things. Audio is one of the most harmless things like that

Do you not think that the"several millions", should decently, be spent on something actually useful for humanity?

 

[Purité Audio]

Salesman, just can’t help exaggerating!
The Dac-2 sells over here for around £600, which I realise is a little distance from. $500, I remember when you got 2 dollars for every pound those were the days ‘Rule Britannia Brittany’s rules the waves….’
Keith

 

[Sokel]

The Dac-2 sells over here for around £600,

Not much more but no USB or the features of the bigger one .

 

[Purité Audio]

The ADI -2 has USB in,

ADI-2-DAC FS - RME Audio Interfaces | Format Converters | Preamps | Network Audio & MADI Solutions

RME Audio Professional Live, Studio, Recording and Broadcast Solutions. Unrivalled Quality, Performance & Stability MADI Interfaces, Converters & Preamps.

www.rme-audio.de

Keith

 

[notsodeadlizard]

Absolutely buy what you enjoy, but would customers buy those products in the same numbers if they knew they were only purchasing because of aesthetics and not improved sound quality.
I don’t see any ad copy that says, ‘here’s our new $50k dac doesn’t it look smart, sounds exactly the same as a $500 Topping,RME ,SMSL’,
Keith

As soon as you say that the topping sounds like something else, you are only confirming the fact that it is about perception.
But perception is fundamentally subjective.
You can tell that some of the formal topping parameters are about the same or even better, no more.
Nobody forbids to say it.
Moreover, the formal parameters of somehigh-end DACs are quite unexpected, 0.1% THD doesn't scare anyone.

I myself have a cheap topping e30 II that I only bought because it was 60% off and I needed something temporary in a temporary place.
This is a normal DAC for this money.
No more.
I don't understand what the topping is all about.
I don't sell topping DACs.
I don't sell anything at all.

 

[Ra1zel]

but would customers buy those products in the same numbers if they knew they were only purchasing because of aesthetics and not improved sound quality

Personally that's what I did with Holo May

 

[Purité Audio]

Dacs at least properly engineered designs don’t have a ‘sound’ they are audibly transparent, so any well engineered dac including really expensive ones will be indistinguishable.
Digital is done and dusted.
You can of course pay quite a bit for poorly engineered product, often associated with the use of valves.
Keith

 

[Purité Audio]

Personally that's what I did with Holo May

It’s a pretty dac, I don't have any issue with that at all.

 

[Els]

He is answering the title of your topic - no it is not linked to cost.

Put simply - all Dacs which measure with inaudible noise and distortion don't have a sound. They will be indistinguishable from each other.

And this is the vast majority of Dacs made today. Some which do have audible noise and distortion (and this includes some very expensive models) can sound different - but if they do, you are hearing reduced fidelity - not improved.

"reduced fidelity" you say. Now there is a topic worth exploring, personalty I am willing to sacrifice a bit of fidelity for musical listenability. I listen to music by musicians, not the recording engineering's fantasy or over production.

 

[Els]

Dacs at least properly engineered designs don’t have a ‘sound’ they are audibly transparent, so any well engineered dac including really expensive ones will be indistinguishable.
Digital is done and dusted.
You can of course pay quite a bit for poorly engineered product, often associated with the use of valves.
Keith

"Poorly engineered products is an opinion" according to notable and experienced audio engineers who get big buck to produce quality products.

 

[Jimbob54]

"reduced fidelity" you say. Now there is a topic worth exploring, personalty I am willing to sacrifice a bit of fidelity for musical listenability. I listen to music by musicians, not the recording engineering's fantasy or over production.

You know the DAC doesnt care whether the recording is good or bad, or what your musical preferences are, dont you?

Why would anyone want anything less than full transparency from the D to A conversion when that is readily available?

 

[Els]

Absolutely buy what you enjoy, but would customers buy those products in the same numbers if they knew they were only purchasing because of aesthetics and not improved sound quality.
I don’t see any ad copy that says, ‘here’s our new $50k dac doesn’t it look smart, sounds exactly the same as a $500 Topping,RME ,SMSL’,
Keith

I have to agree with your comment because I own all three Dacs you mention, however Chord dacs and other pretty or ugly designs is a mater of taste, but I don't believe their creators' intention are just looks and profit.

 

[HarmonicTHD]

"reduced fidelity" you say. Now there is a topic worth exploring, personalty I am willing to sacrifice a bit of fidelity for musical listenability. I listen to music by musicians, not the recording engineering's fantasy or over production.

You are confusing music production with music reproduction. In reproduction you ideally want to hear the unaltered signal from the source (eg. digital stream, CD etc) because no matter how badly it might be produced / mixed, no amp or DAC etc will add “good” information and therefore improve the source. However if you want to alter the source, then get a DAW and add effects to your hearts content. Much more effective and cheaper than any other way.

 

[Jimbob54]

Salesman, just can’t help exaggerating!
The Dac-2 sells over here for around £600, which I realise is a little distance from. $500, I remember when you got 2 dollars for every pound those were the days ‘Rule Britannia Brittany’s rules the waves….’
Keith

If you can get one for £600 Keith I would happily buy from you for £700.

They currently go for £1k in the UK give or take. Inc VAT of course.

 

[Els]

You are confusing music production with music reproduction. In reproduction you ideally want to hear the unaltered signal from the source (eg. digital stream, CD etc) because no matter how badly it might be produced / mixed, no amp or DAC etc will add “good” information and therefore improve the source. However if you want to alter the source, then get a DAW and add effects to your hearts content. Much more effective and cheaper than any other way.

Actually, I dont want to add effects but mostly take away affects, also no everybody has an anachoic chamber in their residence. I think we had this friendly discussion some time ago.

 

[HarmonicTHD]

Actually, I dont want to add effects but mostly take away affects, also no everybody has an anachoic chamber in their residence. I think we had this friendly discussion some time ago.

Then use the DAW to take away effects same difference.

 

[Sokel]

If you can get one for £600 Keith I would happily buy from you for £700.

They currently go for £1k in the UK give or take. Inc VAT of course.

Dac-2 is the one without USB input,it's true about that price.
Adi-2 (non pro) is about 1K,as always.