Best closed-back headphones, $200-$300

[Gamemaker]

Nice! Can you comment on the differences you hear?

For me, the M50x has more bass, not as bright with the mids and highs. With the M70x I hear a more balanced sound on all frequencies. The 70x sounds much brighter, and just the right amount of bass. I don’t like headphones with boomy bass. I like to hear the guitars, cymbals and snare drum. That’s what the 70x does for me. Just my personal preference.

 

[JustAnandaDourEyedDude]

My guess is that a good closed-back headphone will have more control and sheer force in the bottom registers compared to good open-backed headphones. I'm not looking for more bass, but I want deeper bass.

Is that the only reason you are ruling out open-back?
It seems you are looking for headphones with first-class tonality, extended FR and detail resolution for under $300. Do you think any, open or closed, exist at any price level? If so, which ones do you guess would fit the requirements if price were no object?

 

[raif71]

I used to look for closed back headphones coz people around me were complaining that they could hear what I was listening. Ended up with m50x but eventually I went with iems. Now, they are complaining that I could not hear what they are saying

 

[Robin L]

Is that the only reason you are ruling out open-back?
It seems you are looking for headphones with first-class tonality, extended FR and detail resolution for under $300. Do you think any, open or closed, exist at any price level? If so, which ones do you guess would fit the requirements if price were no object?

Recall, I already mentioned at one point that I used Stax Signature Earspeakers for two decades, that was my standard for years. With EQ, Drop 6XX is close to Stax, without EQ the warmth/fat is too much. But my current set-up with EQ does most of the things the Stax 'phones did well, with maybe a touch more control and better bass. There seems to be better detail, the tone of drums is clearer---where there was a spray of broadband noise before, there now is a specific sense of pitch with Drop 6XX/ Topping E 30/L 30. I have to use a different EQ with the AKG K167, and with eq they are still a bit more strident than the 6XX 'phones.

 

[JustAnandaDourEyedDude]

Thanks, that is informative. It still leaves me wondering though, whether what you seek exists at all, even disregarding price. I do not have much experience with transducers, so I cannot make any recommendations, sorry.

Very recently, I did perform a multi-hour subjective, sighted listening test of most of the few headphones I do own, along with the Final A8000 IEM. The HPs are somewhat outside your desired price bracket, but do include the HD650 which is pretty much the same as the HD6XX (which I also own, but did not test). Listened to a few world jazz vocal tracks and to Paganini Caprice No. 24 and Bourree I & II plus Gigue from one of Bach's English Suites.

Caution: what follow are my subjective impressions. The executive summary of my conclusions follows. Final Sonorous IV (too harsh due to included BA driver, rest of Sonorous line should be fine, Sonorous X and D8000 would sound magnificent I imagine) and Focal Elegia (tonality a little odd, detail seems to pop in and out of focus) were eliminated early on. Both are closed-backs. Sennheiser HD650 eliminated for tonality-related reason explained in the next para (also lacks a little detail resolution comapred with the winners). Audio-Technica ATH-R70X close to ideal tonality for me, similar to remaining three HPs, but detail resolution not quite at the same level. The remaining three HPs, HiFiMan Ananda, Drop Koss ESP/95X and Drop Focal Elex almost tie for top spot in my mid-tier collection of HPs. Ananda and Elex are tied for detail resolution, while ESP/95X lags by a shade. ESP/95X and Elex are tied for tonal balance while Ananda is a shade off in its allure. Overall Elex is the winner by a slim margin. All five HPs (other than HD650) have good lower bass without mid-bass boost. Final A8000 IEM defeats them all in terms of detail resolution; also, it has an extended frequency range, going down to decent sub-bass with no mid-bass bloat, and extending high and smoothly in the treble (to my old ears). However, it is a little on the bright side, and the upper mids and lower treble are backwardly placed, and a little lacking in the forward body that I love. I have used the A8000 for music with low organ tones and trumpet highs, and it gives pulse-stoppingly beautiful textures of these. I have not tried it or any of the others with massed brass.

The part about the HD650 might interest you. It seems my criteria are the opposite of your Bruckner massed brass criteria. Neutral and extended bass and treble matter to me, but what matters to me most is female vocals, in particular the contralto range, rarer than soprano. Until I actually did the back-to-back testing, I believed the performance of the HD650 on contralto female vocals was practically ideal, seemingly fairly realistic and full-bodied enough. However, my listening told me that for my ears and preferences, the tonality of the Ananda, ESP/95X and Elex sounds more beautiful than even the HD650's for contralto vocals. It feels like the lighter bass response of the HD650 compared with the others has something to do with this. Of course, I have not heard the contraltos in real life, nor any opera/lieder singers in real life for that matter, so I do not know for sure which presentation is more realistic. However, the HD650 sounds different, while the other three sound very similar to each other (and similar to Elac DBR62, though the DBR62s sound a little more liquid, but lack the last word in detail resolution, where the HPs are a little drier and more detailed).

 

[Robin L]

Thanks, that is informative. It still leaves me wondering though, whether what you seek exists at all, even disregarding price. I do not have much experience with transducers, so I cannot make any recommendations, sorry.

Very recently, I did perform a multi-hour subjective, sighted listening test of most of the few headphones I do own, along with the Final A8000 IEM. The HPs are somewhat outside your desired price bracket, but do include the HD650 which is pretty much the same as the HD6XX (which I also own, but did not test). Listened to a few world jazz vocal tracks and to Paganini Caprice No. 24 and Bourree I & II plus Gigue from one of Bach's English Suites.

Executive summary of my conclusions. Final Sonorous IV (too harsh due to included BA driver, rest of Sonorous line should be fine, Sonorous X and D8000 would sound magnificent I imagine) and Focal Elegia (tonality a little odd, detail seems to pop in and out of focus) were eliminated early on. Both are closed-backs. Sennheiser HD650 eliminated for tonality-related reason explained in the next para. Audio-Technica ATH-R70X close to ideal tonality for me, similar to remaining three HPs, but detail resolution not quite at the same level. The remaining three HPs, HiFiMan Ananda, Drop Koss ESP/95X and Drop Focal Elex almost tie for top spot in my mid-tier collection of HPs. Ananda and Elex are tied for detail resolution, while ESP/95X lags by a shade. ESP/95X and Elex are tied for tonal balance while Ananda is a shade off in its allure. Overall Elex is the winner by a slim margin. All five HPs (other than HD650) have good lower bass without mid-bass boost. Final A8000 IEM defeats them all in terms of detail resolution; it has an extended frequency range, going down to decent sub-bass with no mid-bass bloat, and extending high and smoothly in the treble (to my old ears). However, it is on the bright side, and the mids and lower treble are backward, and lack the forward body that I love. I have used the A8000 for music with low organ tones and trumpet highs, and it gives pulse-stoppingly beautiful textures of these. I have not tried it or any of the others with massed brass.

The part about the HD650 might interest you. It seems my criteria are the opposite of your Bruckner massed brass criteria. Neutral and extended bass and treble matter to me, but what matters to me most is female vocals, in particular the contralto range, rarer than soprano. Until I actually did the back-to-back testing, I believed the performance of the HD650 on contralto female vocals was practically ideal, seemingly fairly realistic and full-bodied enough. However, my listening told me that for my ears and preferences, the tonality of the Ananda, ESP/95X and Elex sounds more beautiful than even the HD650's for contralto vocals. It feels like the lighter bass response of the HD650 compared with the others has something to do with this. Of course, I have not heard the contraltos in real life, nor any opera/lieder singers in real life for that matter, so I do not know for sure which presentation is more realistic. However, the HD650 sounds different, while the other three sound very similar to each other (and similar to Elac DBR62, though the DBR62s sound a little more liquid, but lack the last word in detail resolution, where the HPs are a little drier and more detailed).

The main difference I hear with the Drop 6XX 'phones is eq related. Of all the speakers 'n' 'phones I've messed with, the 6XX/650 is the most easily EQ-ed. Haven't heard as many recent headphones as you, but have heard and recorded a lot of very talented singers in all ranges. Contralto sound has more support at the bottom, but one can easily confuse that emphasis of the lower registration with a "thick" sound, like IM or other varieties of distortion. If anything, an eq-ed 6XX is a little lighter down there than reality. That issue I had with massed brass seems to have been addressed with the Topping DAC and Headphone amp. As I said elsewhere, it has similar improvement with drums. The 6XX has good lower bass with EQ. Without EQ, it's lacking.

 

[JustAnandaDourEyedDude]

The main difference I hear with the Drop 6XX 'phones is eq related. Of all the speakers 'n' 'phones I've messed with, the 6XX/650 is the most easily EQ-ed. Haven't heard as many recent headphones as you, but have heard and recorded a lot of very talented singers in all ranges. Contralto sound has more support at the bottom, but one can easily confuse that emphasis of the lower registration with a "thick" sound, like IM or other varieties of distortion. If anything, an eq-ed 6XX is a little lighter down there than reality. That issue I had with massed brass seems to have been addressed with the Topping DAC and Headphone amp. As I said elsewhere, it has similar improvement with drums. The 6XX has good lower bass with EQ. Without EQ, it's lacking.

Good to know about 6XX's amenability to EQ. I have not tried EQing anything as yet. May work that into my system in the future. Interesting that even EQ-ed, the 6XX is a little lighter at the contralto support range. I agree the lower frequency contribution to contralto can be confused with second-harmonic distortion or similar. However, I think I am using clean enough gear that these sonics are distinct. Distortion such as you mention can be pleasurable, and I hear it as an artificial lushness like fancy make-up applied on a woman's face smoothing out the pores. With the Ananda, ESP/95X and Elex, it is not that; it is a different tonality to the contralto voice without artificiality that makes the HD650 sound slightly lean and a touch nasal by comparison only. With those three, I can still hear breaking up or quavers of the voice as a whole when the singer messes up, or when a little mucus in the throat momentarily mars the voice (contralto pop singers; classically trained singers don't mess up as often).

Glad your massed brass cravings are fixed now with EQ-ed 6XX and top-notch electronics. The resolution of the electronics does make a difference. Most of the DAPs I own provide a muddy sound that no headphone, no matter how good, can fix.

 

[Robin L]

Good to know about 6XX's amenability to EQ. I have not tried EQing anything as yet. May work that into my system in the future. Interesting that even EQ-ed, the 6XX is a little lighter at the contralto support range. I agree the lower frequency contribution to contralto can be confused with second-harmonic distortion or similar. However, I think I am using clean enough gear that these sonics are distinct. Distortion such as you mention can be pleasurable, and I hear it as an artificial lushness like fancy make-up applied on a woman's face smoothing out the pores. With the Ananda, ESP/95X and Elex, it is not that; it is a different tonality to the contralto voice without artificiality that makes the HD650 sound slightly lean and a touch nasal by comparison only. With those three, I can still hear breaking up or quavers of the voice as a whole when the singer messes up, or when a little mucus in the throat momentarily mars the voice (contralto pop singers; classically trained singers don't mess up as often).

Glad your massed brass cravings are fixed now with EQ-ed 6XX and top-notch electronics. The resolution of the electronics does make a difference. Most of the DAPs I own provide a muddy sound that no headphone, no matter how good, can fix.

I'm using the "Any Player" software installed on the Acer Aspire 5 for EQ. -2.5 db @ 170 hz, +3db @ 60 hz. From 170hz, I have the treble raised to +3db @ 16khz. It's a smooth raising of treble, mostly raising level by increments of .5 db from 170 hz to 16 khz. I wish there were more bands in the bass. I've used parametric eq when I was making recordings in the 1990's, parametric eq doubtless would be more exact in compensation. But as it is, the tonal balance is very much improved with eq compared to uncompensated.

 

[iucoen]

I'll mention the Beyerdynamic DT770s again. They have the underlying bass extension you originally mentioned that you are seeking. You should be able to clean up some of the other peaks with EQ. To me they are among the physically most comfortable headphones I have, other than eventually getting warm. And they are under-budget. The 80 ohm ones are the ones I have and are said to have the most bass of the different DT770s. Known for durability as well.

Changing to leather pads will increase the bass as well. Also the stock velour pads leak a lot, so not great for office. The only thing I don't like is the piercing treble.

 

[solderdude]

Piercing treble can be fixed.

 

[L5730]

Always makes me chuckle when a thread title has "closed back headphones" and I count the number of times HD650/6XX gets mentioned/recommended.

Admittedly, in this case, the OP doesn't mention why they specifically want closed back headphones, but tells us what they find a problem with their open backed HD6XXs. If closed back is not a requirement, but an assumption of sound signature, then from what I've read, the HiFi-Man Sundara or HE-400i should deliver the articulate low bass they want.

Looking into DSP either from digital playback devices, or an in-line processor (miniDSP) seems like a good idea in general. That, or a passive inline circuit solution, such as suggested on DIYAudioHeaven.
Seems to be a common point that nothing is perfect out of the box, and it all needs a tweak from stock here or there.

If it has to be closed back for reasons of some isolation, then Takstar Pro 82 (v2) has been said to sound a bit like HD650 ish. I've not heard the newer version myself, or had much to compare to the v1 I have. The v2 has been shown to have better performance, a fixed upper mid as well as a more refined top end. I don't hear anything particularly wrong with the v1 after some EQ and a sensibly flat DAC/amp. Isolation is reasonable, maybe 18 dB attenuation of outside sound. It doesn't leak unless you are in a quiet room, the volume loud and someone is sitting only a couple of feet away.
I've read that people prefer these (v21 or v2) to DT770, but they don't say if they have EQ'd either - and the Beyers look like they could use some EQ!

Saying all this, I've also read that the Earth is flat and ££££ power cables make a difference...

 

[Robin L]

Piercing treble can be fixed.

I've noticed. Most of what is wrong with the AKG K167 can be fixed with EQ. I might not need another closed-back headphone after all.

 

[Robbo99999]

Recall, I already mentioned at one point that I used Stax Signature Earspeakers for two decades, that was my standard for years. With EQ, Drop 6XX is close to Stax, without EQ the warmth/fat is too much. But my current set-up with EQ does most of the things the Stax 'phones did well, with maybe a touch more control and better bass. There seems to be better detail, the tone of drums is clearer---where there was a spray of broadband noise before, there now is a specific sense of pitch with Drop 6XX/ Topping E 30/L 30. I have to use a different EQ with the AKG K167, and with eq they are still a bit more strident than the 6XX 'phones.

On the subject of open backed headphones I recommend the now pretty cheap AKG K702 vs the Sennheiser HD600 I also have, and I noticed you have HD650, so that's pretty similar to my HD600 especially as I EQ'd it to the Harman Curve. So, yes, I recommend K702 now over HD600 because the amount of space & width in the music, imaging, is so much better in the K702....to me they sound pretty much like speakers rather than the "in your head" of the HD600. This was after EQ'ing the K702 to the Harman Curve that I recommend them over the Harman EQ'd HD600. Might be worth a punt on a cheap pair on K702.

Following is my EQ I did for K702 which is based on Innerfidelity measurements but Jaakopasanen has recently created a "calibrated Harman Target Curve" for Innerfidelity measurements by comparing headphones measured by Innerfidelity vs the same headphones measured by Oratory1990 (who is the Harman gold standard if you will), hence this attempts to make Innerfidelity measurements more valid & accurate to the Harman Curve - I believe it does, sounds very close to my Harman Curve Room EQ'd JBL 308p Mkii speakers. To me the K702 take bass EQ better than HD600 too, whilst still having the same detail resolution in the rest of the range, and whilst also having the way better imaging & speaker-like qualities.
AKG K702 Harman Curve EQ, (-4.8dB negative preamp):

K702 do suffer from poor soldering connections in the right earcup though, so they might last months or a few years before you have to resolder the wires or get a warranty replacement....since I've resoldered mine the soldering job I've done hasn't failed yet.

 

[asjdoran]

What I'm looking for are closed back headphones that are good with well recorded Classical music, that go deep into the bass without pumping up the mid-bass, open on top without being ragged, $200-$300. Any suggestions?

Sennheiser HD 300 Pro do something roughly like that for me. But, they're a bit ugly, may crush your head, and according to my ears the bass sounds much more pleasant with amplifiers having a very low output impedance (which the L30 has).

 

[ahofer]

Master & Dynamic sponsored an exhibit on Bill Graham at my wife’s museum. Anybody tried them? Are they Beats-like crap?

Just re-upping to see if anyone has used them. They certainly pose as a high end brand.
https://www.masterdynamic.com

 

[Transmaniacon]

What did you end up with?

 

[edahl]

The AKG K371 still the one? I'm considering a closed back for work, though higher budget isn't out of the question.

 

[iucoen]

I've been using T50rp Mk3 Argon's at work. Even though they are not marketed as "closed back", there's almost no leakage. I would say it leaks less than DT770 with the stock velour pads.

 

[Robbo99999]

The AKG K371 still the one? I'm considering a closed back for work, though higher budget isn't out of the question.

If you're gonna EQ then I recommend a used NAD HP50 (they don't make them anymore), and here's an EQ I did for them based on Oratory's measurement:
https://www.audiosciencereview.com/...sed-back-headphones-200-300.16005/post-534210

If you're not gonna EQ then K371 probably better, but EQ'd NAD HP 50 likely better than K371 as K371 has a dip in the treble that is not fully correctable, and NAD HP50 has perfect distortion measurements as seen in Amir's review.

 

[MayaTlab]

The AKG K371 still the one? I'm considering a closed back for work, though higher budget isn't out of the question.

The more I'm using it, the more I find the K371 problematic in many regards, between poor channel matching, inconsistent FR depending on position (the simple act of leaning slightly forwards changes the seal / FR for me), etc. And while at the "macro" level the FR makes sense, at least below 3kHz (above it's a mess), at the "micro" level it's wildly uneven.

I find it generally difficult to go back to regular closed backs after using the AirPods Max. Not that the latter sound particularly great to me (although I do prefer it to the K371, and actually think that measured on my head it may actually track Harman's own target better, including in the ear canal gain region, where I'm getting a decent response, unlike on most GRAS measurements you'll see around - I'm not sure of it but I suspect that the APM's rather peculiar pivot mechanism may have a responsibility in that regard), but it's just a much more stable experience. Below 1kHz the response is most often rock solid (as it uses the ANC circuit to adjust the output in real time) with perfect channel matching and up to 4kHz or so there is no high-Q feature whatsoever making it very easy to EQ, unlike most other closed backs. Besides you get the benefit of ANC eliminating your own bodily noises (heart beat, chewing etc.) and of all the ANC over-ears I've tried so far it's only one which ANC "woosh" I find nearly fully tolerable.

In the graph below, above traces the APM's R and L channels as measured on my own head with in-concha mics, below the K371's R and L channels, averages of several realistic seatings. The dotted trace is the K371's right channel when I lean forward (and by that I just mean "looking at my computer on the table" kind of leaning forward, not the full Japanese greeting), which I think can be attributed to its hinge design lacking range of motion (I'm getting a lot more pressure at the front of my ears than at the back, leaning forwards slightly breaks the seal). The APM's response is rock solid except for truly edge cases (head very significantly rotated left / right or 90° leaning forward), because its terrible pivot mechanism is a dumb idea that compromises seal in these situations vs. a traditional yoke that naturally applies even pressure around the ear without a need to spring load the cups. Basically both have very poorly designed headband to cup attachment systems, the difference is that the APM's still works for the most part on my head (on yours it may be different) and the ANC circuit does the heavy lifting to compensate for these troubles.

Don't look at the wiggles below 60Hz, it's just that I didn't run sweeps at a loud enough volume.
Also, don't look at the absolute values below 50-70Hz, I have no way of checking whether they're somewhat correct or not, only look at relative comparisons in that range.

I would not be surprised that the instability at lower frequencies is something that most people would actually experience with most closed backs, at least to some degree.

Using that experimental DIY probe mic : https://www.head-fi.org/threads/how...guarantee-a-better-sound.958201/post-16405751
This is the sort of results I'm getting past 1kHz (important note : these results are not valid for you, they just illustrate my own experience of my own samples on my own head. Also, don't look at the absolute values, they're necessarily incorrect to some degree, only look at the relative values between headphones) :

In solid red the APM's right channel, in solid blue the K371's right channel, in solid green as a reference the HD650 with somewhat fresh, but broken in pads.
While I'm nowhere near as confident in my measurements with this probe past 1kHz on my own head with the K371 and APM as with the HD650 or HD560S - particularly above 4-5kHz where I'm seeing more seatings variation that I'd like, using "counter" EQ to validate these measurements make me feel that they are a lot, lot more representative of what I'm experiencing than the measurements I'm seeing online, of the APM in particular (sorry but if I'm adding +10dB at 4700Hz my ears would bleed : https://www.rtings.com/headphones/1-4/graph#16092/4011, same applies to the ear canal gain region, applying +5dB at 3kHz with a low Q value I'd go deaf : https://www.headphones.com/communit...rpods-max-review-best-sounding-anc-headphones - in both cases adjustments that are largely above threshold of audibility).
I believe that some of the variation between my experience and the measurements seen online may at least partially come from the fact that both the APM and K371 are quite susceptible in the ear canal gain region to compression variation, which is what I've attempted to assess with the dotted red and blue traces, which represent the APM's and the K371's right channels with very slight compression applied to the cups to try to make them more evenly pressed around my ears. The APM's headband to cup attachment system in particular may pose issues with rigs such as the one used here, which while it features a pinna doesn't conform particularly well to the average human anatomy around the ear : https://crinacle.com/2020/12/19/apple-airpods-max-review-the-audiophiles-perspective/ ? Also, I wouldn't be surprised to see quite a bit of variation across individuals using the same DIY methodology as above, so I feel that it's likely that your own experience may vary.

All that just to say that, given the option to PEQ the hell out of it, as I don't particularly love the response above 3-4kHz on my own head (deficient around 4kHz, peaky and fatiguing above, albeit less so than what I experience with my K371), I'd rather use the APM than any other closed back I've tried. Without PEQ... I don't really like it, but the balance of its benefits vs. drawbacks make me reach for it quite often (as an iPhone user I have to use the cards I was dealt with...).

I think that while current ANC over-ears have significant drawbacks, the ANC feature is a very neat way of solving the sealing and FR instability issues that may frequently plague most closed back headphones. This is something that @solderdude has tested several times :
https://diyaudioheaven.wordpress.com/headphones/measurements/brands-st-x/wh-1000x-m3/
https://diyaudioheaven.wordpress.com/headphones/measurements/bose/qc35-ii/

The K371 on the other hand is a pair of headphones which I can't really PEQ, if only because of poor channel matching and unstable FR. I still enjoy it for the price though and is there a decent alternative to it in that price range anyway ? I'm not sure of it.