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D-Sonic Amps...what do you think (in theory)?

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#1
So, I'm new here, right, and frankly I'm geeking on all of the knowledge, so I thought I would start a thread that was similar to other thread aboard here.

I don't have the equipment to measure gear myself, so I pulled from the website measurements for the D-Sonic amps. Now, we can only look at these measurements and wax theoretically, right? After all, this forum is like the State of Missouri and a manufacturer can state anything they want to sell product.

But you know, since I only have a modicum of graph knowledge as it relates to audio, I'll admit, that sometimes I'm a little unsure of what I'm reading, though I'm well passed the basics. What really trips me up, though, are all of these freaky ass tables: https://www.d-sonic.com/content/D-Sonic Data Sheet.pdf

The specs, themselves, are obvious claims: https://www.d-sonic.com/general-specifications/

See, I have on of these, the M3a-800S Stereo Amplifier. My high falutin audiophile buddies (meaning, the ones I don't hang out with much), bristle at the fact that I have a $1,500 amp sitting between $23,000 speakers and a $23,000 Linn KDS/3 (DAC/Streamer). Me, I ask them does it sound good...and they can't deny that my system sounds superb. So, screw those guys...but I always wonder if I can get just a little more resolving - meaning, no I don't think having an inexpressive Class D amp means that I'm missing out on something, but yes, I wonder if there is a "step up" without losing the synergy I have been components.

Hell, if I thought I could be without music for a while I would send my amp out for measurements.

Any theoretical thoughts on this D-Sonic line?
 

Blumlein 88

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#2
Certainly excellent specs. But they are from the maker. You notice things like power output maximums. But if you are in the USA running from 120 volt you likely can't quite max out without popping breakers.

The various tables are for different modules they make their amps from. I didn't puzzle thru it all (sorry I'm lazy). You'd like to know which modules in which configuration your particular model of their amp is using. Like most ICE power based amps distortion can rise a bit with frequency. The output filters can interact with loudspeaker loads to sometimes alter the upper couple of octaves.

So in general, these might not be quite state of the art, but with power to spare, you likely aren't being held back sonically by these amps vs anything else. If you are, it will be a tiny barely perceptible difference.

So I've no direct experience with these, and unless you get some measures you can never be sure they haven't been held back in some parameter, but likely they are quite fine.

What to do about your high falutin adiophile buddies, heck be buddies, don't say screw them. Buddies don't always have to agree. One or the other or both will learn something when you don't agree. One of my best friends is just the type fellow who likes to foment disagreement and get you to pick a side. Then hammer on it till we get to the truth. Sometimes I've shown him the way, sometimes he shows me. Knowing him there is never any ill intent, it is just who he is. It makes for an interesting friendship.

So get some of your buddies to bring over some of their amps, give it a whirl versus yours. And take yours over to their place and get them to do some comparative listening. As much as such uncontrolled listening gets a bad rep around these forums on ASR (and a highly deserved bad rep), it still is fun to do sometimes with friends. Do at least match levels when you do this. I know some people will find it a bother to unconnect and move about highly tuned gear, but hey life is short. Make the effort have fun. I think in the end you and your buddies will be better buddies for it. And you'll all get some interesting experiences.
 
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#3
Thank you for the reply.

Just to be clear, though, about the aforementioned "buddies," these are the kind that come over to hear your system, but all they talk about is their systems. :facepalm:

I don't mean screw them indefinitely, but you know, it's difficult sometimes.

Actually I'm hoping that @March Audio might have something to say, as well about these D-Sonic amps. I see that his measures better than any Class D amp that I can recall seeing. But the sonic signature is something else entirely. The D-Sonic amps certainly give off a warm, yet fully articulate sound (or at least as articulate as I'm used to hearing).

But yeah, the buddy system is swell, only most of the good audiofools I know are the headphone crowd. They're only interested in my headphone rig. Heh.
 

March Audio

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#4
They do look interesting. I have only very quickly glanced through the specs, but a couple of things caught my eye. The idle noise levels are comparatively very high compared to say Hypex. CH1 indicated 140uV unweighted where Hypex will be more like 20 to 30 uV. This could be an issue with high sensitivity speakers. Also the distortion levels are a fair bit higher. In real world usage you may not notice that difference.
 
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#5
They do look interesting. I have only very quickly glanced through the specs, but a couple of things caught my eye. The idle noise levels are comparatively very high compared to say Hypex. CH1 indicated 140uV unweighted where Hypex will be more like 20 to 30 uV. This could be an issue with high sensitivity speakers. Also the distortion levels are a fair bit higher. In real world usage you may not notice that difference.
Yeah, that's what I'm think, about the real word usage, could I tell a difference or not, is it injecting noise at such a low level that the ear isn't going to pick it up, and also, am I simply going through updrade-itis with no real reason to do so. It happens to the best of us. But I would still be curious, if I sent it out, to get independent measurements on this amp. D-Sonic may fly under the radar, but they are not entirely unpopular.
 
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#6
I have a hard time getting past this claim in the PDF:
D-Sonic proprietary UMACTM Class D optimized amplifier power stages...
You want to build amps with Pascal OEM modules? Great! But pretending it's your own technology leaves a sour taste in my mouth.

These modules will be similar to those in the Dutch 8C (so they must be pretty good) as well as amps from Rouge Audio. Other sources? They're definitely not as common as Hypex & ICEPower.
 
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#7
These modules will be similar to those in the Dutch 8C (so they must be pretty good) as well as amps from Rouge Audio. Other sources? They're definitely not as common as Hypex & ICEPower
Yeah, these amps are nearly pure Pascal, if not 100% so. Whatever "proprietary" anything in there is...well, I don't even know if it's up for debate. I know where he buys his parts from. That's not a slam on D-Sonic, but I think I catch your drift.
 
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#8
Mostly, I object to this form of marketing. It's like each manufacturer using a different (trademarked!) name for the PTFE coating on their frying pans. Or the same TV having different model #s at Amazon, Best Buy & Walmart. Inform the consumer, don't play games. If you're actually selling value & quality, it will be okay. </rant>

The Pascal modules have a low input impedance, so D-Sonic probably has their own buffer, as with Hypex OEMs. Any specs published for that? The datasheet appears to be a copy of Pascal's after "s/Pascal/D-Sonic"...
 
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#10
I don't know. Every time I think about "upgrading" my D-Sonic amp I simply can't do it. I've brought in two Class A/B amps to demo since I made this post and whether I'm just used to the sound of the D-Sonic or what, I like what I have. Well, I don't don't know if it's being used to the sound, because in both cases, with both amps, the grip on the bass with the D-sonic was something that I wouldn't want to trade out of.

Grain of salt, mind you. I would still like to get two Benchmark AHB2 in to try in dual mono config.
 
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#11
Grain of salt, mind you. I would still like to get two Benchmark AHB2 in to try in dual mono config.
I honestly think this would be your next upgrade because objectively and quantitatively, it is the biggest improvement you can make (assuming your listening room is dead quiet enough). Why not get one first, and then add the second for mono later?
 
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#12
I honestly think this would be your next upgrade because objectively and quantitatively, it is the biggest improvement you can make (assuming your listening room is dead quiet enough). Why not get one first, and then add the second for mono later?
Good question! I had one first and it couldn't drive my speakers for shit.
Impedance: 6 ohms average, 4 ohms minimum at 35Hz. Sensitivity: 88.5dB/W/m

Just no grip on the audio, all the way around. But that makes sense if I'm trying to drive them with the 100w that the AHB2 puts out. I would need 2 amps to really give it a go. As far as my room, yeah, I've got it acoustically treated to about as scientific as I can get. :)

Otherwise, I'm really intrigued by this: https://spl.audio/professional-fidelity/performer-s800/?lang=en having experienced their headphone amp, which I consider the best I've ever tried. It may be a different animal with the speaker amp, though.

Plus, isn't it in the pipeline for other companies to make THX based speaker amps for much less expensive than the Benchmark?
 
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