Circuit breaker - which to choose

[Mnyb]

but if u are not lucky ... how does that affect Inrush current?

It gets as high as it can get given whats your network impedance is and the input impedance of the amplifier is when there is no energy in its storage capacitors .

For the first miliseconds i would guess (peak voltage)/(the dc resistance of the wiring plus the DC resistance of the transformer.) but the inductance of the wiring and transformer might add some impedance so it might not be that bad .

I would just pick something with a slow characteristic and not overthink , but I have no clue about local rules .

I would consider if the amps is broken if started to behave like this ? or has it always been like that ?

Are there a lot of other stuff on the same fuse ? you might also start up things in sequence turn off other stuff while powering up the amp ?

 

[MaxwellsEq]

as was said ... these are max 7y old breakers and i tried 2 different breakers.

The PSU box which causing tripping has only 3 transformers inside nothing else.

Answer this one question: has this amplifier PSU been tripping breakers for years or is it a relatively recent (e.g. 6 months) issue?

 

[roxor]

Are there a lot of other stuff on the same fuse ? you might also start up things in sequence turn off other stuff while powering up the amp ?

as i said multiple times - 1 device ie PSU of the amp on the fuse, nothing else...

 

[roxor]

has this amplifier PSU been tripping breakers for years or is it a relatively recent (e.g. 6 months) issue?

It happened within 7y period (as i own it for around that time, second hand) multiple times... but by multiple times i am saying ... Randomly, sometimes few times within week, sometimes never for half of the year....

 

[MaxwellsEq]

It happened within 7y period (as i own it for around that time, second hand) multiple times... but by multiple times i am saying ... Randomly, sometimes few times within week, sometimes never for half of the year....

Get the amplifier serviced or get a new amplifier.

 

[radix]

Get the amplifier serviced or get a new amplifier.

I think getting the amp serviced before rewiring the house or going with custom breakers is the right approach.

It's a 250wpc amp. The manual says 13amp circuit. Tripping breakers is not normal behavior.

if you've replaced the breaker, the problem is the amp.

 

[roxor]

Get the amplifier serviced or get a new amplifier.

got your point.

But it was ~5000 amp

Regarding the service, the question would be if there is anything to be serviced in PSU box which contains only 3 toroidal transformers.

 

[Sokel]

Let's get simple:
Did you try the amp on another breaker?
Somewhere else in the house?
If it does the same,service it.

 

[Doodski]

PSU box which contains only 3 toroidal transformers.

Ima jump in again into the chat. I'm cool now... I am sorry for being snappy and insensitive. I can't help it at times. I'm on meds and it still happens because I'm stressed out about some stuff. Those 3 transformers that you mentioned store a lot of electrical energy in a magnetic field that develops/builds up around them as the electrical energy goes into the the transformer(s) wire. When the magnetic field forms around those transformers wire windings the magnetic field can draw a lot of electrons from the electrical power source. That is what is happening in your situation. As a result the CB is tripping and stopping all electron flow or the transformer(s) are faulty. That is the very basic explanation without getting into numbers and complex calculations that I think will be too much for you.

 

[radix]

got your point.

But it was ~5000 amp

Regarding the service, the question would be if there is anything to be serviced in PSU box which contains only 3 toroidal transformers.

There are small inrush-limiting devices that might be present and faulty.

A toroidal that has had inrush for a long time can get a damaged core and might need to be replaced.

I assume you've checked that the earth is OK on your electrical? And you are using the original power cord and it's in good shape? And you have the correct fuses in the PSU? (the fuses might be part of the inrush limiting)

I'm not sure how good it is for the PSU to operate without the electronics attached.

 

[roxor]

I just called technician who is servicing Musical fidelity brand also,
he said this issue is common for such an amp or category of these amps ... he mentioned once i power on and hit the top of the sinus wave it will happen.

There is no issue with amp or PSU... he said i have to use different CB with slower reactions or something like that,
also in the circuit its not good to use this component> https://www.conrad.cz/cs/p/abb-2csf...8rp0U5ACwHxeHnysJQRoCdycQAvD_BwE&refresh=true

 

[Doodski]

said this issue is common for such an amp or category of

Yes, it does happen with big transformer type amps although not as severely as you have described it to be happening. Your situation is a bit severe and you have 3 transformers which make things more different than the usual 1 transformer gear. Your amp is not typical or common.

he mentioned once i power on and hit the top of the sinus wave it will happen.

Theoretically true and I have proven this with a extra marks special laboratory test project that used the peak timing of the sinusoidal AC waveform with the instantaneous current draw of a transformer. I understand what you say. The thing is you say it occurs regularly? Is it repetitive and a constant fault of the electrical circuit that occurs often?

Regardless You still should check what we have advised you to check and then proceed from there as was advised. If you don't like the professional advise then hire a expert whom can take full responsibility and be actively involved and can sign off on the work.

 

[JustJones]

I just called technician who is servicing Musical fidelity brand also,
he said this issue is common for such an amp or category of these amps ... he mentioned once i power on and hit the top of the sinus wave it will happen.

There is no issue with amp or PSU... he said i have to use different CB with slower reactions or something like that,
also in the circuit its not good to use this component> https://www.conrad.cz/cs/p/abb-2csf...8rp0U5ACwHxeHnysJQRoCdycQAvD_BwE&refresh=true

That looks like what we call ARC fault breaker in the US. If so it's possible your amplifier might be tripping it when you turn it on under certain conditions. Basically the wire heats up to quick and the breaker thinks there's an arc and trips. Of course this is only me an American speculating about an electrical problem in a European country. you need to get a licensed electrician to test / exaime the circuit.

 

[roxor]

Yes, it does happen with big transformer type amps although not as severely as you have described it to be happening. Your situation is a bit severe and you have 3 transformers which make things more different than the usual 1 transformer gear. Your amp is not typical or common.

there are 2 big toroids each one per channel.
1 small toroid.

 

[roxor]

The thing is you say it occurs regularly? Is it repetitive and a constant fault of the electrical circuit that occurs often?

no i said it Random behavior, sometimes 3x in row, sometimes doesnt occur half of the year.

 

[Doodski]

no i said it Random behavior, sometimes 3x in row, sometimes doesnt occur half of the year.

Oh sorry. That means something that matters.

 

[roxor]

If so it's possible your amplifier might be tripping it when you turn it on under certain conditions.

the ARC never tripped... only CB.

 

[roxor]

Regardless You still should check what we have advised you to check

frankly, that were that many subjects opened so i have no clue in the end what needs to be done here.
MF technician said there is no point to inspect PSU as thats the common issue of the amps like that.

 

[Doodski]

Replace the CB with a new suitable one determined upon your specific location and electrical code and then see what happens. Then proceed or not from there.

 

[JustJones]

the ARC never tripped... only CB.

That doesn't make sense the breaker you linked to looks like an AFCI . That is a Circuit Breaker.