Does you love of gear exceed your love of music?

[Mart68]

I like music so I like music related equipment.

Not so bothered about scuba diving so no interest in diving gear -no interest in fishing so no interest in fishing tackle.

Isn't that how it works? I appreciate for some the equipment is solely a means to an end and some want as little of it on display as possible; but they still care about the standard of the equipment they use.

Even though I'm more than happy with the level of sound quality I have, I still sometimes buy equipment for the hell of it. Sometimes because I like the look of it. Especially kit from the '80s and '90s that I wanted but could not afford then.

For example ten years ago or thereabouts I bought a Technics SL6 fully auto linear tracking turntable just because I'd wanted one in about 1985. Used it once, then it sat on a shelf for a few years until a mate wanted a no fuss turntable his wife could use.

That side of it, I accept, is only tangentially related to loving music, but it does not detract from loving music.

 

[mhardy6647]

@mhardy6647, was 'GAS' the same company as the GASWORKS?
View attachment 344426
Micheal Bettinger had mod'd my Mc275
I am in a lazy mood to do the research.

I believe that the latter exists to support the vintage products of the former. No idea if he/they were directly connected to GAS. They needed a lotta support, unfortunately.
The Ampzilla in the photos has... issues that have defied several regional experts' efforts to correct them.
The GAS stuff was very nice but tended to fail in more or less spectacular ways, at relatively young age.
Bongiorno's story was a pretty interesting one. He started with Dynaco (did some of the design work on the big 400 stereo power amp), moved to SAE, then went on his own with GAS, followed by SUMO (the GAS "Charlie" tuner quickly became SUMO's "Charlie") and then finally Spread Spectrum Technologies (SST), with one last Ampzilla iteration.

image above from https://tmraudio.com/components/pow...illa-2000-second-edition-mono-amplifier-pair/

[In Memoriam] James Bongiorno RIP - [English]

An article to celebrate an eclectic man and HiFi design, a genius and a true legend, James Bongiorno. An article written by L. Cadeddu on TNT-Audio - www.tnt-audio.com

www.tnt-audio.com

(oh. guess he worked on the marantz 15 power amp, too -- didn't know that)

 

[Anthony101]

I think I detect an unhealthy degree of self deception in this thread.
My intitial thought is the gear is so unimportant what are these people doing on this site. The site is about the gear. Shouldn't music lovers be on sites about, well, music?
What exactly is wrong about being interested in the equipment. It doesn't mean the music is irrelevant.
Most of my best musical experiences have been on equipment that would recieve a headless panther if reviewed here on ASR.
When I want to listen to music I go to a concert. Mostly home listening is about me being impressed with the sytems capability to allow me to hear things in a mix I haven't noticed before.
Two channel stereo rarely sounds like music to me. Having seen what happens in a studio to the sacred signal there is no way I can convince myself I'm listening to anything except some very clever engineering which sometimes helps with the enjoyment of the music thats playing.
Look at all those alter like sytem pictures; you can't tell me they're about the music. All those graphs, they're about engineering, not music. I'm interested in audio reproduction and have been since my late teens and that means the equipment. Good music sounds good on whatever one plays it on in my experience.
I have over three thousand albums in flac on my hard drives. I listen to music on my equipment most days. I love the sound I get from my equipement, but it is the sound rather than the music more often than not.
I can't even listen to classical music on my system; it bears so little resemblance to the sound one gets at a concert.

My journey into the world of ASR stems from a desire for well-informed guidance, especially from knowledgeable individuals like you and others on this platform when selecting audio equipment.

Here's a case: I invested £1,500 in an amplifier and a pair of speakers heavily recommended by a prominent YouTuber. However, a dive into Amir's review painted a starkly different picture. In contrast, a DAC Headphone Amp, which received high praise from ASR, was a delightful experience.

While I appreciate audio equipment, it's not just about the components; it's about how they enhance my music-listening experience. That's why I value expert opinions and reliable reviews - they ensure the quality of my audio gear matches my love for music.

 

[DVDdoug]

Does you love of gear exceed your love of music?

No. And I've never been the type to upgrade unless it was a clearly audible upgrade. Or maybe convenience... I have an iPod classic with about 18,000 songs and an iPod dock in both of my vehicles. When something dies (the iPod, the car stereos, or the cars) I'll convert to a Bluetooth setup.

...As soon as Elon Musk plants a chip in my head I'll be able to directly inject the music with no audio equipment!

 

[Shadrach]

Out of curiosity, if you love the sound of music on your system, why can't you love the sound of classical music on your system, even if it doesn't happen to sound just like the real thing?

Personally I would be bummed to feel I couldn't listen to orchestral music on my system, which is one of my favourite types of music. Since total reaslism is unlikely it's always a case of to what degree the listener can meet the illusion 1/2 way. A couple nights ago I was listening to this recording of Rachmaninov's music, which featured duelling pianos:

Ashkenazy, Previn, Rachmaninov - Symphonic Dances, Op. 45 · Russian Rhapsody

View credits, reviews, tracks and shop for the 1979 Vinyl release of "Symphonic Dances, Op. 45 · Russian Rhapsody" on Discogs.

www.discogs.com

Leaning back on my listening sofa with eyes closed, I had the impression of listening through a deep hall space to pianos on the stage. It had enough features of the real thing that it was fairly easy to slip in to the illusion. Likewise, on good orchestral recordings, I often get the impression of Tympani way out to the corners of a big hall, or the brass section deep in a hall "lighting up" the acoustics when they play loudly, in a way very reminiscent of when I'm at the symphony.

Stereo sound reproduction is an auditory illusion. Some recordings are better at fooling us than others. Some equipment is better at passing this illusion off than others.
Perhaps I have less imagination than others.
Many of the electrified concerts I've attended have two speaker stacks either side of the performers which transfers quite well to a two channel reproduction system.
Go to a classical concert in say the Albert Hall and the sound sources may be spread over quite a few metres, far enough apart so that when the first violins play for example, ones head/or eyes adjust to view the source of the sound. The sound sources are constantly shifting depending on what instrument section is playing. Then there are the reflections that a large venue produces.
In smaller venues say with brass section playing there is a clarity and presence that I have yet to hear any stereo system reproduce.
A saxophone for example played in my listening space can be very hard on the hearing, not so much because of the loudness; there is something else in that direct sound that is unmistakable. One would have to be deaf not to recognise it as a live unamplified instrument.
None of the above means that people shouldn't enjoy classical music on their stereo system provided they can suspend reality, but sounding like live, not to my ears.

 

[Jazzman53]

OK I'm guilty but I'm working on it...

For most of my adult life I was obsessed with designing and building loudspeakers, with the final fifteen years of that obsession being devoted to cutting edge ESLs and dipolar subwoofers. I expended ridiculous labor and money and sold quite expensive creations for peanuts, all to continue the quest.

My obsession drove me to search out the highest quality and most dynamic recordings to test and wring out my creations, and although I love the music too, I used it as a vehicle to indulge my fascination with reproducing it.

Two years ago I concluded that I had reached the pinnacle, and I quit, cold turkey. I haven't built any speakers since, I'm not missing it at all, and now I'm learning to just enjoy the music, even if it isn't the highest quality recording.

 

[MaxBuck]

Serious question. I have had nice systems for years, but really got into the hobby and more expensive gear the past 2 years. It's been fun but the constant 'need' to upgrade or pick the right purchase is to the point of fatigue. I make a good living but I am kind of tired of chasing the next improvement. Seriously, wondering if I now just love the gear more than just enjoying the music it plays. It gets oddly anxiety inducing.

I have a new pair of Linton's that I do want to get a new preamp/amp for. After that I think I need to step away from the boards and/or youtube influencers for while. Anyone else feel the same, now or previously? If so, how do you just be satisfied?

I've always looked at the system as only the means to the end - enjoyment of music in my home. But I don't look askance at fascination with the equipment; it's just a different hobby from mine.

 

[anotherhobby]

I like music so I like music related equipment.

Not so bothered about scuba diving so no interest in diving gear -no interest in fishing so no interest in fishing tackle.

Isn't that how it works?

That's how it works for me. All of my hobbies live at the intersection of an experience that I enjoy and a system/process that enables that experience. The hook for me usually has to be that the system/process can be modified/configured to improve/change the quality of the experience (multi-variable joy!). That feedback loop is oddly critical to the long term enjoyment of something as a "hobby" for me vs a casual past time.

I don't need to place specific value on which is more important (the experience or the system that enables it), but suffice it to say that if I didn't love the experience I certainly wouldn't bother with the system. I also like building physical things and have nice tools. Doesn't mean I love the tools more than then things I can make with them.

 

[egellings]

My amplification is home-brewed, so I do enjoy the equipment. However, the purpose of the equipment was to hear music through it. Without the music, the equipment would be useless, and I wouldn't consider building it.

 

[blackmetalboon]

My love of music is what drew me into the equipment. Lack of education and reading nonsense in audio magazines kept me in.

Reading forums and the disagreements between audiophiles sowed the seeds of doubt. When I had the time and opportunity to really compare some of the controversial issues and finding little to no difference I decided to take step back from the equipment.

I will pay over the odds for dealer and local manufacture support, features, build quality, reliability and looks, but these days I’m not chasing improvements in sound quality.

At the moment I spend more time listening to music through an iPod and it’s supplied ear buds than my main system. Don’t get me wrong, I often hear a song and think that would sound unbelievable through my main system, but that is just the “icing on the cake” because you should enjoy a good song no matter what heard it on.

 

[Ricardus]

No.

 

[pablolie]

Stereo sound reproduction is an auditory illusion.

I would not call it as much an "illusion" as the process of psychoacoustic processing that is inherent to a species with 2 ears (a configuration that seems to work for many species, so it's partially "evolution approved"). To me, an "illusion" is something that isn't real, and as such unable to convey real wor;d data, which would be a huge evolutionary disadvantage.

Some recordings are better at fooling us than others. Some equipment is better at passing this illusion off than others.

Which can be captured with measurements that model our hearing sense.

Many of the electrified concerts I've attended have two speaker stacks either side of the performers which transfers quite well to a two channel reproduction system.
Go to a classical concert in say the Albert Hall and the sound sources may be spread over quite a few metres, far enough apart so that when the first violins play for example, ones head/or eyes adjust to view the source of the sound. The sound sources are constantly shifting depending on what instrument section is playing. Then there are the reflections that a large venue produces.
In smaller venues say with brass section playing there is a clarity and presence that I have yet to hear any stereo system reproduce.

I would hardly ever consider most concert venues as an auditory ideal. In fact, I think most are downright horrible.

The good ones actually either have a lot of room engineering to project the sound in a good way, or have super carefully set up amplification systems that are good -yet never ever perfect- at projecting the actual stage around.

Smaller venues are very often completely overwhelmed when brass instruments and drums are played loudly, and the players using amplification on other instruments (classic guitars and such) are forced to drive their amp up etc. Not saying that is always the case - they can be magical for more intimate acoustic performances.

...
None of the above means that people shouldn't enjoy classical music on their stereo system provided they can suspend reality, but sounding like live, not to my ears.

To me - it often sounds better. It is more clean and controlled, and I always sit in the best seat. And there are no annoying half-drunks screaming or dancing or jumping. :-D

 

[DavidEdwinAston]

I would not call it as much an "illusion" as the process of psychoacoustic processing that is inherent to a species with 2 ears (a configuration that seems to work for many species, so it's partially "evolution approved"). To me, an "illusion" is something that isn't real, and as such unable to convey real wor;d data, which would be a huge evolutionary disadvantage.


Which can be captured with measurements that model our hearing sense.

I would hardly ever consider most concert venues as an auditory ideal. In fact, I think most are downright horrible.

The good ones actually either have a lot of room engineering to project the sound in a good way, or have super carefully set up amplification systems that are good -yet never ever perfect- at projecting the actual stage around.

Smaller venues are very often completely overwhelmed when brass instruments and drums are played loudly, and the players using amplification on other instruments (classic guitars and such) are forced to drive their amp up etc. Not saying that is always the case - they can be magical for more intimate acoustic performances.



To me - it often sounds better. It is more clean and controlled, and I always sit in the best seat. And there are no annoying half-drunks screaming or dancing or jumping. :-D

Half drunks, screaming! In the Albert Hall pabolie, never!

 

[pablolie]

Half drunks, screaming! In the Albert Hall pabolie, never!

There's intermission champagne excess all around!

 

[Robin L]

There's intermission champagne excess all around!

Ask Frank Zappa what happened to the LSO on one of their numerous breaks while recording his orchestral scores.

 

[Snarfie]

View attachment 344466

image above from https://tmraudio.com/components/pow...illa-2000-second-edition-mono-amplifier-pair/

View attachment 344467

[In Memoriam] James Bongiorno RIP - [English]

An article to celebrate an eclectic man and HiFi design, a genius and a true legend, James Bongiorno. An article written by L. Cadeddu on TNT-Audio - www.tnt-audio.com

www.tnt-audio.com

Looks like a Star Trek Amp.

 

[egellings]

My love of music is what drew me into the equipment. Lack of education and reading nonsense in audio magazines kept me in.

Reading forums and the disagreements between audiophiles sowed the seeds of doubt. When I had the time and opportunity to really compare some of the controversial issues and finding little to no difference I decided to take step back from the equipment.

I will pay over the odds for dealer and local manufacture support, features, build quality, reliability and looks, but these days I’m not chasing improvements in sound quality.

At the moment I spend more time listening to music through an iPod and it’s supplied ear buds than my main system. Don’t get me wrong, I often hear a song and think that would sound unbelievable through my main system, but that is just the “icing on the cake” because you should enjoy a good song no matter what heard it on.

You can enjoy it better, however, on a nicer system, up to a point.

 

[mhardy6647]

Looks like a Star Trek Amp.

View attachment 345230

Aye. Tha' she does, Cap'n.

 

[Jaxjax]

FM Radio….13 Bit !!

My most memorable moment in home audio was that $400 album Steven Stills did with a Fisher tuber tuner into DIY hybrid OB 4 way active speakers & Klangfilm amps running everything but the bottom end. Then again I think my JBL charge 2 at times pleases me more then my 20k playback.
I would never ever sell my MR74....to many wonderful memories with it.
Joe

 

[Jaxjax]

OK I'm guilty but I'm working on it...

For most of my adult life I was obsessed with designing and building loudspeakers, with the final fifteen years of that obsession being devoted to cutting edge ESLs and dipolar subwoofers. I expended ridiculous labor and money and sold quite expensive creations for peanuts, all to continue the quest.

My obsession drove me to search out the highest quality and most dynamic recordings to test and wring out my creations, and although I love the music too, I used it as a vehicle to indulge my fascination with reproducing it.

Two years ago I concluded that I had reached the pinnacle, and I quit, cold turkey. I haven't built any speakers since, I'm not missing it at all, and now I'm learning to just enjoy the music, even if it isn't the highest quality recording.

I'm pretty sure I've followed your builds....amazing work !!!
Joe