Denafrips

[Womaz]

Different does not always mean better , I think that’s the point that’s trying to be made

 

[Killingbeans]

I took the 2nd post as saying it would not make a difference. "Getting a Denafrips, chord or Yggdrasil will not improve your sound."

I think it's meant as: It will not make an audible difference to the sound waves hitting your ears. Something I agree with.

But it will probably still make you hear a difference. Not because it makes a difference to the sound, but because both your knowledge of the product and the inputs from your other senses will assist your brain in fabricating alterations to the sound. We can't escape cognitive bias. Best thing we can do is to make ourselves more aware of the effects pulling the strings in our brains.

Something as simple as the design language of a DAC can easily make us hear differences when there actually are non. Whether you want to spend money on getting that effect is up to you. I won't judge. After all, placebo feels just as real as actual perception. But don't mix up the two if you can help it. Be causious when something magical appears to be happening. For instance when well designed DACs break the laws of physics that source components are supposed to abide.

 

[HarmonicTHD]

I have now added a Lumin U1 Mini, and the Denafrips Athena preamp, and for all the nay sayers there is a difference to be heard...with the biggest difference being the DAC. I love the holographic presentation my setup has now,

That’s where we most likely disagree.

Did you level match? Did you do a controlled ABX?

If not you are most likely misled by your senses. (Everyone is, that’s why ABX was invented)

Audio Blind Testing - You Are Doing It Wrong! (Video)

Just uploaded a video on the basics of performing controlled tests in audio. It was motivated by saving myself text in having to write all of this down when telling someone who to do these tests right. And as a counter to a few online personalities to keep saying they do "blind" tests yet when...

www.audiosciencereview.com

 

[Ellisr63]

That’s where we most likely disagree.

Did you level match? Did you do a controlled ABX?

If not you are most likely misled by your senses. (Everyone is, that’s why ABX was invented)

Audio Blind Testing - You Are Doing It Wrong! (Video)

Just uploaded a video on the basics of performing controlled tests in audio. It was motivated by saving myself text in having to write all of this down when telling someone who to do these tests right. And as a counter to a few online personalities to keep saying they do "blind" tests yet when...

www.audiosciencereview.com

I bet you anyone can hear the difference between a ladder DAC and a ESS DAC, and yes I level matched.

 

[Ellisr63]

I think it's meant as: It will not make an audible difference to the sound waves hitting your ears. Something I agree with.

But it will probably still make you hear a difference. Not because it makes a difference to the sound, but because both your knowledge of the product and the inputs from your other senses will assist your brain in fabricating alterations to the sound. We can't escape cognitive bias. Best thing we can do is to make ourselves more aware of the effects pulling the strings in our brains.

Something as simple as the design language of a DAC can easily make us hear differences when there actually are non. Whether you want to spend money on getting that effect is up to you. I won't judge. After all, placebo feels just as real as actual perception. But don't mix up the two if you can help it. Be causious when something magical appears to be happening. For instance when well designed DACs break the laws of physics that source components are supposed to abide.

I understand what you are saying...have you ever listened to a ladder DAC and compared it to a DAC in a AVP? I have experienced the suggested thought affecting the sound, but when you can sit down listening to the Pontus every day and listen to the same tracks and hear dramatic differences in the sound presentation than you heard the night before....it is real. I have had friends come over that are very familiar with my setup and they immediately wanted to know why it sounded better/different after listening to the same tracks. It is virtually night and day difference between the ESS DAC in my Marantz av8805a and the Pontus ii. If you do not believe it that is ok, as I bought it to satisfy my needs.

 

[BDWoody]

I bet you anyone can hear the difference between a ladder DAC and a ESS DAC, and yes I level matched.

So far, no one has demonstrated that this is true or provided evidence anyone else has. When I say evidence, I mean something other than uncontrolled subjective impressions.

The brain is a tricky thing.

 

[Killingbeans]

I have been into audio since 1977. I have friends come over that are very familiar with my setup and they immediately want to know why it sounded better/different.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Clever_Hans

It is virtually night and day difference between the ESS DAC in my Marantz av8805a and the Pontus ii. If you do not believe it that is ok, as I bought it to satisfy my needs.

If you're happy, that's what really matters. Just don't be surprised if most users in her won't respond to these findings with more than an apathetic "Cool story bro..."

So far I have seen zero serious investigations resulting in data that supports this common claim. On the contrary, when you do the test blind with adequate controls, the night and day difference vanishes every single time. Not saying that DACs can't sound different, but when they do, it's because of aggravating flaws in the design that can easily be spotted in measurements.

 

[Killingbeans]

have you ever listened to a ladder DAC and compared it to a DAC in a AVP?

I have not. But nothing seems to indicate that it would be more than a fun waste of time. So called "critical listening" seems to be a highly erroneous tool for judging these things.

I have experienced the suggested thought affecting the sound, but when you can sit down listening to the Pontus every day and listen to the same tracks and hear dramatic differences in the sound presentation than you heard the night before....it is real.

People also have these experiences when they buy magical stickers to put on their equipment or nonsense quantum fuses. And it's equally real to them.

There are actual dramatic differences to be found in audio reproduction, but asserting that they originate in DACs requires some seriously hard hitting new evidence.

 

[Ziroz]

Denafrips new power amp Apollo 55kg. 225 watt 8 ohm 450 watt 4 ohm.
https://www.denafrips.com/apollo
Some measurements.
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Is there a link to the full set of measurements, I am very interested, thx.