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Does Your System "Wow" or "Amaze" You? Looking to upgrade? Tell Us About It....

Yes! Tell us more. Sounds like a wet dream!
Do you recall our conversation in "The Most Beautiful Speakers in the World"?


I don't think you liked my answer then but I hope you now understand what I was talking about.:)
If that's an eyesore to you...I get it. We all have our taste.

Here's even more eyesore if you dare gaze upon it...;-)

 
You are still getting me wrong misunderstanding me, @MattHooper. You said "free from speaker" << like it disappeared << like me having a wet dream of not having any speaker << free from speaker.
 
You are still getting me wrong misunderstanding me, @MattHooper. You said "free from speaker" << like it disappeared << like me having a wet dream of not having any speaker << free from speaker.

When I wrote “free of the speaker” I meant of course sonically, like the sound isn’t coming from the speakers.

When you say “free of the speaker” I understood from the last conversation that you’d prefer sound “free of any speaker” - that is your ideal of no visible speaker at all.

And that visible speakers to you were eyesores. And hence my obviously visible speakers would be an “eyesore” for you.
Hence my comment.
 
I apologized then and will now; for you taking it personal. Peace out.
 
I apologized then and will now; for you taking it personal. Peace out.

I’m completely baffled as to how you concluded I took anything personal then or now. Why would I? It really is possible to understand that people have different tastes and goals. So I was having fun.

Apparently there is some communication barrier I can not cross.
 
Just signing in to this thread again. Been adjusting my speakers around a bit, including trying different heights on various platforms/footers etc.
At the moment I have the speakers on a "granite sandwich" platform: 1 1/4" thick granite slab, then a layer of car damping material, then another
3/8" slab of quartz, then hockey pucks under the corners on some carpet spikes (to get it all to the height I want). Man that granite contraption feels solid
to the knuckle wrap test (vs the springy wood floor the speakers original sat upon).

At the moment I've hit a really beautiful balance, totally "free of the speaker" sound and the bass is both punchy, dense and so focused and articulate!
With no sense at all of "stuck in the box" bass instruments along with everything else just appear holographically placed with precision. And no matter how dense and frantic the music gets - I love Prog Rock, Fusion, Funk/Dance/Electronica etc - it's just effortless to hear what the bass and kick drum are doing (distinct instead of blurred together). Mids and highs both vivid and smooth, so I can blast the sound loud with zero fatigue factor. Definitely in a happy place, getting a system "how I want it to sound."

View attachment 297128

(When listening to music I cover the fireplace with a velvet drape to kill those fireplace tile reflections near the R speaker).

Paul Barton said some interesting things on this subject, about 50:00-55:00 minutes into this video:


This has been my experience too. Tough to get right though, but once you get there, it may be very audible/tangible. Most people like to think that speaker cabinets do not vibrate/transfer any energy to the floor and adjacent solids, but this isn't always true...
 
Just signing in to this thread again. Been adjusting my speakers around a bit, including trying different heights on various platforms/footers etc.
At the moment I have the speakers on a "granite sandwich" platform: 1 1/4" thick granite slab, then a layer of car damping material, then another
3/8" slab of quartz, then hockey pucks under the corners on some carpet spikes (to get it all to the height I want). Man that granite contraption feels solid
to the knuckle wrap test (vs the springy wood floor the speakers original sat upon).

At the moment I've hit a really beautiful balance, totally "free of the speaker" sound and the bass is both punchy, dense and so focused and articulate!
With no sense at all of "stuck in the box" bass instruments along with everything else just appear holographically placed with precision. And no matter how dense and frantic the music gets - I love Prog Rock, Fusion, Funk/Dance/Electronica etc - it's just effortless to hear what the bass and kick drum are doing (distinct instead of blurred together). Mids and highs both vivid and smooth, so I can blast the sound loud with zero fatigue factor. Definitely in a happy place, getting a system "how I want it to sound."

View attachment 297128

(When listening to music I cover the fireplace with a velvet drape to kill those fireplace tile reflections near the R speaker).

The speakers are looking great, new shoes always look sharp.

Also, not a new thing but I like the way you’ve shamelessly pulled them into the room.
 
Paul Barton said some interesting things on this subject, about 50:00-55:00 minutes into this video:


This has been my experience too. Tough to get right though, but once you get there, it may be very audible/tangible. Most people like to think that speaker cabinets do not vibrate/transfer any energy to the floor and adjacent solids, but this isn't always true...

Thanks, I listened to that section. Paul's description of feeling the bass, the kick drum etc, with speakers coupled to the floor "resonates" with my experience :)
That's why I abandoned spring-based footers after trying them. They so fully decoupled the sound from the floor I no longer felt those waves of bass through my floor/sofa
during orchestral climaxes, or anything with deep bass, and also there was just a general lack of "room feel" and less solidity. Even though the bass did tighten, the speakers took on more of an electrostatic presentation.

That's why I undertook a fun little project of experimenting - I wanted to find the right amount of coupling so I didn't lose the palpability of bass etc, with just the right amount
of absorption/decoupling, to also tighten up the bass and have the speakers disappear even more. My current combination seems to have hit that mark as well as I
have heard: tight bass, but still dense and palpable and punchy, and a total disappearing act for the speakers bottom to top.


The speakers are looking great, new shoes always look sharp.

Also, not a new thing but I like the way you’ve shamelessly pulled them into the room.

Heh. That's a case where necessity happily coincided with preference!

I'd always shamelessly pulled the speakers forward of the rear wall in that listening room, for the smoothest sound. But for most of the history of the room, the speaker/listening sofa position were 180 degrees from what they are in the photo. All my speakers through the years used to be where the sofa is, bay windows behind them, pulled somewhat in to the room, equipment/amps between them. In that photo, my projection screen is on the wall behind the speakers, which is where my listening sofa used to reside.

Once I decided to add a projection screen, the only available wall was where my listening sofa sat. Before the reno, I initially did some testing, switching my seating to the bay window side of the room (as it is now), with the speakers on the other side (as they are now). And to my dismay the acoustics went to crap! The speakers just did not sound good any more (some weird suck-outs etc). That was a depressing sign, so I made sure to hire an acoustician when I renovated the room. The end result was a much better sounding room than I'd ever had, and any speakers seem to sound fantastic.

As to the current speaker position you see in the photo: necessity entails that I pull them out that far because my home theater speakers are already taking up the space on either side of the projection screen. So even if I wanted to, I could not put those Joseph Audio speakers against the back wall. And since they have to be pulled out, I have to pull them out enough so that there is ample space to move in and out of the room (or they'd block the entrance to the room). But that works perfectly because they are exactly where I would want to place them, relative to my listening position, even if I didn't face that ergonomic problem. I've always liked a closer listening position for more envelopment. Plus, I do have some leeway in moving the speakers back a bit, but I have a bunch more leeway with my sofa too: My sofa is on big furniture sliders making it very easy to move back and forth a couple of feet. So whenever I want a further listening distance (tends to focus the sound more, and get more "live" sounding), I just slide my sofa back a bit.

In an ideal world I'd love to try some bigger horn speakers for fun, or some of the old school bigger box designs, but aesthetically and ergonomically they won't work for my room. Even the modest sized Harbeth SuperHL5+ speakers seemed a poor fit. Slender, smaller speakers like the Joseph Perspectives are great because they take up very little visual width, so it doesn't intrude on the projection screen behind them, plus they sound far bigger and more ballsy than they look.
 
Hello friends,

As a follow-up of my posts #68, #91, #100, #145 on this thread...

Only if you would be interested, please find here #774 on my project thread "The latest system setup of my DSP-based multichannel multi-SP-driver multi-amplifier fully active audio rig as of August 3, 2023".

Also, you can find here #776 on my project thread: "The latest startup/ignition sequences and shutdown sequences in my DSP-based multichannel multi-SP-driver multi-amplifier fully active audio rig as of August 3, 2023".
 
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Amazed would be hyperbolic but I've had 3 incidents of satisfaction with changes in recent years.
  1. I completed Zaph Audio 'ZRT' DIY speakers and sold my Magneplanar MG 1.6QR's. I wasn't expect too much, I really just wanted smaller speakers but the ZRT's were a step up in terms of resolution.
  2. I got a VTV Hypex NC252MP-based amp and replace a Pass Labs X150.5. The old amp was nice sounding but the Hypex had more detail, transparency, and more articulate bass. Subsequently I further upgraded to a VTV Stereo Purifi amp; this was similar in character to the Hypex and only a subtle improvement.
  3. I acquired an old Sonic Frontiers Line 1 tube preamp. I provided a slightly warmer and fuller sound versus the Freya + in passive mode, (I never cared for the tube mode). I splurged and had the SF Line 1 restored/upgrade to "SE+" level by Parts ConneXion for a very subtle improvement at best.
 
Going through this thread somewhat again, makes me wish for a transporter to be able to hear all these different systems. I'm sure I'd hear systems that are doing some things "better" than my own.

My unexplored frontier are horn speakers. I've been intrigued by my occasional encounters, mostly at shows, occasionally at audio shops, and I see some of our members use them (and even build them!). Horn based designs just don't fit in to the demands of my room though, so it'll never happen (which is ultimately a good thing, I don't need to spend any more money on audio at this point). I loved what I heard from the Klipsch La Scalas at my friend's place, despite their shortcomings.

As I've said, while I do look at measurements when available, I really love the exchange of subjective experience, asking "what does this sound like to you?"

An audio pal came over not long ago to listen go my system. He listened to some of my stuff, then his own music. When I asked him to describe what he thought of the sound, to paraphrase, he said the first thing was the huge spread of sound, with particularly dense, satisfying "they are solidly there" imaging quality. The next thing that stuck out he said was how utterly relaxing it was to listen to, the upper frequencies he described as just "buttery smooth and non-fatiguing" but importantly, not at all rolled off or dark sounding, but very airy, vivid and sparkling. He said he doesn't usually hear that combination of vivid yet relaxed and smooth, and that he could just turn this type of system up and up without fatigue. Finally, he noted a bit of emphasis/warmth in the bass vs what he's used to at home, a bit bigger and rounder and more filled out, but not at the expense of sounding bloated...the bass was still very tight sounding.

I found this so interesting because he described precisely how my system sounds to me, precisely the attributes I have tried to hone in the sound of my system, and exactly why I'm so happy with it. Again, while measurements could also tell a tale, a big part of what I get out of this hobby is just sharing the experience of listening with other people, and exchanging notes on what we seem to hear.
 
Pair LS50's (original), Generic 24" stands filled with 12.5 lbs of lead shot each.
Pair Rythmik L12 subs
MiniDSP 2x4HD
Crown XLS 1502 amplifier
DIY speaker wires from Home Depot, various unbalanced interconnects.
Umik-1, REW
cast off Notebook for streaming and video playback
Foobar2000, VLC
65" Samsung QLED TV (LED with local dimming)
Craft beer.

In 14' x18 room with a dormer ceiling the sound is wonderful. My only gripe is it took me a long time to understand how to set up the subs. Despite the low SINAD of the electronics, there is no hiss. I'm not looking to buy any gear right now. Maybe I could use a new listening couch.

I suspect 90% of the members here with complaints would be happy with some setup tweaks and EQ
 
Going through this thread somewhat again, makes me wish for a transporter to be able to hear all these different systems. I'm sure I'd hear systems that are doing some things "better" than my own.

My unexplored frontier are horn speakers. I've been intrigued by my occasional encounters, mostly at shows, occasionally at audio shops, and I see some of our members use them (and even build them!). Horn based designs just don't fit in to the demands of my room though, so it'll never happen (which is ultimately a good thing, I don't need to spend any more money on audio at this point). I loved what I heard from the Klipsch La Scalas at my friend's place, despite their shortcomings.

As I've said, while I do look at measurements when available, I really love the exchange of subjective experience, asking "what does this sound like to you?"

An audio pal came over not long ago to listen go my system. He listened to some of my stuff, then his own music. When I asked him to describe what he thought of the sound, to paraphrase, he said the first thing was the huge spread of sound, with particularly dense, satisfying "they are solidly there" imaging quality. The next thing that stuck out he said was how utterly relaxing it was to listen to, the upper frequencies he described as just "buttery smooth and non-fatiguing" but importantly, not at all rolled off or dark sounding, but very airy, vivid and sparkling. He said he doesn't usually hear that combination of vivid yet relaxed and smooth, and that he could just turn this type of system up and up without fatigue. Finally, he noted a bit of emphasis/warmth in the bass vs what he's used to at home, a bit bigger and rounder and more filled out, but not at the expense of sounding bloated...the bass was still very tight sounding.

I found this so interesting because he described precisely how my system sounds to me, precisely the attributes I have tried to hone in the sound of my system, and exactly why I'm so happy with it. Again, while measurements could also tell a tale, a big part of what I get out of this hobby is just sharing the experience of listening with other people, and exchanging notes on what we seem to hear.

I deeply impressed and appreciate your wonderful comment to which I fully agree.

I too occasionally invite my dear friends, almost all of them are professional or semi-professional musicians in classical music, early-classical music or jazz for our relaxing and enjoyable audio listening sessions. I sometimes allow them flexibly controlling relative gains (tone control) of my multichannel SP drivers e.g. ref. here and here.

After these heart-ease listening sessions with my friends, I too always realized as you kindly pointed: "Again, while measurements could also tell a tale, a big part of what I get out of this hobby is just sharing the experience of listening with other people, and exchanging notes on what we seem to hear".

Thank you again!
 
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Going through this thread somewhat again, makes me wish for a transporter to be able to hear all these different systems. I'm sure I'd hear systems that are doing some things "better" than my own.

My unexplored frontier are horn speakers. I've been intrigued by my occasional encounters, mostly at shows, occasionally at audio shops, and I see some of our members use them (and even build them!). Horn based designs just don't fit in to the demands of my room though, so it'll never happen (which is ultimately a good thing, I don't need to spend any more money on audio at this point). I loved what I heard from the Klipsch La Scalas at my friend's place, despite their shortcomings.

As I've said, while I do look at measurements when available, I really love the exchange of subjective experience, asking "what does this sound like to you?"

An audio pal came over not long ago to listen go my system. He listened to some of my stuff, then his own music. When I asked him to describe what he thought of the sound, to paraphrase, he said the first thing was the huge spread of sound, with particularly dense, satisfying "they are solidly there" imaging quality. The next thing that stuck out he said was how utterly relaxing it was to listen to, the upper frequencies he described as just "buttery smooth and non-fatiguing" but importantly, not at all rolled off or dark sounding, but very airy, vivid and sparkling. He said he doesn't usually hear that combination of vivid yet relaxed and smooth, and that he could just turn this type of system up and up without fatigue. Finally, he noted a bit of emphasis/warmth in the bass vs what he's used to at home, a bit bigger and rounder and more filled out, but not at the expense of sounding bloated...the bass was still very tight sounding.

I found this so interesting because he described precisely how my system sounds to me, precisely the attributes I have tried to hone in the sound of my system, and exactly why I'm so happy with it. Again, while measurements could also tell a tale, a big part of what I get out of this hobby is just sharing the experience of listening with other people, and exchanging notes on what we seem to hear.
There are those moments when the system isn't doing anything unusual but it hits you in a magic way.
 
There are those moments when the system isn't doing anything unusual but it hits you in a magic way.
Lately I have been thinking about the relevance of "magic" in our enjoyment of audio reproduction.

I think most of us will agree that our hearing is far from perfect. As an analogy, think of the Hubble telescope. The device was built with serious flaws. A sophisticated computer program was created to correct those flaws. Our hearing is a bit like that with our brains constantly correcting for flaws and perceived anomalies.

This ear/brain system allows us to create the illusion of a 70 piece orchestra in our living room, create the auditory "image" of a singer standing before us in our listening room and it can also convince us we hear spectacular improvements in a playback system where non exists.

While most of us are after musical "truth", or accuracy, or transparency, I personally think taking all of this too seriously and analytically takes too much of the "magic" out of the listening experience. I think focusing entirely on the science can be a disservice, while leaving some room for a little "magic" can make the experience more musically rewarding.
 
While most of us are after musical "truth", or accuracy, or transparency, I personally think taking all of this too seriously and analytically takes too much of the "magic" out of the listening experience. I think focusing entirely on the science can be a disservice, while leaving some room for a little "magic" can make the experience more musically rewarding.
I'll agree with that, in that I built my speakers the way they are just because I thought it was cool, not from strictly optimum scientific principles.
 
Lately I have been thinking about the relevance of "magic" in our enjoyment of audio reproduction.

I think most of us will agree that our hearing is far from perfect. As an analogy, think of the Hubble telescope. The device was built with serious flaws. A sophisticated computer program was created to correct those flaws. Our hearing is a bit like that with our brains constantly correcting for flaws and perceived anomalies.

This ear/brain system allows us to create the illusion of a 70 piece orchestra in our living room, create the auditory "image" of a singer standing before us in our listening room and it can also convince us we hear spectacular improvements in a playback system where non exists.

While most of us are after musical "truth", or accuracy, or transparency, I personally think taking all of this too seriously and analytically takes too much of the "magic" out of the listening experience. I think focusing entirely on the science can be a disservice, while leaving some room for a little "magic" can make the experience more musically rewarding.

I find a lot to agree with there.

I would say, though, that the issue you are getting at - the enjoyment of a bit of "magic" or not focusing on...or even knowing...the exact technical details - is going to vary for individuals. It's like magic tricks, or cool movie special effects or movie scenes. For some, understanding how it is done, seeing the trick revealed, somewhat deflates the experience. The "magic" and joy was in being fooled. Once you aren't fooled, that magic can for some be ruined. For others, learning the details of how it was done only enhances their pleasure. And many will find themselves in some range between these two poles. And many people will themselves waver over time...maybe be more interested in the details at one point for one item, then just kickin' back and not thinking about it for another.

Likewise I think for audio gear. This place tends to self select for a certain type of audiophile - technically oriented, engineer minded (not all, but a general trend). The type who in their youth wanted to unscrew the top of their amps to see what was inside and learn how it works, or DIY'd their own speakers etc. All of that is great. But not everyone has that interest or aptitude (I don't). I have a certain level of interest of knowing about my gear, but electronics has always bored me. Just does. So I'm never going to pick up a soldering gun and get in there learning the ins and outs of, say amplifiers. Or build my own tube amps. And there is some appeal in just looking at those glowing tubes and feeling like it's a bit of "magic" happening there, the signal glowing in those warm tubes....

This is somewhat related to why I personally can't get everything I like about this hobby, in terms of forum conversations, in a purely technically oriented forum like this one. This site is set up as an antidote to all the purely subjective oriented discussions and speculations in the audiophile world. Here is where you are supposed to understand the objective features of gear, and bring objective (or scientifically controlled) evidence for any discussion of gear. It's exactly what you want in order to get to some reliable information. But it also imposes a pretty strict limitation on the type of discussions and approach that will fly here. It's sort of like if there was a forum devoted to a scientific/engineering understanding of "Cooking," where if you are to speak of your recipes you'll be asked for the explicit chemical break down of all the food, and show science supporting that each change in your recipe is actually detectable by people eating your food. Great if you really, really want to understand what's going on. Kind of exhausting to have those demands whenever you just want to talk about cooking, as one does among family and friends. So a more informal cooking forum, where you exchange recipes without such strict scientific demands, can be a relief and "more fun."

Similarly, for me it's nice to sometimes just hang out in some places where audiophiles just discuss what they seem to hear in their gear, exchange those casual, informal notes, and shoot the shit that way. People who are not naturally suspicious of subjective language, who like to describe what they hear, and who will be enthusiastic about reading and sharing such impressions.

The obvious liability there is how b.s. can also flourish in such discussions. But shooting the shit with other audiophiles doesn't commit me to believing anything anyone says, so I do my own winnowing of what seems worthwhile, and enjoy the ride.
 
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No clue where to post, but this thread seems close enough and active, so I'll give it a go: I'm disappointed with my new speakers.

PC setup:
Focusrite Scarlett Solo (3rd gen) DAC
2x Marantz MA500 monoblocks
Klipsch R-28Fs speakers

Living room setup:
Denon AVR-X3600H receiver
KEF Q100s/JBL LSR305s speakers
SVS PB-2000 subwoofer

Recently, I purchased a pair of KRK RP8-G4s for my living room setup to replace my JBLs/KEFs. I've only had them a few weeks, but I'm not very satisfied with them. They have plenty of bass, but vocals feel lacking, like they're far back (sub has been off since I've gotten the KRKs). I've tried running Audyssey, using the KRK app, playing with the settings on the back, switching between sources like Spotify and vinyl, etc. Yet the speakers still sound worse than either my Klipschs or even the JBLs. I've had the Klipschs for ~5 years, and the JBLs for ~8 years, so I'm aware that maybe I'm just used to them. I'm also aware (and hoping) it's just a break-in issue, and over time the KRKs will loosen up and sound better, but I'm not sure if I want to wait for them to sound good, especially since I only have another week or so to return them if I decide not to keep them.

I also wonder if using the KRKs in a living room setting (rather than near field) is part of the problem, but again, my LSR305s sound great.
 
No clue where to post, but this thread seems close enough and active, so I'll give it a go: I'm disappointed with my new speakers.

PC setup:
Focusrite Scarlett Solo (3rd gen) DAC
2x Marantz MA500 monoblocks
Klipsch R-28Fs speakers

Living room setup:
Denon AVR-X3600H receiver
KEF Q100s/JBL LSR305s speakers
SVS PB-2000 subwoofer

Recently, I purchased a pair of KRK RP8-G4s for my living room setup to replace my JBLs/KEFs. I've only had them a few weeks, but I'm not very satisfied with them. They have plenty of bass, but vocals feel lacking, like they're far back (sub has been off since I've gotten the KRKs). I've tried running Audyssey, using the KRK app, playing with the settings on the back, switching between sources like Spotify and vinyl, etc. Yet the speakers still sound worse than either my Klipschs or even the JBLs. I've had the Klipschs for ~5 years, and the JBLs for ~8 years, so I'm aware that maybe I'm just used to them. I'm also aware (and hoping) it's just a break-in issue, and over time the KRKs will loosen up and sound better, but I'm not sure if I want to wait for them to sound good, especially since I only have another week or so to return them if I decide not to keep them.

I also wonder if using the KRKs in a living room setting (rather than near field) is part of the problem, but again, my LSR305s sound great.

PM sent. Check the small envelope symbol next to your username.

Jim
 
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