Digital vs. Vinyl (again)

[Ken Newton]

There's an article in the May edition of Gramophone magazine regarding the resurgence of vinyl and decline of CD. The article touches on several differeing causes for this turn of events, among which are the notion that digital sound simply is subjectively unsatisfying. Of course, this is an old and familiar debate among us audiophiles. While audiophiles may have the equipment to hear any such subjective differences (if they exist), I very much doubt the majority of the public driving the increase in vinyl sales has equipment of the necessary transparency and fidelity. One intriguing possible objective explanation for the subjective preference for vinyl that has recently been put forth is that the low frequency groove noise of vinyl is intrepted by the ear as natural ambient sound. Sort of an unintentional surround sound effect. Digital, lacking groove noise, may often seem less natural or real sounding by comparison. See link below for an discussion about this effect, and the associated notion that adding artifical low frequency noise to digital playback may make it sound as satisfying as vinyl to those of the feeling it doesn't currently.

http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/anal...hesis-why-some-prefer-vinyl-douglas-self.html

The Gramophone article also identifies 'hipsters' as a significant force driving this market dynamic. This I have long suspected. I usually shake my head when I see the portable all-in-one turntables (picture, the close-and-play units of your childhood marketed toward adults) often sold alongside vinyl L.P.s in retail locations. This definitly wipes out the notion of superior playback being a large driving factor, to my mind. At least, with regards to hipsters, I suspect the new vinyl revolution is a transitory social phenomena primarily intended to demonstrate the hipster's, uh, discerning artistic and cultural sensibilities. In short, vinyl is currently cool. I think the rest of us, however, simply want to enjoy listening to satisfying music reproduction in the convenience of our homes.

 

[TBone]

I suspect the new vinyl revolution is a transitory social phenomena primarily intended to demonstrate the hipster's, uh, discerning artistic and cultural sensibilities. In short, vinyl is currently cool. I think the rest of us, however, simply want to enjoy listening to satisfying music reproduction in the convenience of our homes.

The rest of "us"?

(sigh)

Seriously, another 99 pages of vinyl "discussion" to curse thru ... now I'm shaking my head.

 

[NorthSky]

Ken, do you have a link to that Gramophone article? Or can you provide a photocopy, if permissible of course?
Without the full article we can swim in all different type of waters.

* But if I may, not on scientific level but just an opinion; I'm happy to see vinyl coming back the way it does...in all flavors from the affordable to the ultra good lookin' and expensive. It's good business for analog lovers, myself included. I like having choices in life and see people making a living from those various choices.
...Good for the economy and good for the love of music.

An older article: http://www.gramophone.co.uk/blog/editors-blog/what-the-vinyl-revival-reveals

Bonus: http://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2015/apr/14/vinyl-revival-music-here-to-stay

 

[TBone]

North, vinyl never really went away here, at all ages .... another TBone saga:

During a time when CD ruled and vinyl was "dying", friends knowing I was still into turntables would drop of all types of turntables to my house. My garage was full of 'em, most beyond my care to try. Anyway, years later, I started culling, putting 'em on my front lawn for others to pick, or the garbage man to gather, whichever came first. Most were taken pre garbage. This one time, I was sitting on my front porch, an old Technics on my front yard for grabs ... this young teen quickly noticed, took it and thanked me.

Well, a day later, I awoke to see that same turntable placed on my porch with a message "broken, turns the wrong way". Having so many parts at hand, fixed it, waited for him to come by again, and gave it to him. He was delighted, and soon his teen pals were in my garage picking and choosing.

That was over a decade ago, he still owns/plays his Technics today.

 

[RayDunzl]

The Gramophone article also identifies 'hipsters' as a significant force driving this market dynamic.

 

[RayDunzl]

The single instance of (assumedly) high-end vinyl I've heard - at a dealer, left me with no particular impression.

It was in the expensive room, Wilson speakers and I don't remember what else. Nothing particularly good or bad about it.

Now, if we go back to the late 60's, I'll never reproduce that subjective sound (if you are allowed to include the related trendy chemical assisted experience).

On the other hand, what I have going on in my room right now fully exceeds any expectations I've had for fine quality reproduction.

Now playing solo acoustic guitar - Kazumi Watanabe Guitar Renaissance V

 

[NorthSky]

North, vinyl never really went away here, at all ages .... another TBone saga:

During a time when CD ruled and vinyl was "dying", friends knowing I was still into turntables would drop of all types of turntables to my house. My garage was full of 'em, most beyond my care to try. Anyway, years later, I started culling, putting 'em on my front lawn for others to pick, or the garbage man to gather, whichever came first. Most were taken pre garbage. This one time, I was sitting on my front porch, an old Technics on my front yard for grabs ... this young teen quickly noticed, took it and thanked me.

Well, a day later, I awoke to see that same turntable placed on my porch with a message "broken, turns the wrong way". Having so many parts at hand, fixed it, waited for him to come by again, and gave it to him. He was delighted, and soon his teen pals were in my garage picking and choosing.

That was over a decade ago, he still owns/plays his Technics today.

Tony, CD also never went away...just now it is starting to fade away, but it'll be back, stronger than ever...a lot of great music recordings out there on CDs, they'll last forever, never to die completely. This ain't no rocket science...it's audio evolution...audio nostalgia...and audio post revolution.

* Ray, that guy @ the coffee shop; he looks like a nerd. ...The girl across his table; she wants nothing to do with him, she'd rather drink her beer quick and probably leave the place.

 

[TBone]

Tony, CD also never went away...just now it is starting to fade away, but it'll be back, stronger than ever...a lot of great music recordings out there on CDs, they'll last forever, never to die completely. This ain't no rocket science...it's audio evolution...audio nostalgia...and audio post revolution.

Sadly, I've seen too many of the more dynamically mastered CDs, the early first pressings, not stand the test of time and become unplayable. To be perfectly honest, I kinda like the premise that people think CD is now obsolete ... here, second hand stores sell 'em for next to nothing ... so while the cost of vinyl rises accordingly, I've been supplementing my CD collection on the very cheap.

 

[TBone]

Nothing particularly good or bad about it.

Attaining top end vinyl reproduction (and subsequent ripping practices) are not plug & play! Took me a v.long time to learn specifics and achieve results per my expectations. Lots of dependencies. If all goes to plan, this late fall I'll be ripping certain LPs (and a few difficult to find CDs) to cdr, mailed to other vinyl wielding friends for fun/comparison; if your interested ...

 

[Ken Newton]

The rest of "us"?

(sigh)

Seriously, another 99 pages of vinyl "discussion" to curse thru ... now I'm shaking my head.

Yes, those of us who aren't hipsters. Perhaps, that doesn't apply to you.

 

[Ken Newton]

Ken, do you have a link to that Gramophone article? Or can you provide a photocopy, if permissible of course?
Without the full article we can swim in all different type of waters.

* But if I may, not on scientific level but just an opinion; I'm happy to see vinyl coming back the way it does...in all flavors from the affordable to the ultra good lookin' and expensive. It's good business for analog lovers, myself included. I like having choices in life and see people making a living from those various choices.
...Good for the economy and good for the love of music.

An older article: http://www.gramophone.co.uk/blog/editors-blog/what-the-vinyl-revival-reveals

Bonus: http://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2015/apr/14/vinyl-revival-music-here-to-stay

Sorry, no. I read the article while browsing magazines at my local book store.

 

[Ken Newton]

* Ray, that guy @ the coffee shop; he looks like a nerd. ...

That's hipsters. They're well to do super nerds. So nerdy, they're cool - or so they would like to think.

 

[AJ Soundfield]

The single instance of (assumedly) high-end vinyl I've heard - at a dealer, left me with no particular impression.

Last weekends club meet featured vinyl, $4k ish TT. It was by Channel D apparently used by folks like JA at Stereophile for rips. Some good sound and a lot that sounded like eating Rice Krispies.

Feb was a $16k DSA phono pre.

Hurry up and join.

 

[RayDunzl]

Ray, that guy @ the coffee shop; he looks like a nerd.

I'm more interested with whom he's sitting...

 

[TBone]

Yes, those of us who aren't hipsters. Perhaps, that doesn't apply to you.

Us that aren't ... those that are ...

 

[amirm]

The Gramophone article also identifies 'hipsters' as a significant force driving this market dynamic. This I have long suspected. I usually shake my head when I see the portable all-in-one turntables (picture, the close-and-play units of your childhood marketed toward adults) often sold alongside vinyl L.P.s in retail locations. This definitly wipes out the notion of superior playback being a large driving factor, to my mind. At least, with regards to hipsters, I suspect the new vinyl revolution is a transitory social phenomena primarily intended to demonstrate the hipster's, uh, discerning artistic and cultural sensibilities. In short, vinyl is currently cool. I think the rest of us, however, simply want to enjoy listening to satisfying music reproduction in the convenience of our homes.

This is what I always thought was the reason. To wit, my son when he was 16 or so, borrowed my turntable as he thought it was cool to have. A couple of years ago, gave it back to me .

 

[TBone]

Amir, out of curiosity, which TT did you have?

 

[Ken Newton]

Not only is his turntable utter crap, so are his headphones!

 

[RayDunzl]

Not only is his turntable utter crap, so are his headphones!

What is the LP? Can anyone identify it?

 

[TBone]

What is the LP? Can anyone identify it?

from a distance, maybe a Capitol pressing. I can't recall many other purple labels in my collection, some Deep Purple originals maybe ...