Drop + THX Panda Review (headphone)

[solderdude]

It's based on the very well tuned Oppo PM3. I've seen multiple users report that this new model is a regression in sound quality and Amirs measurements confirm it.

Panda vs PM3 on Sonarworks rig.

 

[xarkkon]

Dumb hypothetical question:

Would this review change in any way if the sync was at 1khz instead of 425, and the EQ bringing down the resultant boost at 80 - 700 hz?

It looks to me that that might have been more where Drop was going for (boosted bass) than seeing weak sub-bass and treble.

 

[Francis Vaughan]

Would this review change in any way if the sync was at 1khz instead of 425, and the EQ bringing down the resultant boost at 80 - 700 hz?

The sync point is just for visual niceness. It has no other meaning. In the Frequency Response Deviation from Target graph the location of the emphasised line at 0dB isn't meaningful at all. What matters is how far from flat the measured lines are, not their absolute position. Choosing a different reference point just shifts the reference line, but does not change the deviation from flatness.
How you choose to implement EQ is independent of an arbitrary reference line. But adding one at some location may help you choose the way you go about it.

 

[vkvedam]

Phew! $399 for this

 

[phoenixsong]

The Neumann NDH20 seems to have the same low distortion but with lots of bass- you will probably like it

 

[Zygot]

amirm can you measure input lag in case of gaming for wireless headphones?

 

[amirm]

amirm can you measure input lag in case of gaming for wireless headphones?

In this case it doesn't have a DSP and it is in bypass mode anyway so doesn't have latency. But sure, I can do that in the case of the ones with DSP and hence pipeline delay.

 

[Zygot]

In this case it doesn't have a DSP and it is in bypass mode anyway so doesn't have latency. But sure, I can do that in the case of the ones with DSP and hence pipeline delay.

Great, it will be a valuable measurement.
Lag is usually the only one reason to skip wireless headphones for gaming.

 

[JimBobSound]

*Patiently awaits AirPod pro max review………

 

[PeteL]

In this case it doesn't have a DSP and it is in bypass mode anyway so doesn't have latency. But sure, I can do that in the case of the ones with DSP and hence pipeline delay.

doesn’t all bluetooth headphones have latency, DSP or not?

 

[markanini]

*Patiently awaits AirPod pro max review………

Might be tricky to measure due to dynamic EQ.

 

[MayaTlab]

Might be tricky to measure due to dynamic EQ.

Very easy to make mistakes when measuring the AirPods Pro or the Max (and possibly some of Bose' products as well), even from experienced people.
For example Sean Olive measured a 5dB or so broad shelf difference between ANC on and off with the AirPods Pro :

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1348072065954299905

But that's something that is evidently not happening when listening to music and a little test can help to make hypothesis in regard to why (play pink noise while wearing them with ANC OFF, then play a single tonality, let's say at around 200hz, then, while the tonality continues to play, switch to ANC ON (the tonality should play at a similar volume), then switch back to OFF - now the tonality plays louder - similarly to Sean's measurements. Well at least as of firmware 3C39. All of that suggests that Adaptive EQ is working in some way even when ANC is off and that it requires broadband noise to calibrate itself in that mode, unlike with ANC on where broadband signals aren't required - if you don't play for example pink noise before measuring them with ANC off you won't get accurate measurements).
The AirPods Max is a bit different in terms of such a behaviour but can also throw off some measurements. Crinacle measured wiggles at lower frequencies with his usual method that just don't appear when using white noise : https://crinacle.com/2020/12/19/apple-airpods-max-review-the-audiophiles-perspective/
With Bose products one of the difficulty is that they seem to use loudness compensation curves. So the curve may look different depending on the volume they were measured at. For some reason I'm not even sure that this tells the whole story with the Bose 700, I'm very un-confident in the limited measurements I can make with them.
I don't know much about the Panda but since it doesn't have an inward facing microphone I doubt that it's monitoring its output and adjust it in real time like some ANC headphones appear able to do.

 

[Airquotes]

I actually liked the way these sounded and found them very comfortable on my tiny head. My problem came from how incredibly broken the firmware on them is. My first pair bricked, came back to life, bricked again, stopped working on the computer, stopped connecting, just all kinds of stuff. Finally RMAd them after getting truly fed up and unable to update the firmware on them. 2nd pair (BNIB) turned on once then never turned on again. Requested a refund which thankfully they obliged. I think they underestimated how hard it is to write proper firmware and knew they were pushing out a broken product. If you check the Drop forums it's one story after another of connection problems and dead headphones. They just aren't ready for release yet.

 

[Weebster]

I don't feel so bad. I paid 200usd and at that price, they just went to the woodshop where headphones eventually go to die, but the sound isolation is good enough to use to muffle some power tools.

I really hope I don't have to go Bose just for some good sounding BT cans. I'm old enough to have some bad memories of that brand.

My goto pair is an ATH- M50X with a Fiio BTA10 adapter. Sounds really good but the battery life isn't great. AT has a bt focused version now.
Amir has my Status Audio Flagship bt cans which I am hoping will be my new goto once he is done with them . Keeping my fingers crossed they get that coveted recommendation

 

[Timbo2]

In this case it doesn't have a DSP and it is in bypass mode anyway so doesn't have latency. But sure, I can do that in the case of the ones with DSP and hence pipeline delay.

Useful if one uses them for watching TV so as not to disturb. That said I've found any bluetooth has enough lag to annoy me. You can adjust for it in the settings, but I have adjust them back to my AVR after I'm done with the headphones. Too much of a pain to do regularly.

 

[phoenixsong]

Is there something that can explain why they do not sound good post EQ? Because post EQ they should objectively match the target FR, have low distortion and no weirdness in the group delay plot

 

[Vini darko]

Is there something that can explain why they do not sound good post EQ? Because post EQ they should objectively match the target FR, have low distortion and no weirdness in the group delay plot

Probably a big increase in distortion.

 

[phoenixsong]

Probably a big increase in distortion.

Probably not the reason though, distortion is still low under the 114dB distortion plot, and the EQ would at most boost certain regions by 7.5dB. there should be enough headroom to keep the distortion under control

 

[amirm]

Is there something that can explain why they do not sound good post EQ? Because post EQ they should objectively match the target FR, have low distortion and no weirdness in the group delay plot

My EQ efforts are rather short and done by eye. If I can't get close to the target easily, then I give up. In this case, I managed to substantially improve the performance but at then, just didn't get to a place I wanted.

 

[AdamG]

I actually liked the way these sounded and found them very comfortable on my tiny head. My problem came from how incredibly broken the firmware on them is. My first pair bricked, came back to life, bricked again, stopped working on the computer, stopped connecting, just all kinds of stuff. Finally RMAd them after getting truly fed up and unable to update the firmware on them. 2nd pair (BNIB) turned on once then never turned on again. Requested a refund which thankfully they obliged. I think they underestimated how hard it is to write proper firmware and knew they were pushing out a broken product. If you check the Drop forums it's one story after another of connection problems and dead headphones. They just aren't ready for release yet.

Welcome Aboard @Airquotes.